Would you pay a small fee - to try out a bass/guitar?

[skej21]

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1390220294' post='2342660']


I don't doubt that story and others like it are huge problems for music shops. But the internet is often described as a 'game changer' and this is exactly the sort of thing that happens when something better comes along.

How many of us keep a horse and cart for our travel requirements - after all, they're still available aren't they? Once upon a time they were the pinnacle of transport aspiration but were eventually superseded by something so much better that the vast majority of people chose the alternative.

Sure, change sometimes adversely affects some people, but if that change is not to the benefit of the vast majority of people then it won't happen because people will stick with what they know. I don't think people were forced to give up horses in favour of the internal combustion engine - they chose it because it was better. What other reason was there? It's the same thing with high street shops versus online shopping, or email versus handwritten letters delivered by the royal mail, or warm comfortable shopping malls compared with trudging all around town.

Times change. If they didn't then we'd all be living far poorer and less comfortable lives.
[/quote]

True, although I'm not sure your argument is entirely sound. In your example, it may be true but high street music retail versus online music retail is that one is largely cheaper, not nessecarily better. I suppose the one big advantage of that is that most large online music retailers have a total lack of knowledge and interest in maintainence of instruments. We make a lot of money doing set-ups and restrings and other obvious bits (that all our instruments in store get upon arrival) because online retailers don't bother. They just send the guitar in the box that it arrived to them in, often without even bothering to open it.

Swings and roundabouts I suppose :-)

Edited January 20, 2014 by skej21

[flyfisher]

Cheaper, better - it's all subjective isn't it? Perhaps you're seeing the demise of one aspect of the business (outright sales) and the rise of another (service and support)? Change doesn't mean all or nothing.

I doubt this is a problem that only affects music shops though and, personally, I would say that local councils are a big part of the problem because of excessive business rates and restrictive and/or expensive parking charges.

The business rates contribute to the higher costs of the goods and parking is just a huge hassle in many towns these days. So, as a potential customer, why on earth would I bother to drive into town, struggle to find a parking space, or pay for the privilege, then walk to the shop in the rain only to find that they don't have what I'm looking for in stock - and if they do it will be more expensive than online (for perfectly understandable reasons).

Instead, I can make myself a cuppa, sit down at my PC in the comfort of my own home, find what I want and order it within about 10-15 minutes. When it arrives (usually the next day), I can try it out at my convenience in the comfort of my own home. If I don't like it I can simply send it back and get a full refund.

Those are the options available to consumers these days and it's quite clear which one they are increasingly choosing. So what do councils do when faced with high street shops struggling and going bust - yep, increase business rates and parking charges in a futile attempt to maintain their revenues. It's not too difficult to see which way the tide is turning.

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1390219442' post='2342648']
+1
I can also understand a time limit on trying a bass too. It must be frustrating to have a customer playing a bass for an hour, then say "nahh, I don't like it. "
[/quote]

I have to admit, I always feel guilty trying out a bass for a length of time and then not purchasing it. It doesn't help that, along Denmark St, the shop assistants will usually come and check on me after ten minutes to ask "how are you getting on?"

Now, I'm well aware that they've come over in an attempt to secure a sale, but perhaps they've got the right idea. If I just don't like the bass particularly, they're happy to try and recommend another; they've been happy to let me compare and contrast two or three. I feel like I'm getting plenty of attention, even if the underlying message is that I should make a decision; but at least that way I'm not going to sit there noodling away for an hour, annoying the other customers, then prop an expensive instrument precariously against the stool and wander out without saying anything.

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1390227193' post='2342796']
Cheaper, better - it's all subjective isn't it? Perhaps you're seeing the demise of one aspect of the business (outright sales) and the rise of another (service and support)? Change doesn't mean all or nothing.

I doubt this is a problem that only affects music shops though and, personally, I would say that local councils are a big part of the problem because of excessive business rates and restrictive and/or expensive parking charges.
...
Those are the options available to consumers these days and it's quite clear which one they are increasingly choosing. So what do councils do when faced with high street shops struggling and going bust - yep, increase business rates and parking charges in a futile attempt to maintain their revenues. It's not too difficult to see which way the tide is turning.
[/quote]

Nail firmly on head with a laser-guided hammer. Back when my old flatmate and I were still brewing beer regularly, we used to visit a tiny brewery near Hoxton that also sold brewing supplies. We could have got the stuff cheaper online, but five minutes' conversation with one of the guys in the shop gave us enough invaluable advice that more than made up for any extra cost.

Sadly, the council effectively drove them out of London. The parking fees on their street kept climbing until it was nigh-on-impossible to get their delivery lorries up to the door. We heard they'd relocated to Sussex and now only sold brewing supplies through mail order. A great loss to two students who just wanted to learn how to make a convincing pint of bitter.

[0175westwood29]

would never pay to try out a bass.

andy

[lucky]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1390210421' post='2342527']
What on earth? Not worth his time? He's there anyway, isn't he? I mean, he didn't open the shop up just for your mate, did he? Sounds like he made it not worth his time by talking your mate out of a sale.
[/quote]

nope, it was a Saturday afternoon and we were the only ones in there, yet still such negative customer service..

[topo morto]

[quote name='lucky' timestamp='1390267626' post='2343493']
nope, it was a Saturday afternoon and we were the only ones in there, yet still such negative customer service..
[/quote] I would just have stayed in there for a while watching him do his important stuff and making him feel uncomfortable!

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='lucky' timestamp='1390267626' post='2343493']
nope, it was a Saturday afternoon and we were the only ones in there, yet still such negative customer service..
[/quote]

I can't believe that somebody would say it wasn't worth their time unless they were going to buy. Maybe they might buy if you let them play the guitar!

I was about to say here about all the negative stories on here about music shops and their customer service, but it is always the negative stories that rise to the surface, isn't it? I wouldn't ever dream of telling a customer that it wasn't worth my time to clean and tune a guitar they wanted to play. It's not worth their time, or money (as customers), to go to a shop with such a petulant shop keeper.

[Dr.Dave]

I would never pay a fee to try out a bass ...... Though I have , on occasion , accepted one !

[JapanAxe]

On the whole I don't ask to try instruments unless I am looking to buy one of that type. Often you can learn as much about the things you don't like as about the things you do.

I rarely try stuff I can't afford, except for comparison purposes but this does occasionally backfire and have me reaching for my credit card.

As for pay-to-try at retailers, I can't see this happening as it would erode one of their advantages over online shops, namely that you can be required to pay for return shipping on an item you are returning under the Distance Selling Regulations.

[Big_Stu]

Pleasantly surprised that it's not a total knock-back. I think I would if it was a serious bit of higher end gear, it would be an investment, maybe on a lower priced item if there was some goodies thrown in.
I know there's a lot of shops under pressure from i'net sales, so it would be a case of "use them or lose them".

[topo morto]

BTW I don't think I've given my straightforward answer to this question, which is : yes, I would totally pay to be able to spend a decent amount of time in a well-stocked shop that had the facilities to allow me to try out instruments properly. I have never been in a shop like that though!

[Dad3353]

... but one [i]does [/i]pay, albeit indirectly, when one buys absolutely anything from a local shop. All the costs (the salesperson's time, depreciation on stock, breakages, set-ups...) are factored into their prices, and explains why they are mostly more expensive than on-line outlets. They, too, have costs, such as freighting and returns, different to the retailer.
There is very little that is really free, and demoing stock is not an exception. Should one pay directly..? Difficult to enforce, I would think. I'm quite happy to accept that, for many items, the local shop gives me enough good service all year round to justify my paying more than I could get on-line. For items they cannot obtain, of course, on-line is fine. Would I pay directly..? I have had equipment loaned to me, either for evaluation, or to help me out of a fix, and have never been asked for rental. I would happily pay such, though, if it were asked of me. Maybe we're just lucky in having a good music shop, though..?

[BassTractor]

What dad says.
As I wrote in a post I deleted, I long contemplated selling at item in-cost, but taking money for my time and gear rent. Decided against it mostly because customers want fantastic local service at Internet prices, and won't be willing to pay directly for my time.
This is slightly funny though, as they are willing to pay for my teaching, in which case they do pay for my time, and this too is about using my time on taking part in my knowledge.
So I guess it's mostly about what one is used to.

I also think new ways of doing business as a specialist shop are forcing their way into the market. In the long run I think there's no way good shops will continue to accept being abused by cynical customers in the described fashion.

[Annoying Twit]

I'm a bit late to this thread, but will add my 2p.

I'd be happy to pay some money to be able to spend time trying out a wide range of basses. However, as this would discourage many buyers, I would guess that if this happened it would be a specialist retailer who did so, I don't think it would become a general policy in shops.

In fact, there are some people on this forum to whom I'd happily pay £10 to be able to try out their stuff.

I was curious about renting instruments, and have found that renting orchestral instruments is cheaper than I thought. [url="http://leicestershiremusichub.org/hire-instrument"]http://leicestershir...hire-instrument[/url] It wouldn't happen immediately, but I wonder if at some time in the future it might be worthwhile trying a double bass for a term to see how I get on with it.

When I visit shops, I'm very careful to make sure that I ask permission to try any instruments. And if I know I'm likely to be trying instruments, I'll make sure I'm wearing suitable clothing. e.g. no exposed metal buttons or belt buckles.

Edited January 21, 2014 by Annoying Twit