I dont get it

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='3V17C' post='235025' date='Jul 8 2008, 03:26 PM']when you get to a certain age (30ish +) it can be much harder to find an originals band as most people by then are happy just doing covers and younger bands have to consider the image side of things to be taken seriously.[/quote]

This is true and there's not much you can do about it really, unless you're lucky. Funnily enough both myself and a good friend of mine (both of us about to turn 34) are currently backing young talent - he's got this folk singer/songwriter girl, and I've got this soul/hip-hop singer girl. My gig's the nicer one, obviously, because a) It's not folk, and b ) I get to contribute to the writing, but his band actually sound pretty good too - for a folk band.

And that's basically one way to get away with being an old fart in an originals band. Do the old "I'm the hired sideman" bit. Even if you're not.

Edited July 8, 2008 by thisnameistaken

[xilddx]

[quote name='bremen' post='235026' date='Jul 8 2008, 03:33 PM']Your English is better than a lot of the native-English speakers I know :-)[/quote]

Completely agree on that !

Edited July 8, 2008 by silddx

[wombatboter]

[quote name='bremen' post='235026' date='Jul 8 2008, 03:33 PM']I'm sad to hear that, I'd always heard that the mainland European music scene was a bit healthier than ours.

Your English is better than a lot of the native-English speakers I know :-)[/quote]


Thanks ...
It's "easy" to build a bass-career upon the universal repertoire like "I wish", "I'm so excited", "Kiss" etc...but it's a lot harder to get something started that is unique and combines the talents of all the bandmembers.
Sure : everybody around here in Belgium likes Jamiroquai or Earth Wind and Fire, etc...but as soon as you talk about writing songs, rehearsing ("not paid ? you must be out of your mind !") and being creative even the best musicians take the easy way and commit themselves to being background bandmembers doing an ego-less but efficient job. Most of them prefer the quick buck to locking themselves in a rehearsal room without the certainty of success or an impressive tourlist.
I feel like I'm talking to a wall whenever I am enthousiastic about certain records, dvd's to fellow musicians..They only go to other gigs if they can slip backstage to present themselves and start the flattering.
In the alternative scene it's not that much better (a bassplayer told me that it's forbidden to slap in certain bands since it is considered "not cool") and I sometimes dream of ideal situations where I am sitting with my bass next to Joni in Laurel Canyon, hear Ringo practice his drum roll on "Come together" or see Robert Palmer do the programming for "Looking for Clues"..
It is important that there is still something happening and that you might be involved in it, you never know...
Last summer I had around 30 gigs in two months, now I have only 4 because I try to be true to myself (I just resigned in a band because the singer works on a cd with a producer who prefers his own session musicians and I can't believe our singer doesn't stand up for her own musicians). So be it..
I replace in other bands for the moment and I work as a receptionist during the day so I don't have to be worried about my income. One thing remains : the love for music and knowing that it all has been worthwhile..

Edited July 8, 2008 by wombatboter

[mike257]

Loads of really interesting opinions here, I won't bother with the samaratins next time something's bugging me

From my experience of originals bands, the most important factor that holds them together is the relationship between the band members, the mix of personalities. I'm currently guitarist hunting for my new band, but the singer and drummer I'm working with are two of my closest friends. We knew each other from other bands, and as we all became available, making music together seemed the natural thing to do, as we enjoy each others company so much. Our drummer has only ever played metal, and nothing but metal, our singer has only sang his own songs and never someone elses, and I've never been the one doing the writing before, so we've all had to step outside of our comfort zones, and do something new and challenging, but it's been easy and natural because of our relationship. My worry now is finding a guitarist who will complement both the music and the balance of people in the group, and the deciding factor for all of us, far above technical ability, will be how they gel with us as people.

So I guess the thing I'd do is find some musicians you connect with, who share your sense of humour, whatever, and make that the focus, and let the music sort itself out. I know our auditions will start off over a pint or two, not with guitars in hand!!

[Machines]

I'm horrendously picky when it comes to bands. Any who have a whiff of self-appreciation or delusions of fame I steer clear of. I've learnt it's better to wait 6 months for a good one than have your time and patience destroyed by a bunch of no hopers.

[OutToPlayJazz]

[quote name='ARGH' post='234483' date='Jul 7 2008, 08:55 PM']My heart beats to the volume of Metal,as much as I hide,and like other stuff....my tone always needs a little dirt and distortion.[/quote]

Hmmm... How's about you forming your own original metal band, then? Make sure it's the best in the West Yorkshire area! That way you can hand pick your own musicians. That's what I've done with OutToPlayJazz - I have a "bank" of the best musicians & singers I know up and down the country. And in The PHD rock trio we're all equals - All technical players at a very high standard like yourself.

Rich.

Edited July 8, 2008 by OutToPlayJazz

[ARGH]

Right,its afternoon..and Im still f***ed off.

RE: "I wouldnt hire a guy that brought a 6 string to an audition".....I can respond in two ways,one being,If they downtune to say Low B..or they ask for AT LEAST a 5 string..Im gonna bring the 6,I dont just bring out an instrument to impress anyone. Most times its as Ive said ,the Fender. If you have a problem with people with more than 4,its your problem...simple as..I cant help you,you have to change.The other response is shorter,and obvious....

I dont want to form a band,Ive been doing that,Ive been doing that forever...its part of the problem,I want the problem to go away,Im stopping playing,the problem is going away.....

Fitting in.....Maybe being an alchy,drug using twat,might get me somewhere,maybe being sh*t might help,maybe being always late to gigs/rehearsal,with a pissweak excuse will get me success,then again I think not,but hey its an avenue.....Because thats what I seem to be auditioning to replace?!?

'Are you in fact Rubbish'

Yes ,this HAS actually flown through my head,but I cant be.....Im earning,and getting kudos doing coverswork,so I cant be sh*te,I genuinely think its maybe...fear...Bassists dont have ideas,we just dont,we just plod...doing the same sh*te over and over again,and never go beyond root 5th,maybe an octave on special occasions. Ive been called many names,by many people,for having an idea in the past,whereas I just shut up now (oh the teenage years) and watch them just fade away.....I can play,I can play very well,after aeons of trying,I cant get an originals gig,story end of.

Adrenochrome...You are in the same circles as me,and you KNOW that NO-ONE wants to write original stuff,its all for cash as soon as you pass 30,and thats just sh*te...I put an ad out on the ROTN (He'll know) do you know how many responses I got...1..f***ing 1...and acres on debate of weather original material goes down well on a gig that pays (f***ing what???...has the whole area NO imagination,why did ANYONE pick up instruments when they were kids...My mate asked a covers singer who's 20,"Dont you write original stuff" to which the reply was "No",with a look of 'Are you stupid or summat') . Leeds is sh*te,Bradford's sh*te,Wakey's sh*te,Dewsbury's sh*te...even the small out of the way places have NOTHING (Wetherby,Ponte,Fax). The names that made it 10-15 years back,have given nowt back or they are cliquey in extremis,all bullshit,and arsekissing...Even Birstall had a signed act once...its all gone.

Im tired. Im sorry.....

[ARGH]

[quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='235132' date='Jul 8 2008, 05:37 PM']Hmmm... How's about you forming your own original metal band, then? Make sure it's the best in the West Yorkshire area! That way you can hand pick your own musicians. That's what I've done with OutToPlayJazz - I have a "bank" of the best musicians & singers I know up and down the country. And in The PHD rock trio we're all equals - All technical players at a very high standard like yourself.

Rich.[/quote]
Sorry Rich,but I dont want to come accross as a c*** but.....What do you think Ive been doing for the last few years. I was auditioning for a band that was metal as f***,but the Guitar player just vape'd and joined Doods band. I was probably crap,but I wish was told so. The isnt anything of any note within 20 miles.....Im willing to travel further..but STILL theres nothing,Ive travelled round trips of 300+ miles for a rehearsal,thats how desperate and willing I was.

I just hate being lied too,I hate feeling as if its going right and it dosent,and I really hate myself feeling this way.

[ARGH]

Im sorry,Im just ranting now. Im gonna f*** off and have a shower.

Edited July 8, 2008 by ARGH

[alexclaber]

If I were you I'd get down to some writing and gradually try to put a band together. I spent a good few years trying to get things happening but finally ended up with a great line-up that meshes really well and is gathering momentum. I have lost count of how many people I auditioned/jammed/gigged with enroute.

I'm sure you could easily produce complete music on your own - take some time out from the scene and do some music just how you want it, then use that to get a new live project rolling.

Alex

[Jase]

Put your anger and frustration into your bass......form an all bass trio or something...call me for the 4 cos that's all I can handle you can play the mad instrument you have and get another player in between....I'm just trying to make you laugh mate... don't sell anything, don't hang up your bass for the summer, keep laying it down in your covers band, stay out there, cos if you don't....then you'll truly disappear.

[xilddx]

ARGH, you are being a self indulgent knob.

300 mile round trip for rehearsal??!! Have a word with yourself mate!

Get off yer arse, stop being so f*cking self defamatory and move somewhere new and get on the scene. It takes time.

If it means so much to you to play some heavy music, do it!

Got a myspace site? On youtube??

Show us what you're made of.

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='ARGH' post='235147' date='Jul 8 2008, 06:01 PM']RE: "I wouldnt hire a guy that brought a 6 string to an audition".....I can respond in two ways,one being,If they downtune to say Low B..or they ask for AT LEAST a 5 string..Im gonna bring the 6,I dont just bring out an instrument to impress anyone.[/quote]

K. I think you missed my point - being that [i]I[/i] wouldn't hire you. Me.

[quote name='ARGH' post='235147' date='Jul 8 2008, 06:01 PM']Most times its as Ive said ,the Fender. If you have a problem with people with more than 4,its your problem...simple as..I cant help you,you have to change.[/quote]

Au contraire. I'm not the one who can't get a gig. But anyway...

[quote name='ARGH' post='235147' date='Jul 8 2008, 06:01 PM']I dont want to form a band,Ive been doing that,Ive been doing that forever...its part of the problem,I want the problem to go away,Im stopping playing,the problem is going away.....[/quote]

Well, that's one solution, but seeing how angry you are about it I don't think it's the best solution. Is it that you don't want to form a band, or that you can't even find individual musicians who are into what you want to do? Or can't find musicians to play with at all? I'm not being funny - it took me a while to find people around here.

[quote name='ARGH' post='235147' date='Jul 8 2008, 06:01 PM']Fitting in.....Maybe being an alchy,drug using twat,might get me somewhere,maybe being sh*t might help,maybe being always late to gigs/rehearsal,with a pissweak excuse will get me success,[/quote]

Or maybe you just haven't found like-minded people yet. Or open-minded people. And maybe - and this is just an idea, please try not to be angry - maybe you come across as a bit of an anorak because you've got a 9-string guitar? Yeah in a forum full of other bass anoraks it's normal, but y'know, perspective.

[quote name='ARGH' post='235147' date='Jul 8 2008, 06:01 PM']Leeds is sh*te,Bradford's sh*te,Wakey's sh*te,Dewsbury's sh*te...even the small out of the way places have NOTHING (Wetherby,Ponte,Fax).[/quote]

I have a friend in Wakey who's currently busy with two originals gigs, another mate in Wakey who's probably doing all the others at the moment - both playing bass. None of these acts are part of any "scene", but they might not be your cup of tea exactly. One of them was looking for a bass player just a week or so ago actually, then they moved my mate on to bass from guitar because they couldn't find one.

Just saying, there might be stuff going on quite close to you that you're not aware of. Do you go see a lot of local bands?

[Finbar]

And IME, don't shy away from the fact you play an ERB in auditions. Be honest about it. I've found its a selling point more often than not. It'll set you apart from any other people auditioning. Sometimes for the wrong reasons, sometimes for the right ones.

[ARGH]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='235234' date='Jul 8 2008, 08:11 PM']K. I think you missed my point - being that [i]I[/i] wouldn't hire you. Me.[/quote]
Sorry..very VERY sorry,Its just when I see people having,what seems to me,hang ups,and predetermined thoughts,over numbers of strings..I see red,You just got ARGH'd. I can get gigs,they are just covers gigs....nice..but..well...2 pagesworth of bile tell you....

The 'Self indulgent' 300 mile trip was for my old band I had in Surrey,we would meet in QUAD in Leicester,we were and still are great mates,and 2 still play together in Woking*,we thought,in our own mad way that 'It can work'....soon to find out,it didnt,for both social,and writing reasons and the financial being a 3rd,but it was really really nice at the time,and the Curry afterwards was always nice.

The best piece of advice has been Alex's,and Rich's,of which as of August Im doing something about.Sadly I cant just up sticks and move anymore because..well..I bought what I live in,and moving now would be financial suicide (5 years...just 5 more years..the Tigers ground gets levelled...and then..££££...hopefully).

To be an 'Anorak',by having a 9 string...I dont get that though? What do you mean?




* If anyone is into Rush,Mastodon,and oddtime riff heavy Metal and lives in around Surrey area PM me they are desperate for a bassist.

[ARGH]

[quote name='Finbar' post='235256' date='Jul 8 2008, 08:43 PM']And IME, don't shy away from the fact you play an ERB in auditions. Be honest about it. I've found its a selling point more often than not. It'll set you apart from any other people auditioning. Sometimes for the wrong reasons, sometimes for the right ones.[/quote]
Thanks Fin,I have,but sadly,no avail as yet.

I have ...finally,come down..after 2 days....sorry and thankyou for all the nice comments,and words. Its just a forum,I get like this..I have to vent...Im glad Im not the only one thats had this sh*t to deal with.

[Finbar]

Start a band with me Kickass dual bass action. It would slay. Like Lightning Bolt but sillier ^_^

[ARGH]

[quote name='Finbar' post='235292' date='Jul 8 2008, 09:33 PM']Start a band with me Kickass dual bass action. It would slay. Like Lightning Bolt but sillier ^_^[/quote]
We could irritate EVERY mole within a county....Maybe I should get an 11 string.

[Finbar]

And give me the 9? Sure

Hah, maybe you should just try and find one good drummer, and do a drum/bass duo That could be pretty awesome! If my band ever splits up, I'd be really tempted. It would REALLY push me, but it could be great fun Much easier band dynamic, better money split, less petrol spent... Its quite appealing!

[ARGH]

[quote name='Finbar' post='235299' date='Jul 8 2008, 09:40 PM']And give me the 9? Sure

Hah, maybe you should just try and find one good drummer, and do a drum/bass duo That could be pretty awesome! If my band ever splits up, I'd be really tempted. It would REALLY push me, but it could be great fun Much easier band dynamic, better money split, less petrol spent... Its quite appealing![/quote]
I'll be honest..thats been the crux of my rage...Drummers..I can find a million Guitarists..but Drummers,justdont exist..ok..ones of decent capable..sane players...dont exist,my mates been looking for over 4 years.

[Finbar]

Drum machine.

Can play more than any drummer can, and never effs up. Means you have to be up to scratch though

[tonybassplayer]

I would like to ask a question please

Have you seen the advert for the Chief Whips who are looking for a bass player on the Partysounds website ??

Tony

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='ARGH' post='235274' date='Jul 8 2008, 09:10 PM']To be an 'Anorak',by having a 9 string...I dont get that though? What do you mean?[/quote]

Well it is a bit nerdy isn't it? Partly it suggests that you had it built to order, which in itself is a bit nerdy, but it also suggests that you probably bought it with the intention of playing it alone. I mean why else would anyone want all the bonus strings? So to me I suppose it subconsciously says you like indulging in difficult technical exercises. Like a mathematician or an engineer. So that's probably where I get "nerdy" from.

Basically whenever I see something like that I get scared that someone's going to pick it up and tap out plonky-buzzy horrible versions of piano music on it. I don't know whether anyone else gets the same feeling, but I imagine most people have never seen one before. I haven't in the flesh, actually.

Anyway, now that you've mentioned that you're into stuff like Mastodon, I can imagine it's hard to find other people who dig that stuff. I think it's clever myself, but I can't really listen to it - I think I have simpler tastes. Don't think I know any players who are into that stuff here in York but that's not to say they don't exist.

It doesn't sound like you're really ready to quit though. I think if nothing is coming along you should just retreat to your home studio and do your own thing for a while. At least you'll have stuff to show people when opportunities do come up.

[Finbar]

I have a custom 7, and I don't tap out piano music... 95% of what I do with my 7 is in the context of a band. If the band is clear about that, then there should be no problems. Its just that there aren't many bands with 7+ strings to act as a yardstick for what to expect. Element of Surprise did it very nicely IMO.

If they start asking you to do guitar solos in the middle of the song, you've probably got guitarists with the wrong end of the stick ¬_¬

[ARGH]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='235320' date='Jul 8 2008, 10:12 PM']Well it is a bit nerdy isn't it? Partly it suggests that you had it built to order, which in itself is a bit nerdy, but it also suggests that you probably bought it with the intention of playing it alone. I mean why else would anyone want all the bonus strings? So to me I suppose it subconsciously says you like indulging in difficult technical exercises. Like a mathematician or an engineer. So that's probably where I get "nerdy" from.

Basically whenever I see something like that I get scared that someone's going to pick it up and tap out plonky-buzzy horrible versions of piano music on it. I don't know whether anyone else gets the same feeling, [u]but I imagine most people have never seen one before. I haven't in the flesh, actually.[/u]

Anyway, now that you've mentioned that you're into stuff like Mastodon, I can imagine it's hard to find other people who dig that stuff. I think it's clever myself, but I can't really listen to it - I think I have simpler tastes. Don't think I know any players who are into that stuff here in York but that's not to say they don't exist.

It doesn't sound like you're really ready to quit though. I think if nothing is coming along you should just retreat to your home studio and do your own thing for a while. At least you'll have stuff to show people when opportunities do come up.[/quote]
Thats where you are going wrong on the extra string thing.You havent seen one..let alone played one...Im still learning,and you have created this mindset of x=y,because of what you may have seen..(its like thinking....I dunno..Fretless players all have beards and play fusion,maybe they do,But Ive a fretless and have been beardless since Christmas..)or what you think you have seen. You just made an assumption,about me and my instrument...2 3/4 octaves,EADG,IS ok,but I felt I needed more...And Ibanez and Warwick aint making them off the peg..........yet!

sorry fella,for the record,solo playing on our own because of 'bonus strings','Plonky,buzzy...'WE dont all do that,us ERBist..its a dreadful stereotype held over from the 6 string days..'more strings,must w***' And its pretty much always utter sh*te..yeah the NAMM Tapola stuffs on youtube,but its not all like that,its just a larger range ,thats all.Bass to some is a trad,background instrument..I dig that too,I play upright remember (well...try too).

Im not a fan of Mastodon....Phil on guitar liked Mastodon,Ade Liked Rush...Ive never owned a Mastodon lp in my life,but Ive heard they are good at what they do.

Yorks never really been a Metal town,Neither has Leeds (Post Punk/Indie) really,Bradders,Fax and Sheff* are,so's Wakey a bit,but not AS much as the previous two.

*Weirdly this has happend,and grown a lot in the last 2 years since Rios shut down,Theres Leeds Rios,But I dont think Bands like it that much.