Best Bridge for Super Sustain?

[bassatnight]

Hi,

I have a wee project on the go with a Fender P Mexican I bought for a couple of hundred of the Bay in January. I am not a big fan of Fender 'stock' bridge's and want something with more mass for better sustain (I need to add I am turning this fretted into a fretless) I have owned Badass and Gotoh before and although the Badass was marginally better it wasn't three times the price better!

So for fretless work any recommendations on a replacement bridge?

I must get some before and after pics up, she is lovely in a Lake Placid blue with black guard, I may sell on the rosewood neck but just picked up a mighty mite fretless ebanol so trying to make her sound as good as she is going to look.

Cheers,
Steve.

[Conan]

To be perfectly honest, I've never found that replacing the stock Fender bridge makes much difference to the tone or sustain. There are other more important factors to consider first IMO. That said, some of the Fender high-mass bridges look better than the BadAss, Gotoh, etc equivalents.

I'd keep the money or buy a couple of decent sets of strings!

[gary mac]

I was very impressed with the Gotoh unit that I fitted to a P bass build. Not convinced it actually improves sustain, well not that I could hear but it's well engineered, efficient and easy to adjust.

I would purchase another and certainly preferred the Gotoh over Badass.

[SteveK]

As Conan says, I doubt you'll notice much, if any, difference by replacing the bridge. Having said that, I'd go for something aesthetically pleasing with a quick string release.

[charic]

On looks alone the Babicz stuff is lovely. If I was looking again I'd probably be looking in that direction

[Conan]

[quote name='gary mac' timestamp='1393945368' post='2386099']
I was very impressed with the Gotoh unit that I fitted to a P bass build. Not convinced it actually improves sustain, well not that I could hear but it's well engineered, efficient and easy to adjust.[/quote]

Yes. They look great.

If looks are a major factor, then go for an after-market upgrade instead of the old BBOT. But for increased sustain..... maybe not!

[White Cloud]

I don't have much to add to this subject as it has pretty much been covered well by those above.

I really like both Gotoh 201 & Badass bridges on Fenders. Having said that the stock bridge does almost as good a job. I have no experience of the Babicz but it appears to be a "Gucci" variant on the same theme.

[Beedster]

Bridge-schmidge, on a fretless it's far more about setup - especially string height - the quality and integrity of the board, the strings, and most important of all, your fingers. Don't waste your money on a new bridge, I recall Jaco using a BBOT and not having too many complaints?

[Beedster]

Oh, and the nut is extremely important in fretless setup also, get that wrong and you could kill sustain on certain parts of the neck

[HowieBass]

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1393947935' post='2386140']
Bridge-schmidge, on a fretless it's far more about setup - especially string height - the quality and integrity of the board, the strings, and most important of all, your fingers. Don't waste your money on a new bridge, I recall Jaco using a BBOT and not having too many complaints?
[/quote]

+1 to this, you're going to have deeper string slots in the nut and with no frets plus less relief in the neck you need a bridge that lets you get the saddles nice and low. You might buy a high mass bridge, find the baseplate is too thick and the saddles bottoming out.

[bassatnight]

Cheers folks, I may just stick with the stock bridge. Onwards and upwards!

[HowieBass]

@bassatnight - I've just noticed the three fretless basses you already have and I can't imagine bettering them even with the Fender P bass - you must seriously be into the 'mwah'!!!

[JTUK]

[quote name='SteveK' timestamp='1393945670' post='2386103']
As Conan says, I doubt you'll notice much, if any, difference by replacing the bridge. Having said that, I'd go for something aesthetically pleasing with a quick string release.
[/quote]

Yes... agree.
The bass either has enough sustain and resonance and sings or it doesn't, but I would also be getting something more
than the stock Fender type plate as I always thought they were cheap and nasty...

[Telebass]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1393944042' post='2386089']
To be perfectly honest, I've never found that replacing the stock Fender bridge makes much difference to the tone or sustain. There are other more important factors to consider first IMO. That said, some of the Fender high-mass bridges look better than the BadAss, Gotoh, etc equivalents.

I'd keep the money or buy a couple of decent sets of strings!
[/quote]
This. There's nothing wrong with the stock bridge. Basic and workmanlike, yes. Bad bridge, absolutely not.

[bassatnight]

[quote name='HowieBass' timestamp='1393960307' post='2386341']
@bassatnight - I've just noticed the three fretless basses you already have and I can't imagine bettering them even with the Fender P bass - you must seriously be into the 'mwah'!!!
[/quote] I am very happy with my fretlesses, but this is more of a personal project, always fancied a LPB Fender P with an Ebony neck and all black hardware when one came up that I could upgrade I thought why not

[xilddx]

[quote name='bassatnight' timestamp='1394009186' post='2386750']
I am very happy with my fretlesses, but this is more of a personal project, always fancied a LPB Fender P with an Ebony neck and all black hardware when one came up that I could upgrade I thought why not
[/quote]
I had a white Fender Japan P Bass Special loaded body with black hardware that I got from The Stratosphere and put a Mighty Mite ebanol fretless neck on. I got black Hipshot Ultralites for it. You going to love that neck mate, they are fantastic

I agree with the above sentiments, no bridge is going to noticeably improve sustain, and getting the nut cut correctly and setting the relief properly are far more important.

[White Cloud]

I hope that [i]you share pics with us[/i] when the bass is finished. Sounds very cool.

[Dingus]

Well, my experience is the different bridges do make a certain difference in the sound of a Fender-style bass, and not just to sustain , but more so to overall clarity.

Most Fender basses will never have super-long sustain regardless of what bridge you put on them , but a slightly more substantial stainless steel bridge like the Badass or similar seems to give a bit more sustain and clarity particularly in the upper registers. Such bridges are also far less susceptible to slipping and losing their adjustment positions than the bbot bridges tend to be. I would stick with a relatively lightweight stainless steel design, though, because that style of bridge seems to be quite integral to making a Fender have its' characteristic complex sound. Heavy brass bridges on a Fender can be detrimental to the overall sound.

[Conan]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1394030078' post='2387102']
Well, my experience is the different bridges do make a certain difference in the sound of a Fender-style bass, and not just to sustain , but more so to overall clarity.[/quote]

Interesting! I'm not saying that there is no difference at all, just that under normal circumstances (i.e. while playing with a band at fairly high volume) it is highly unlikely (IME) that anyone would be able to notice any "improvement" to tone or sustain.

I have recently owned both a Fender Geddy Lee and a Marcus Miller. Both are fitted with BadAss II bridges. In both cases, they felt and sounded different to other fender J basses - but the differences were much more (IMO) down to the necks, pickups and onboard preamp (in the case of the MM) than any contribution that the bridge may have made.

I also think that fretless basses (when compared like-for-like with their fretted versions) have less sustain anyway. YMMV of course. Although that will, to an extent, depend on fretting-hand techniques.

If the OP wishes to install a high-mass bridge, then he should go for it. But as part of a quest for improved tone and sustain, I think it will follow the law of diminishing returns.

[Geek99]

I swapped bridges and didn't notice any difference besides ease of use and adjustment

[Conan]

[quote name='Geek99' timestamp='1394033046' post='2387148']
I swapped bridges and didn't notice any difference besides ease of use and adjustment
[/quote]

Which are perfectly good reasons to change!

[Dingus]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1394031225' post='2387120']
Interesting! I'm not saying that there is no difference at all, just that under normal circumstances (i.e. while playing with a band at fairly high volume) it is highly unlikely (IME) that anyone would be able to notice any "improvement" to tone or sustain.

I have recently owned both a Fender Geddy Lee and a Marcus Miller. Both are fitted with BadAss II bridges. In both cases, they felt and sounded different to other fender J basses - but the differences were much more (IMO) down to the necks, pickups and onboard preamp (in the case of the MM) than any contribution that the bridge may have made.

I also think that fretless basses (when compared like-for-like with their fretted versions) have less sustain anyway. YMMV of course. Although that will, to an extent, depend on fretting-hand techniques.

If the OP wishes to install a high-mass bridge, then he should go for it. But as part of a quest for improved tone and sustain, I think it will follow the law of diminishing returns.
[/quote]

I would completely agree with you that you aren't going to hear a night and day difference to the bass overall, Geoff, but I do think that the bridge can and does make a difference to the sound of any bass overall.

As a bit of background history, back in the mid-1980's I had a vintage Jazz Bass ( despite the fact that what I really longed for at the time was something modern that looked like a coffea table with active electronics) that was totally stock , and I noticed that as I played hugher and higher up the neck , thee was a noticeable loss of clarity and sustain compared to a lot of more modern basses. Also, the bridge saddles would slide about on the untracked baseplate and bugger up my intonation settings. Switching to a Badass sorted out both problems, although I would also acknowledge that, for most purposes, a Fender with the bbot bridge will have ample sustain for most people practical needs.

The relatively lightweight steel bridge is a big part of that Fender sound, in just the same way that a very heavy brass bridge contributes a lot to the sound of Alembic basses, for example. The steel gives a lot of a harmonic overtones to the note , and those overtones help define that sound of a Fender bass that we all know and mostly love.

A fretless is indeed much more muted than its' fretted counterpart by virtue of the fact that on a fretted you have got a steel string making contact with a steel fret . Once you change that for your finger pressing the same string down into a fretless wooden fingerboard, the tone and dynamic envelope of the note will change dramatically.

[uncle psychosis]

If you want to increase your sustain then buy a compressor, not a new bridge!

[White Cloud]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1394039410' post='2387267']
As a bit of background history, back in the mid-1980's I had a vintage Jazz Bass ( despite the fact that what I really longed for at the time was something modern that looked like a coffea table with active electronics) that was totally stock
[/quote]
....you owned a Fender during the 80's??? Most of us were feeding our wood burners with them at that time.

Next you'll be telling me that it had flats on it

[Dingus]

[quote name='White Cloud' timestamp='1394043193' post='2387327']
....you owned a Fender during the 80's??? Most of us were feeding our wood burners with them at that time.

Next you'll be telling me that it had flats on it
[/quote]

Yes, exactly right. Never had flats though, and I told myself that I was just like Jaco ... but just not[i] quite[/i] as good.

Other kids used to take the piss out of me at school because I didn't have a preamp. That's when I decided that if I ever had children I would either buy them the most up-to-date musical equipment or send them to private school instead of the kind of rough inner- city comprehensive I went to.

What has actually transpired is that I decided not have any kids and buy the up-to-date gear for myself instead . Result!

Edited March 5, 2014 by Dingus