Skol303 Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 I'm toying with the idea of bringing analogue summing into my modest home mixing set up. I'm often reading good things about it and so I'm interested in exploring the idea further. What's bugging me is the basic question of how the heck would I go about connect a summing mixer into my current set up - given that I work exclusively 'within the box' at present. I have an old iMac, the sockets on which look like this: And I have a basic Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 USB interface, the ins/outs of which are thus: So in simple terms, how would I go about connecting a summing mixer into this set up - i.e. what gets plugged in where?? It's kind of a[i] 'birds and bees'[/i] question, only for audio! I'm currently not sure whether I need a D/A converter, an I/O or patch box... or even what any of these things are. I've tried plenty of Googling around the subject, but the discussion tends to assume the reader has at least a basic knowledge of analogue set ups, which I don't! If anyone can shed light on this I'd be most grateful. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 (edited) Do you mean summing as in you split the signal from your bass, put different effects on each channel & then sum them back together? If that's what you're doing & just want to record it (not play live), then you could use the 2 channels on the front of your interface & mix them in your DAW. If you want to play live, get/make a small mixer. I made mine... [url=https://flic.kr/p/be4x9P][/url] Edited March 28, 2014 by xgsjx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironside1966 Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 USB line out's\ [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=4] summing mixer\ [/size][/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]FR Scarlett[/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=4] Ins, It is that simple or have I missed something. [/size][/font][/color] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 [quote name='ironside1966' timestamp='1396033661' post='2409335'] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 USB line out's\ [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif] summing mixer\ [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]FR Scarlett[/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif] Ins, It is that simple or have I missed something. [/font][/color] [/quote] From my understanding, it is that simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted March 28, 2014 Author Share Posted March 28, 2014 [quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1396032263' post='2409314'] Do you mean summing as in you split the signal from your bass, put different effects on each channel & then sum them back together? If that's what you're doing & just want to record it (not play live), then you could use the 2 channels on the front of your interface & mix them in your DAW. If you want to play live, get/make a small mixer. I made mine... [/quote] Hi G. Sorry I should have been more clear... As I understand it, a summing mixer is a hardware device that let's you convert multiple digital channels from your DAW into analogue and 'sum' (ie. mix) them together - and then convert the analogue mix back into digital and feed it back into your DAW. I short: it let's you output digital material, mix it as analogue, and then feed it back into your computer... all of which allegedly preserves the clarity/fidelity of each track far better than 'summing' the final mix in digital format. Yeah, I'd probably have stopped ready by now too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironside1966 Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 it Just the same but using more out's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted March 28, 2014 Author Share Posted March 28, 2014 [quote name='ironside1966' timestamp='1396033661' post='2409335'] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 USB line out's\ [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=4] summing mixer\ [/size][/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]FR Scarlett[/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=4] Ins, It is that simple or have I missed something. [/size][/font][/color] [/quote] That bit I understand! What I'm unsure of is how to split the signal from the Focusrite so that it enters the summing mixer as individual tracks - rather than as a single stereo signal? Here's a link to some pics of a typical summing interface which illustrates my conundrum: http://www.dangerousmusic.com/products/2-bus-0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironside1966 Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 (edited) [size=4]Don't think stereo think of it has 2 outputs then add more[/size] [size=4]You need to create sub groups in your DAW. give them different outputs of the [/size][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=4]Focusrite Scarlett.[/size][/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=4]if the [/size][/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=4]Focusrite Scarlett has not got enougth outs then you need to invest in another interface[/size][/font][/color] Edited March 28, 2014 by ironside1966 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topo morto Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 You've got 4 outputs on your focusrite, each of which could be an input to one of the mixer channels. The whole activity really sounds rather bogus though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted March 28, 2014 Author Share Posted March 28, 2014 [quote name='ironside1966' timestamp='1396034483' post='2409348']...Focusrite Scarlett has not got enougth outs then you need to invest in another interface[/quote] I think that may well be the sum of it! (pun intended). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironside1966 Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 (edited) I went through a phase of using outboard gear, I spent a lot of time experimenting with it but in the end I just stopped using it. The ease and convenience of working in the box far outweighed the benefits. If I am honest I don’t think my mixers were any better with outboard gear. I use saturation plug-ins instead. Try http://www.slatedigital.com Edited March 28, 2014 by ironside1966 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topo morto Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 [quote name='Skol303' timestamp='1396034161' post='2409340'] ... all of which allegedly preserves the clarity/fidelity of each track far better than 'summing' the final mix in digital format. [/quote] Whoever said it would preserve the fidelity of each track better than a (properly-working) digital system is your enemy. Clarity is more subjective, but... [quote name='ironside1966' timestamp='1396036325' post='2409373'] I use saturation plug-ins instead. [/quote] +1 - There's something to be said for nice-sounding analogue but that nice sound isn't magic, it's due to effects that if understood can be replicated 'in the box'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted March 28, 2014 Author Share Posted March 28, 2014 ^ Cheers guys, good to hear these insights. I'm currently just weighing up the idea of adding an analogue signal chain to my setup. I've always mixed solely 'in the box' and much of my analogue curiosity is likely down to the perceived 'grass being greener' and me just liking knobs and switches to play with. I won't be taking the plunge - if at all - for a good while yet. It's an expensive pursuit and I currently have other demands on my wallet - like moving house! - but I like to have ideas brewing, hence my curiosity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topo morto Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 [quote name='Skol303' timestamp='1396037248' post='2409390'] I'm currently just weighing up the idea of adding an analogue signal chain to my setup. I've always mixed solely 'in the box' and much of my analogue curiosity is likely down to the perceived 'grass being greener' and me just liking knobs and switches to play with. [/quote] There's a lot to be said for having physical controls - we are physical beings, with bodies and hands after all. The summing mixer just seems a bit anaemic. Why not dive in properly and get a nice-sounding analogue desk with EQ, proper faders, and all that... (now dead cheap second hand...) that way you get a proper physical mixing experience rather than a token extra D/A A/D step? Just another idea for the brew... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted March 28, 2014 Author Share Posted March 28, 2014 [quote name='topo morto' timestamp='1396039438' post='2409429']Why not dive in properly and get a nice-sounding analogue desk with EQ, proper faders, and all that... (now dead cheap second hand...) [/quote] Nice idea. I've just been having a browse on eBay and there are indeed some bargains to be had on old analogue mixing desks. I shall investigate further... Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubsonicSimpleton Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 I bought an Allen & Heath System 8 16:8:2 desk a few years ago when I was working with a big soul band performing sound engineering duties, it is a truly lovely piece of kit to use - worth way more than the paltry £200 I paid. http://www.dancetech.com/item.cfm?threadid=2651 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topo morto Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 One thing you might want to check is how many simultaneous outputs your old iMac could realistically push... I don't know what the deal is there, only ever do stereo in / out myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 I should have taken into consideration that you posted this in the "Recording" section & not the "Effects" section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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