No wonder music shops close.

[mcgraham]

To the OP, I totally agree. The majority of music stores are becoming more and more hassle than they are worth. My personal props goes to Guitar Guitar for being the best guitar store I've ever used or visited. So helpful and so polite, always loads of time for every customer. Bass-wise, Bassdirect is excellent, and now they have two in-store staff the customer service is far more attentive and helpful.

Re: customer service - No-one likes people being rude or unhelpful, but that's nothing new to encounter from shop assistants/stores. The thing that irks me is the default trying-to-be-helpful-but-really-isn't [i]'no we don't have it in but we can order it in for you'[/i]...

...except that I can do exactly the same thing for myself, get it delivered to my home, and therefore wouldn't have to make another trip into a store. There is very little helpful about that approach. In fact, on anything moderately expensive or stuff other than standard stock items, the stores often make you pay up-front for the item they are ordering in, so there's not even the advantage of them ordering something with no cost to you. I understand the reasoning, but there is absolutely zero incentive for me to pull the trigger on something like that.

I get that if they don't have it then what else can they say, but there must be something that can step above the mark. e.g. 'We don't have it in stock, but we could order it to an address you prefer, e.g. home, work. You'll have to pay for because it's not a stock item, but we'll price match as per online, AND we'll cover shipping to say sorry for not being able to oblige here in store, and if you're not happy with it, just return it to our store or via post as per returns policies for a full refund'.

Maybe I'm being too optimistic, or not acknowledging logistical issues there, but THAT sort of customer service wouldn't be THAT difficult to do (it's basically providing an online service in store) and would certainly make people who want to support their local store more inclined to keep going back.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='lou24d53' timestamp='1398002312' post='2429395']
I keep reading on here about how good Bass Direct are, but in my experience, they are not the 'holier than thou' retailer they are painted to be on here. I've only ordered online from them twice, but on both occasions, I have had to chase up my order.

The first time, it took three emails from me to chase up the correct speakon cable I had ordered along with with a Genz Benz 1x12" Focus cabinet, with me having to send the initial incorrectly sent cable back to them AT MY EXPENSE. The second order, I had to chase up my Darkglass Vintage Microtubes pedal two days after I placed the order, despite being told it would be posted the day I placed it.

I'm sure Bass Direct are one of, if not THE, best bass retailers in the UK, but they also are not without fault.
[/quote]
I've had poor service from Bass Direct too.

I've also had very good service from shops that have been strongly criticized on BC.

I've also had a bad experience of Guitar Guitar who are praised in previous post.

Edited April 21, 2014 by EssentialTension

[Musicman20]

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1398078727' post='2430116']

I've also had a bad experience of Guitar Guitar who are praised in previous post.
[/quote]

Same here...although in the end they sorted it out. Still not keen to test it again though.

I got the impression because I wasn't interested in typical shred metal guitars they weren't interested.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1398067651' post='2429950']
One interesting little observation I have about instrument retailers is that almost all of them are 'players'.

A lot of them are relatively young, have been through years of learning at school, university or music academy type places

After all this preparation for a career in 'music' they end up flogging guitars in a shop because there's either so few opportunities to earn money playing or they simply didn't have whatever it took to get into the band they really wanted.

This can often result in a resentful workforce who look down on their customers.

I'm not defending this attitude one bit, I've always thought that if you do any job you should try and do it to the best of your abilities, but it might explain some of the attitudinal issues from some music shop staff
[/quote]

Completely agree Molan!

[Cow]

Since we're on the subject of customer service in local music stores:
A few years back I went into my small local music shop with my then-girlfriend, who ended up purchasing a nice acoustic they had. While she was paying for it and selecting a hard case etc, I asked to try a five string bass they had (can't recall exactly what it was) as I'd never had a go on one before. It was pretty nice and not particularly expensive, so naturally the GAS monster started to rear it's ugly head to the point that I was almost convincing myself I should buy it, getting all caught up in the retail-buying excitement and all. After five-ten minutes or so of noodling one of the staff came over so I started asking some questions, such as was I right that the fretboard was ebony (I pretty much knew it was but was trying to show I might be interested in buying it). They were all met with disinterested half answers including a 'no idea, probably' regarding the ebony board, he then huffed and told me he better take the bass back now otherwise it would be second hand.

Bearing in mind, I had had it for less than ten minutes and was showing interest in it while my girlfriend (we were the only two people in the shop) was handing over a reasonable sum of money at the till, I gave him a blank 'are you serious?' look, handed over the bass and left. On the plus side, it stopped me spending money I shouldn't have been spending, but I still couldn't believe it.

Fast forward to last year, I was installing a treble bezel in my Rickenbacker and in the interest of cosmetics, was considering getting some replacement pickguard screws etc as the ones on it are showing a little rust. They were a bit too pricey online so thought I'd give the local shop a try, thinking since they do repairs/setups, they might have something suitable in stock or be able to to order something in a bit cheaper. Worth a try at least, I thought. So in I went, it was one of the owners who was behind the counter, so I asked him did he by any chance do spare screws/nuts etc. He looked at me like I'd just asked him if I could get a roll and square sausage and replied "screws for what?". Resisting the urge to ask him if that was a trick question and accepting perhaps I wasn't specific enough, I looked over at the repair counter with the boxes of screws nuts and bolts and politely explained I was looking for replacement pickguard screws/nuts etc. for my Rick. He then leaned back in his chair, folded his arms and said "Well, we might - but everything has it's price". Those were his exact words to me. No exaggeration.

At that point, I really wanted to (and in retrospect should have) simply turned around and walked out, perhaps asking if he'd like to get that printed on the window as the store slogan. However, being too polite and still sort of wanting the screws, I pointed out (as politely and non-sarcastically as I could at this point anyway) that I didn't ask for anything for free and was well aware they wouldn't be, given that I was in fact, in a shop and that is generally how shops work. We then went over to the repair bench where I showed him the screws I'd brought with me, after telling me he couldn't order the correct screws for me, he then rummaged around various tubs bringing out various screws, none of which were remotely similar. Ones that were the closest he only had four of, which when I pointed out I needed more than his answer was I could just take four of them, then a couple of different ones as well to make up the numbers. I decided to leave at this point.

Needless to say, I won't be back there again and I certainly won't be taking in anything for repair...

[Cow]

In fact, just to add: I had almost forgotten, but at the time my girlfriend was buying the acoustic guitar she had another electric (an ESP) on order with Thomann. It wasn't being released for a few months yet if I recall so she was waiting for the stock to come in. She happened to mention this to the shop owners at which point they went on a tirade about how Thomann were the worst company in the world and no one should ever buy anything from them ever, even showing her a printed letter they said had been sent out from the head of ESP warning that Thomann were a bunch of scammers who wouldn't honour warranties or some such.

They convinced her she should cancel her order and they would order the guitar in for her if she wanted it. I wasn't convinced (have used them myself before and since) and didn't find anything online at the time or since either about a problem between ESP and Thomann - perhaps it was genuine and someone here can back it up though, I'd be interested to know. Anyway, they scared her enough that she did end up cancelling the order, though luckily she never re-ordered it from that store.

[chrismuzz]

[quote name='Cow' timestamp='1398087550' post='2430253']
In fact, just to add: I had almost forgotten, but at the time my girlfriend was buying the acoustic guitar she had another electric (an ESP) on order with Thomann. It wasn't being released for a few months yet if I recall so she was waiting for the stock to come in. She happened to mention this to the shop owners at which point they went on a tirade about how Thomann were the worst company in the world and no one should ever buy anything from them ever, even showing her a printed letter they said had been sent out from the head of ESP warning that Thomann were a bunch of scammers who wouldn't honour warranties or some such.
[/quote]

Companies can get into a lot of trouble for being derogatory about others! And I'm sure if Thomann were such a bunch of scammers, and ESP knew it, they wouldn't continue to allow them to supply their products. Sounds ropey as hell

[discreet]

[quote name='chrismuzz' timestamp='1398093587' post='2430333']
Sounds ropey as hell
[/quote]

It sure does - many members of this forum (including myself) have only good things to say about Thomann.

[EssentialTension]

Thomann have never scammed me.

[sykilz]

Hadn't been to a musicshop in years, but this weekend I'd just sold a bass so the money was burning a hole in the pocket!! Went to PMT in Southend, which I've always liked, and their prices are now in line with the internet too, and it somewhat showed me that the store experience was better, as I could try a few models I hadn't anticipated liking. Also two models, a Yamaha (!!!!!!!) and a Fender Dimension had loose control knobs and jack sockets that disappeared into the basses body! Now the shop should really have checked these, but at least they could fix them there and then, and offer me other models to try. If I'd mail ordered them it'd be a repackage and repost for each wrong 'un. I even purchased a (different) Dimension, which after returning home and trying thru my rig, I didn't like the sound, so rang back and they immediately offered an exchange, so went back today and got a Jazz, dead chuffed. And a cup of coffee too. And 5% off this weekend!

[leroydiamond]

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1398096119' post='2430377']
Thomann have never scammed me.
[/quote]
Thomann have always been ace. Though they are an online business, yet they answer the phone promptly, are always courteous and ship promptly. Their 30 day no quibble returns policy is for real. I spent a few minutes reviewing some products I had received and promptly received an email giving me 40 euro off my next order!. Will the street retail shops be able to compete with such a service?.

Edited April 21, 2014 by leroydiamond

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' timestamp='1397980608' post='2429084']
HotRox in Nottingham I by far the best I've ever been. Actual instument stock is poop but everything else they are excellent, they know what they are on with and never had trouble with them in regards to trying stuff out.
[/quote]

Actually despite the fact that they are fairly limited in the bass section, Hotrox have IMO the most interesting selection of 6 string guitars of any of the Nottingham music shops.

[madshadows]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1398094021' post='2430339']
It sure does - many members of this forum (including myself) have only good things to say about Thomann.
[/quote]

Thomann were great when I bought my bass of them, great service and well packed for delivery

John

[Philip_]

thomann are a good company no doubt about it.

andertons and GAK are also reliable and both do bass demos on youtube which i appreciate.

[chrismuzz]

[quote name='Philip_' timestamp='1398112500' post='2430635']
thomann are a good company no doubt about it.

andertons and GAK are also reliable and both do bass demos on youtube which i appreciate.
[/quote]

I've not bought from Thomann before but I've never heard a bad review. GAK and Andertons I've had excellent experiences with though

[Philip_]

[quote name='chrismuzz' timestamp='1398113080' post='2430643']
I've not bought from Thomann before but I've never heard a bad review. GAK and Andertons I've had excellent experiences with though
[/quote]

Gak's online dealings have always been good for me - i'd love to visit their shop but it's far too far away from me to even consider. they made a whole terrace of shops into their place and it looks jam-packed with cool gear. now THIS is a music shop if i've ever seen one...



andertons were particularly easy to deal with when my amp arrived broken. i know a lot of companies do the "no questions asked" returns thing, but they were chill on the phone and we had a bit of a laugh about it.

i'd give either of those companies my money again.

Edited April 21, 2014 by Philip_

[Woodinblack]

[quote name='Cow' timestamp='1398086084' post='2430236'] They were a bit too pricey online so thought I'd give the local shop a try, thinking since they do repairs/setups, they might have something suitable in stock or be able to to order something in a bit cheaper. Worth a try at least, I thought. So in I went, it was one of the owners who was behind the counter, so I asked him did he by any chance do spare screws/nuts etc. He looked at me like I'd just asked him if I could get a roll and square sausage and replied "screws for what?". Resisting the urge to ask him if that was a trick question and accepting perhaps I wasn't specific enough, I looked over at the repair counter with the boxes of screws nuts and bolts and politely explained I was looking for replacement pickguard screws/nuts etc. for my Rick. He then leaned back in his chair, folded his arms and said "Well, we might - but everything has it's price". Those were his exact words to me. No exaggeration.
[/quote]

Some times it works though, I went into the music shop in dorchester, as I had an indie guitar and its pickup switch was missing and they have a lot of indies (I didn't get it there). I asked if they had switch ends, they didn't but they guy went off to search for something that would work, and eventually found one that worked from the back of the store and charged practically nothing for it. Some stores really do go the extra mile.

[paulears]

The real problem is that music shops staff their premises with keen young musos paid NMW when they really should have staffed the shop with proper sales people, who know the product ranges and can actually sell!

Sales don't generate themselves, there's an art to it, and there are plenty of skills people can learn to increase their conversion rate. Customers make buying signals and proper sales people can spot these. Sure - part of their job is to sell what they want, rather than the customer wants, and maximise profit.

These people match up what people want (think they want) to what the shop has to sell, and as they're usually on commission, you can expect attention. Of course, sometimes we don't want this attention, but you can't have it both ways.

[chrismuzz]

[quote name='paulears' timestamp='1398114492' post='2430672']
Sales don't generate themselves, there's an art to it, and there are plenty of skills people can learn to increase their conversion rate.
[/quote]

After working in sales for 6 months I've really noticed this. The problem is that now that I'm a skilled salesperson, selling musical instruments is far beneath me and I'd earn drastically less money than I do currently.

[molan]

[quote name='Woodinblack' timestamp='1398113780' post='2430656']


Some times it works though, I went into the music shop in dorchester, as I had an indie guitar and its pickup switch was missing and they have a lot of indies (I didn't get it there). I asked if they had switch ends, they didn't but they guy went off to search for something that would work, and eventually found one that worked from the back of the store and charged practically nothing for it. Some stores really do go the extra mile.
[/quote]

I've actually had this in Denmark Street on more than one occasion - odd screws missing or a washer that's come loose. I used to work around the corner and would pop in to see if they had a random part and got a few little bits and never paid for any of them

[flyfisher]

Interesting piece here about the growth of Amazon over the past 20 years:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-27055407

[i]Every man, woman and child in Britain spends an average of more than £70 a year on Amazon. That's more than half the country's entire online retail spend. It's an impressive result for a business started on a couple of computers exactly 20 years ago. [/i]

[Musicman20]

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1398156639' post='2430906']
Interesting piece here about the growth of Amazon over the past 20 years:

[url="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-27055407"]http://www.bbc.co.uk...siness-27055407[/url]

[i]Every man, woman and child in Britain spends an average of more than £70 a year on Amazon. That's more than half the country's entire online retail spend. It's an impressive result for a business started on a couple of computers exactly 20 years ago. [/i]
[/quote]

I really rate Amazon, no matter what tax issues there are. I always end up paying less and having that brilliant service.

If we ever get to the stage of them stocking American Series Fender gear, then I'll probably use them for that as well.

They currently have little bits like MXR pedals, and in the USA they stock Aguilar.

Edited April 22, 2014 by Musicman20

[mark_random]

Hello all! Thanks for the kind words about GAK in this thread.

As I'm sure I've said before on BC, we really value the feedback from specialist forums like this one. I'm always keen to hear about the experiences you've had in-store, over the phone, and on our site. As the OP noted, it's really tough to be a music instrument retailer in 2014 so hearing what we are doing right, and where we can improve, is very useful indeed!

[mentalextra]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1398161197' post='2430956']
I really rate Amazon, no matter what tax issues there are. I always end up paying less and having that brilliant service.

If we ever get to the stage of them stocking American Series Fender gear, then I'll probably use them for that as well.

They currently have little bits like MXR pedals, and in the USA they stock Aguilar.
[/quote]

My daughter ordered some trainers off Amazon last week, but they were delivered to a 'suspect' neighbour as we weren't home, when we did eventually get them they were a bit beaten up. My daughter decided to return them. Easter Saturday night we dropped them at a local Budgens 'pick up' point. Monday Morning (easter monday) courier brought replacement! Shame we had to return them, but they redeemed themselves

[mentalextra]

[quote name='paulears' timestamp='1398114492' post='2430672']
Customers make buying signals and proper sales people can spot these. Sure - part of their job is to sell what they want, rather than the customer wants, and maximise profit[/quote]

As a salesman myself I have to own up to playing some games with shop staff I dont't like, and PC World is my real treat!