Budget s/h blues-rock rig that sounds good?

[skankdelvar]

My small but b*****d heavy Ampeg B15T combo does fine at teeny gigs and great in the studio. Trouble is, it can't really get over a full-on band with any conviction. So, I need a second 'rig' for gigging, but as usual, I'm strapped.

For under £350.00, what do you reckon's a good combination of [i]secondhand-only [/i]gear that would help a Precision and a Jazz deliver a loud blues rock thump? (and hopefully keep my spine where it should be)

There have been lots of helpful threads in the past but seem to be a bit more focussed on new gear or more modern sounds.

Thanks in anticipation

[Deep Thought]

I play blues and R'n'B through a Trace 7215 SMC 300watt combo, with a Precision. No effects. Does the job for me very well, there's usually several for sale around the £150-200 mark, and they seem to be generally well regarded as giving plenty of bang for the buck. I use a Hartke 4X10 extension cab for a bit more punch, but the Trace is fine on its own for most applications. I was pleasantly surprised at its weight and compactness, but opinions can differ on that score, and what is lightweight to me could be a ton to somebody else. I think there was one on the sales page not long ago, I bet there's a few on the Bay.

[bassmansky]

i would say trace gear, 300w combo with maybe a extension cab,theres a few about at the moment.i used a 1x15 300w trace combo for a couple of years and it did me proud.also ashdown abm gear which im using at the moment is very simalar and just as goodthough probably not many about for your budget.

[skankdelvar]

Ta for that guys...I didn't realise Traces were that inexpensive these days. Mind you, some time since I scoped out bass gear and lots seems to have changed.

So, people, if I was looking at Hartke ext cab, would I be better off with paper or aluminum cones? - some players value the latter for a 'modern' sound, although I'm not quite sure what that means!

Oh, and nice Precision, Deep Thought...very Lynott.

Edited July 15, 2008 by skankdelvar

[bass_ferret]

Sorry but ampeg model numbers can be a bit confusing. Is your amp the B15T Portaflex 100w valve flipop combo?

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='bass_ferret' post='240490' date='Jul 15 2008, 11:39 PM']Sorry but ampeg model numbers can be a bit confusing. Is your amp the B15T Portaflex 100w valve flipop combo?[/quote]

I wish.... Nah, it's an 80's [i]tranny[/i] portaflex flip top. Hence the T suffix. Supposed to be 100w, but I've seen it quoted as nearer 70w. Seen a couple of B15N's (the old valve job) on the Bay recently...silly money, but apparently sound the dogs.

*Sigh*

[Dr.Dave]

You can pick up old style Hartke 3500 amps for around half your budget. A loud 350w with a valve stage. Folk seem to have stopped raving about them , maybe as they seem very big and heavy compared to the new generation of micro stuff.

Team that with a 4x10 - there was an Ashdown ABM going here for about £160 - plenty of noise there.

Option to go full stack and add a 15.

I'm in a blues rock band and I'd be happy with that.

My own choice is a GK 400RB and 2 Ashdown compact cabs, a 2x10 and a 1x15. You'd be pushed to get that within the £350. Not as loud as the set up above but a bit easier to hump around.

[chris_b]

I assume the cab is 8 ohms, so you won't be getting the full 100 watts unless you add another cab. Try it with an other 1x15. You will get more volume and shift more air than you do at the moment.
Recently there was a Peavey 1x15 BW cab for less than £100 here on BC, have a look in the For Sale section, it might still be available.

[Deep Thought]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='240479' date='Jul 15 2008, 11:28 PM']Oh, and nice Precision, Deep Thought...very Lynott.[/quote]

Thanks! It's intended to be more JJ Burnel though.

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='chris_b' post='240612' date='Jul 16 2008, 09:17 AM']I assume the cab is 8 ohms, so you won't be getting the full 100 watts unless you add another cab. Try it with an other 1x15. You will get more volume and shift more air than you do at the moment.
Recently there was a Peavey 1x15 BW cab for less than £100 here on BC, have a look in the For Sale section, it might still be available.[/quote]

Ta for the thought, chris_b. Sadly, it's 4ohms from a single output. Back when it were all fields round here, (ie about 1989), 100w seemed enuff. Wrong!!!!

Cheers though

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='Deep Thought' post='240655' date='Jul 16 2008, 09:59 AM']Thanks! It's intended to be more JJ Burnel though. [/quote]

Sorry Deep, you look far too friendly to be JJ. Try scowling more and beating the **** out of a journalist or two. He was a black belt y'know.... Or so they said.

[silverfoxnik]

There's some good gear available at the moment in the For Sale section.. Merton has a good Trace 1x15 for sale for about £100 too.. As someone said here recently, it's definitely a buyer's market at the moment!

[Deep Thought]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='241074' date='Jul 16 2008, 05:01 PM']Sorry Deep, you look far too friendly to be JJ. Try scowling more and beating the **** out of a journalist or two. He was a black belt y'know.... Or so they said.[/quote]

It's true enough-he's now a Sixth Dan black belt. He's the reason I took up bass in the first place, way back in the mists of time-always wanted a black precision with a maple neck like his, finally got one last year. No point me trying to impersonate JJ though, even if I wanted to-he's got way more hair than me for a start! (he's also way better than me!)

[Mr. Foxen]

I've got a peavey 1x15 and an OHM GA140 head you could have for £150, would be a good start. Its currently my practice rig till Iget my Ashdown combo back.

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='Deep Thought' post='241228' date='Jul 16 2008, 08:31 PM']No point me trying to impersonate JJ though, even if I wanted to-he's got way more hair than me for a start! (he's also way better than me!) [/quote]

So how did he get that 'Barracuda' sound? Unique. I think Peaches was the first punk bassline I learnt....

[Deep Thought]

It's generally accepted that, certainly in the early days, his distinctive sound came from using a guitar amp (a HiWatt I believe) with a cab that had torn speakers.

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='Deep Thought' post='241523' date='Jul 17 2008, 09:26 AM']It's generally accepted that, certainly in the early days, his distinctive sound came from using a guitar amp (a HiWatt I believe) with a cab that had torn speakers.[/quote]

Drifting OT for a minute, seems like a case for a Digitech signature pedal. Or at least a named FX patch.

Either way, a consensus seems to be emerging on the rig front...old Traces, Hartkes or GK's. My heart says full rig, my back says combo and a cab. 2x10 + 1x15 maybe...

[bassmansky]

trace 1x15 combo with a 2x10 cab,you should be able to pick both up within your budget as their are a few about at the moment.plenty loud enough and fairly easy to lift around.

[Welshbassist]

My vote goes for ashdown. I wouldn't go for GK myself, I think they'd be too "bright" sounding!

[bass_ferret]

Lightweight and cheap dont often go together so best keep an eye on the for sale forum. Head and cab is more flexible than a combo. And ignore all those people telling you to mix 10's and 15's - they dont know what they are talking about. If you need two cabs use two the same.

[skankdelvar]

Aha! The consensus seems to be wobbling slightly!

GK's = brighter, Ashdowns = woolier* - don't these things have a tone knob?

Interested in this not mixing driver sizes thing...why's that? Thought it was fairly uncontroversial practice? (doesn't mean it's right, I s'pose - 10 billion flies etc)

Thanks for all the kind input so far, people. One thing's clear; lots of good old stuff out there. It'll be like Xmas for my Physio...

[size=1](*description noted elsewhere on forum)[/size]

[Dr.Dave]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='242280' date='Jul 17 2008, 11:59 PM']Aha! The consensus seems to be wobbling slightly!

GK's = brighter, Ashdowns = woolier* - don't these things have a tone knob?


[size=1](*description noted elsewhere on forum)[/size][/quote]

Exactly right.

I've always been of the opinion, though, that if I can get a sound close to what I want without moving any of the knobs far from 'neutral' - then that's the amp for me.
Small tweaks then perfect the sound.

GK = bright. Well , not in my experience - though of course they're capable of being so. The core sound - which is essentially what I use - on my 400RB mk4 is lower than a dacshund's nads. Think most folk would want to add a bit of top if anything.

Ashdown = wooly. Well , yes - a bit. Have to throw my hat in there.

Not mixing speaker sizes??? New one on me. I'd like to know the thinking behind that.

You , my friend , need a trip to 'World of Bassamps' somewhere and try a few out. At the end of the day , opinions are like arseholes - we all have one.

[Deep Thought]

I think the 'wooliness' is generally associated with the ABM series Ashdowns-I also have an Ashdown MAG 300 4X10 which is not at all woolly, and I recall others here saying similar. That having been said, to return to the gent we were discussing earlier, JJ Burnel (sorry to keep banging on about him) now uses ABM stuff, and I don't think his sound can be accused of being woolly!

[bass_ferret]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='242280' date='Jul 17 2008, 11:59 PM']Interested in this not mixing driver sizes thing...why's that? Thought it was fairly uncontroversial practice? (doesn't mean it's right, I s'pose - 10 billion flies etc)[/quote]
See [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=22504&hl="]this post[/url] There is a [b]huge[/b] difference in frequency response and sensitivty between Ashdown ABM115 and ABM210/410 cabs. When used in this combination I am not surprised at the bad sound.

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='Dr.Dave' post='242409' date='Jul 18 2008, 09:39 AM']Exactly right. ....if I can get a sound close to what I want without moving any of the knobs far from 'neutral' - then that's the amp for me.
Small tweaks then perfect the sound.[/quote]

Makes sense - sorry, I was being a bit facetious re: the tone knob. I sort of realise that diff mfrs have different core tones , but I don't seem to have 'noticed' many of these uppity new-fangled brands, so more difficult to audial-ize (as some might say).

As an old Bob, I can mentally 'define' a Fender, Marshall or Ampeg tone in the same way I can imagine the taste of a tin of pilchards, but I'm b*****d if I could accurately describe what newer rigs sound like, even though I go to gigs and listen to music / the radio. The only thing that comes to mind is 'a bit more sproing-y'.

Maybe modern amps have a less distinctive 'tonal character' and fit into mixes less obtrusively (*dons Kevlar vest*)

FWIW, the amp that most floated my boat [i]ever[/i] was a rhsal room Acoustic 370 through a 2x15. Out of body experience.

ta for the further input