Barefaced Cabs - Retro six10 and Retro Two2

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='Billy Apple' timestamp='1399677735' post='2446721']


I'd not be happy if when placing my order I'd not been told about the new improved model that was round the corner.
[/quote]

Same here. When I placed an order for a gen2 cab, a couple months down the line Alex emailed me about the Gen 3 super compact and asked if I'd like either a regular Comoact or the new super compact. I'm sure he would have done similar to any 69er orders.

[Merton]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' timestamp='1399707844' post='2446801']


More than likely, for a few years china has been hoarding Neodymium(to my knowledge at least) so that's what originally drove forward the the gen 3 cabs. I don't know if the driver in the gen 3 stuff is ceramic, neo or ferrite but I really dig mine regardless.
[/quote]

Originally was going to be ceramic in Gen3 but then they found a neo source meaning they could up the thermal power handling

The new 10" is ceramic because, as it has a much smaller magnet required for the limited power handling, it keeps the costs down I believe and there is no weight or sonic advantage to go neo on this design. EDIT: didn't explain that as well as I understand the reasoning in my head. Hmm.

Edited May 10, 2014 by Merton

[nickademus]

[quote name='nickademus' timestamp='1399665725' post='2446569']
So why are these modified 10" guitar speakers Alex is using not neo? Cost?
[/quote]

I reread the 69er thread and it was the 69er that has a modified guitar speaker in it but its good to see Alex going back to ferrite to get where he wants with this cab.

I thought that fridges started to roll off at about 100hz but the specs on the Retro10 says 40hz so can we assume this cab will have more extended bass compared to a fridge?

[mcnach]

[quote name='Wooks79' timestamp='1399561152' post='2445352']
Put off by the 12ohms thing, I wouldn't wanna take a chance
[/quote]


Yeah, he could have done the TC Electronic thing and call them 8ohm

A single number to describe the impedance of a speaker is a pretty simplistic way to describe a speaker. I guess it's useful in that speakers probably follow a relatively similar impedance/frequency curve, so when one speaker rated at X works with an amp, you can be satisfied that other speakers rated at the same will work too.
But that's not the full story, as Alex points out in the blurb.

[mcnach]

[quote name='JapanAxe' timestamp='1399580594' post='2445670']
12ohms? Not a problem. Impedances are nominal, for which read 'approximate, rough-and-ready, rule of thumb'. With a valve amp you can safely go up or down by a factor of 2 in nominal impedance, so an 8 ohm output can be used into a load between 4 and 16 ohms. It may not sound as good or as loud, but it won't kill the amp.

I have seen and heard this demonstrated by a guy who is a certified valve geek!
[/quote]

Exactly

[mcnach]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1399583763' post='2445711']
I don't understand why it has to be 12 ohms??? Wouldn't it be more 'popular' just to make a simple lightweight 2x10???
[/quote]

I think the idea is that you can use three together for maximum "oomph", at a resulting impedance that works for most amps out there.

Alternative "standard" impedance small lightweight cabs, he already makes a few

[mcnach]

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1399628778' post='2445962']
...or conversely, getting the most out of your amp?

Would you get in your Ferrari and only press the throttle half way?
[/quote]


no, but I suppose you get more out of the extra speakers than a few extra watts into fewer speakers.. and if the objective is to allow a modular 6x10 rig (which seems to me the case from reading the blurb), then I think it works nicely. You can use 2 rather than 3 2x10 if space/transport is limited and you don't lose too much of the available power.

But, who uses their amp to the max?
If to achieve volume X you need to turn up the amp a bit higher when using 2 of those 12ohm cabs, then do that... the cabs can take it (supposedly).

I think it's clear the objective is a modular 6x10, where you can use various other combinations in a reasonable manner with the existing amps. Whether enough people find that appealing or not is another matter entirely.

[mcnach]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1399635598' post='2446097']
yep... and the amps and cabs section updates can be dominated with their NCD etc threads and posts.
So, just what we need... another thread about them.

I am down to 4 forums I regularly check through.... I rather it not be 3..
[/quote]


Clearly labelled threads so those who are not interested can skip them easily.

Skipping threads: yes, we're allowed.

[mcnach]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1399671629' post='2446650']
It is just a question of balance. If you were pretty new to the site and you read a few threads you might get the impression that
they were the only cab to have. It is just that there are as many people here who really don't know why there is any fuss at all about them, but they aren't the most vocal.
[/quote]


I think it goes in cycles. I was surprised to find quite a few BF threads recently, but I think it's that the new Gen3 of products have recently come out and people are starting to buy them in larger amounts. After a while it will probably subside and go back to what it was like pre-summer 2013.
Although I do get the impression that the Gen3 cabs are generally significantly "nicer", and if that were the case, it will contribute to getting a few more than just because it's a new series of cabs.

Prior to this recent influx, I had not noticed too many threads about BF, which is why I had to use the search function to lookk for reviews and comments before.

[JTUK]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1399682448' post='2446741']
Maybe the people who really don't know why there is any fuss at all about them haven't tried them.
Have [i]you [/i]tried a Barefaced cab?
[/quote]

You really don't want to know... I assure you.

[discreet]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1399723073' post='2447006']
You really don't want to know... I assure you.
[/quote]

I assume you didn't get on with Barefaced, then! Fair enough. Which cab did you try?

[Merton]

Edit - bored so ignore me

Edited May 10, 2014 by Merton

[JTUK]

It wasn't mine...of course, but had a 15" which 'prooved' everything I dislike about them.
Too much bass and no tone, I didn't like the build as the shelved port looks odd on the side.
Panels too thin and not convincingly put together and lacking in attention to detail or finish.

Having said that, not that impressed with the amp or bass either, but say no more about that.
The guy liked it and thought it very light.... I didn't rate the sound of it in the room either and
I can understand why people may have boom problems
but then his sound objectives and mine would be wildly different.

Did I really want to post the above ... ? no, not really.

[discreet]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1399724736' post='2447036']
Did I really want to post the above..? no, not really.
[/quote]

Well I'm sorry to have pressed you on a point you didn't want to make, but it boils my piss when people criticise gear they haven't even had visual contact with, let alone tried themselves, or God forbid, tried in a rehearsal or gigging situation, so I thank you for that.

[JTUK]

All cool, no problem..

[bertbass]

[quote name='Billy Apple' timestamp='1399672764' post='2446668']
Are people who bought the 69'er not a bit miffed that it's been side-lined so soon?
[/quote]

It's like virtually everything, things get updated and specs changed, normally just after you've bought it. New car, hifi, Apple product, amp, cab, guitar or bass.

Am I miffed, not at all. At last night's, exceptionally boring gig, I stood on stage and thought, can my sound get any better than this? I wandered out into the vast expanse of nothingness that was the dance floor and leaned on the bar and just listened and still thought, can my sound get any better than this? Infact, the whole band sounded superb, shame no one was paying attention but it was a birthday party and the birthday boy really enjoyed it, so it's OK.

I'm in sonic heaven with my Streamliner and 69er and who's to say that the 'new improved' 69er will sound as good? I don't think that I will be paying another grand to find out.

Edited May 10, 2014 by bertbass

[Musicman20]

I tried an early Compact and yes, I'd need a tweeter or mid driver for some more clarity. Even though I have an Orange OBC115 which seemed to have more bite than the Compact. I wanted it as a one cab solution for certain gigs.

I realise times have moved on and I am genuinely interested to know what the BB2 sounds like. All previous expectations are now in the past so is start fresh. As long as there is enough bite and the build is better the BB2 might be a good cab for me.

[Lozz196]

[quote name='bertbass' timestamp='1399725774' post='2447054']
It's like virtually everything, things get updated and specs changed, normally just after you've bought it. New car, hifi, Apple product, amp, cab, guitar or bass.

Am I miffed, not at all. At last night's, exceptionally boring gig, I stood on stage and thought, can my sound get any better than this? I wandered out into the vast expanse of nothingness that was the dance floor and leaned on the bar and just listened and still thought, can my sound get any better than this? Infact, the whole band sounded superb, shame no one was paying attention but it was a birthday party and the birthday boy really enjoyed it, so it's OK.

I'm in sonic heaven with my Streamliner and 69er and who's to say that the 'new improved' 69er will sound as good? I don't think that I will be paying another grand to find out.
[/quote]

I think that`s the best place to be in Bert, totally satisfied with your sound and not seeking more tone-nirvana from an untried product. I`m pretty much there myself nowadays, though I keep looking at many different amps/cabs etc, I can`t see me getting any more from any other set-ups - aside from backache that is.

[discreet]

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1399732447' post='2447136']
I can`t see me getting any more from any other set-ups - aside from backache that is.
[/quote]

Then there's the pain in the wallet to take into consideration.

[ShergoldSnickers]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1399725197' post='2447049']
All cool, no problem..
[/quote]

Yep — I'd sooner have a negative opinion based on actual experience than either a negative or positive one based on supposition and guesswork. Far more useful.

[mcnach]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1399727094' post='2447067']
I tried an early Compact and yes, I'd need a tweeter or mid driver for some more clarity. Even though I have an Orange OBC115 which seemed to have more bite than the Compact. I wanted it as a one cab solution for certain gigs.

I realise times have moved on and I am genuinely interested to know what the BB2 sounds like. All previous expectations are now in the past so is start fresh. As long as there is enough bite and the build is better the BB2 might be a good cab for me.
[/quote]

I have a Gen2 Compact and felt a bit like you. I liked the volume, the size, the weight... it was a great portable solution, but it needed "help". On its own I never really fully enjoyed it (others do, but I want a more top/midrange sound). It worked well to supplement other cabs that could to the midrange better, but I personally would not really use it on its own.

I recently got a BB2, and that was a much better cab for the sound I am after. It may not have as much bottom end (but then you can boost bass a bit and it seems the cab can cope with it), but sounds a lot clearer and it has a very pleasant sound, a lot more open. I have used it with the Compact a few times now, and they work well together... but I also used the BB2 alone a few times, and it seems like a very good all round cab. Very happy with it. The Compact Gen2 was ok, the BB2 is really nice, full stop. Try one if you get the chance, but at high volumes (reheasal or gig), as I never feel it sounds all that great at low volumes, but it shines once you turn it up.

[discreet]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1399749553' post='2447341']
Try one if you get the chance, but at high volumes (reheasal or gig), as I never feel it sounds all that great at low volumes, but it shines once you turn it up.
[/quote]

Well there's the rub. You can't really make a proper decision about a cab (or a bass, or an amp) by just playing your bass through the cab at home, in a shop or at a bass bash. You only really know what it can do when it's used in anger and at battle levels right in the mix with your loud guitarist, your heavy-handed drummer and your shouty singer. It's not always obvious how it's going to pan out.

I suspect this is why there is a high turnover of cabs in Amps and Cabs for Sale...

Edited May 10, 2014 by discreet

[Merton]

I think the Gen 3 cabs really are a big step up from the previous BF cabs, but I was a big fan of the old Compact, S12 and Vintage cabs too. I don't like tweeters though

JTUK, if you ever want to try a Gen3 SC (1x12) - purely for scientific reasons for your own (dis?!)pleasure - just shout. It would be interesting to compare them to your cabs because I've never actually used those so can't compare. I just know the SCs work for me

[Raslee]

...and once again another cab billed as a 'fridge killer' (my arse) - why not a Berg or Hartke killer eh??? . Bit like the laborious anti iPhone salesmanship i.e. the iPhone serial killers aka Samsung etc.

Having owned a previous 'fridge killer' cab I have to say the weight was of course the big difference that suits many, but certainly not killing the sound at all - far from it in my opinion. I now own a fridge and an iPhone (old one)...I'm not precious about them but great to have the benchmarks that most compare their products against.

[Beer of the Bass]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1399749553' post='2447341']
The Compact Gen2 was ok, the BB2 is really nice, full stop. Try one if you get the chance, but at high volumes (reheasal or gig), as I never feel it sounds all that great at low volumes, but it shines once you turn it up.
[/quote]

Well, drifting off-topic, I liked playing through your BB2/Gen 2 Compact combination at the gig last night! It seems like the BB2 is really clear and even in the upper mids/treble region - it's all there without giving the impression of having gaps or peaks in the response. Also, with just a small tweak of the Markbass VLE knob, I was happy with the sound of my fuzz, which is rare for a tweetered cab. Although I don't know how you had the attenuator set - maybe it was switched off?