Cab help?!

[timmchale2009]

Hi all

I recently bought a 15th Anniversary Ashdown ABM 500 2 x 10 combo. Stunning tone, really versatile (works well with both my Jazz and Precision) and surprisingly light! I decided to add an extension cab and bought the matching 1 x 15 but it's gonna take an age for it to arrive, however they have got the matching 2 x 10 available which looks like it's got pretty impressive spec too. Now what's confusing me is the following... The 1 x 15 gives a frequency range of 20hz to 9khz and the 2 x 10 gives a frequency range of 25hz to 20khz. Obviously I have the 2 x 10 and that has more bass than you can shake a stick at so is there any sway in preference for that extra 5hz lower? Will it make a dramatic amount of difference to the low end or will it be negligible? Also can someone explain what the difference in the SPL's will mean?! The 1x15 is 99.1dB @ 1w/1mtr and the 2x10 is 98.5dB @ 1w/1mtr. Sorry for lots of techy-ish questions.

Thanks

Tim

[LukeFRC]

It all depends at what point they are measuring the frequency point from! -3dB, -6dB or -10dB - without that information the frequency response info isn't really that useful.
The SPL figures mean that the 1x15 is marginally louder than the 2x10.... not as much as would make a difference.
So between the two I doubt there's much to choose by - which is easiest to move around?

I would google around for Bill Fitzmaurice's advice on mixing speaker sizes.... and make your choice from that.

[chris_b]

IMO Ashdown 10's sound better than their 15's.

I'd get the 210. You'll get as much bass out of the 410 but it will be tighter and less "pillowy", which is a better bass tone in my opinion. The 10's will be punchier with more definition in the notes.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1403952681' post='2487973']
It all depends at what point they are measuring the frequency point from! -3dB, -6dB or -10dB - without that information the frequency response info isn't really that useful.[/quote]They're probably -20dB. Those numbers are utterly silly where electric bass speakers are concerned. They simply don't go that low, by about an octave.

[quote]I would google around for Bill Fitzmaurice's advice on mixing speaker sizes.... and make your choice from that.
[/quote]In a word, don't.

[Lozz196]

I`d get the 210. As well as what Chris says, you have the flexibility of the combo on its own for rehearsals/smaller gigs, then adding the ext 210 for bigger events without any need to change your eq (which is possible with a different speaker size, and even more likely when the frequency ranges are different on each cab).

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1403958800' post='2488074']
They're probably -20dB. Those numbers are utterly silly where electric bass speakers are concerned. They simply don't go that low, by about an octave.
[/quote]

At which point I don't know why they bother giving those figures. It's so so different to the PA world where everything is spelled out.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1403976887' post='2488296']
At which point I don't know why they bother giving those figures. It's so so different to the PA world where everything is spelled out.
[/quote]Bass players get gigs by being competent playing their instruments. That doesn't require a high level of technical knowledge.PA guys get gigs by being competent producing good sound. That requires a high level of technical knowledge. I'm generalizing of course, not all working PA techs are competent by any means. I'm in Montreal for the jazz festival. Last night I saw concerts at five outdoor venues, only one sounded good. Not concidentally it was at the largest/most important venue. It's a very safe bet the crew there got the gig by having a reputation for knowing what they're doing. It's also a very safe bet they got paid a lot more than the hacks at the other venues. Knowledge may be its own reward, but it carries a lot of other perks as well.

[Phil Starr]

FWIW Bill is absolutely right, as is LukeFRC.

It's possible to make a 15 go down to 20hz and to make one that is 99dB/W but you couldn't do both at the same time. To be efficient you need a light cone and a short voice coil, to be deep you need a heavy cone and a long voice coil. You can get efficiency up by using a huge magnet but at huge cost. Even then you would eventually overdamp the speaker leading to a loss of low end.

All speakers tail off in their response at both ends. Bass tails off at about 12dB/octave in a sealed cab and usually 24dB/octave in a ported cab. This means they all produce some output at 20Hz, just that it is too little to be of any use. In any case your bass goes down to 41hz for a 4string and 30ish for a 5 so there is no need for lower. Excursion also doubles for each extra octave so you'd have to halve the power rating if it really did go that low. It's a dishonest claim really

1dB is pretty much the smallest change in volume you can detect, so 0.6db won't be noticed.

If you like your sound then only the 2x10 will give you more of it, The 15 will change your sound. You'd have to try it out to find out if you like the change or not.

Edited June 30, 2014 by Phil Starr

[Prime_BASS]

I'd get the 2x10.

Stand the combo on its side, then the 2x10 on top of that on its side. Now you have a rig that's the same height as a 8x10 but much better displacement.

The lows, you aren't going to hear them that much anyway, the low E fundamental is something like 40 Hz(IIRC) and you mainly hear the harmonics of that anyway. That's why people can set up with amps that say they only go as low as 40hz, 50hz etc.