The sound of low B - advice

[razze06]

I've recently purchased my first 5-string bass (Yamaha bb615) in a very long time. My reasons for the purchase are quite pragmatic: we often need to transpose songs down to a different key to suit our singer's range, and having a low B string would help with that.

I have noticed that the difference in timbre and tone of the same note played on the B string and on the E string are very different. To be precise, I think that the low B sounds louder and shoutier in the higher register (above the F#), and hollow on the lower notes. I tried the bass using a variety of setups, including all my amps, through my cabs and a hartke 4x10. The tone changes, but the same differences apply.

I believe the Yamaha is a good quality bass, with nice tension on the low B, and adequately low action. The sound on the other strings is perfectly agreeable, but the difference on the low B is quite clear. My question is: is there anything I should adjust on the eq, setup, playing technique to mitigate the effect? Is it something to do with the bass? Is it just the way things are?

[Old_Ben]

Which key do you usually drop down to? And when doing so do you shift the tuning on the B string? Or do you keep it at B and just play the other notes / with a capo?

I have found that with using B strings it be the string gauge might feel adequate but still doesn't have enough tension. In my own opinion I find even a 0.130 still lacking, I use the 0.145 gauge and it makes a whole load of difference to the tone and depth of the low B.

(Also getting the bass set up by a guitar shop wouldn't hurt either!)

Depending on your amp and (EQ) wouldn't over do it but maybe push up the bass frequencies, if you have a graphic EQ maybe try just the lowest slider up a touch could see it poking out a bit more.

[GrammeFriday]

Could just be a one-off duff string - it does happen sometimes. I'd try changing strings/brand of strings before starting to fiddle around with pickup height adjustments, etc.

[Lw.]

In my experience this should happen all across the fretboard to a varying degree (often not noticeable in a band setting), for example on a conventional 4-string play a C on the E & A strings and they will sound slightly different. I imagine some people use this to their advantage to get a different sound for the same note.

To make it less noticeable on your B-string you could probably play around with your EQ a little (but don't over do it) or try lowing your pick-ups a little on that side which will probably lower the volume on that side (again only move it in small increments).

[CamdenRob]

It's a totally different timbre depending where on the neck you play a note. It's usefull as sometimes you want deep and boomy and others you want clear and bright.

[ikay]

I find that using a really fat B string can accentuate the difference in timbre and volume over the other strings. I use a 125 gauge B on both my 5ers (TRB5 and SR5) , the tension is fine and the string balance sounds good. To my ears anyway! As with all these things YMMV. How you setup (relief/action) and how you play can make a big difference.

Edited July 8, 2014 by ikay

[humapuma]

There will be some change in timbre if you play the same notes on different strings, as you would expect, but I'm guessing it's quite a strong difference? If there is a large difference it shouldn't just be 'just the way things are', but there are a few variables! You certainly can get 5s to sound even and balanced across the whole range.

Maybe try a new, perhaps heavier set of strings and check the set up including pick up balance (low to high, neck to bridge), as others have suggested.

Don't have any experience with Yamahas so can't offer more specific advice as I don't know what they're like.

In the long run if you play 5 a lot you may end up looking at different cabs (can't remember what you've tried apart from a 4x10, and I can't read the OP now I'm typing!).

[GrammeFriday]

[quote name='ikay' timestamp='1404823787' post='2496034']
I find that using a really fat B string can accentuate the difference in timbre and volume over the other strings. I use a 125 gauge B on both my 5ers (TRB5 and SR5) , the tension is fine and the string balance sounds good. To my ears anyway! As with all these things, how you setup (relief/action) and how you play can make a big difference.
[/quote]
+1. 125 I find to be ideal for both string-to-string balance and tension.

[discreet]

When I dabbled with a fiver I found it necessary to address the B string slightly differently to make it sound congruent with the other strings. But to a lesser extent I find the same with the E, and less again on the A even, on a four-banger - so it's just a question of degree. IMHO, anyway.

[zero9]

I concur with ikay. When I did have a five, I used a smaller gauge B string, which gave a better balance to the overall sound. Some string retailers (such as Status Graphite) will let you buy individual strings. For a small spend, you could buy a couple of different gauges of B string and try them with your current set.

If you know another bassist or good guitar tech in your area, it might be worth getting them to check out the instrument if you're not sure. Sometimes a second opinion helps.

Edited July 8, 2014 by zero9

[jazzyvee]

There is a difference in the tone of any note of the same pitch played in different positions on a bass and also guitar. It's not a problem it's just physics and as is said above some players use that knowledge to their advantage. I know I do.
If you keep the same string gauge the B-string on a 34" scale bass will sound and feel noticeable different than on longer scale 35" scale as for the same gauge of string the 34" will feel slightly looser.
On my basses anyway the EADG strings have a very similar feel when played and the B string feels different when plucked. When I had my first 5 string it came with .125 on the bottom and I changed it to .130 and it feels much better. The other thing is you learn to compensate for this difference with your playing when it comes to playing notes on the B-string so that eventually you get a good tonal balance.

[GrammeFriday]

Good points. I should have said that I find 125 perfect for my MTDs (which are 35 scale) but 130 works better on my Stingray 5 (which is a 34).

[humapuma]

Oh. I might be wrong to have suggested heavier strings judging from some of the other comments.


Well, I likes em.

[razze06]

Thanks for the sound advice (see what I did there?)

I know someone who's a 5 string enthusiast, maybe he can advise on the specific bass and sound. Different strings is a definite possibility, I may have a set lying about at home, see what gauge they are.

The BB615 has a funny bridge that extends backwards in correspondence of the lowest string. This should give a scale close to 35 inch for that string only, as opposed to 34 for the rest of the strings. Perhaps a lighter gauge string could help...

[HowieBass]

If that B sounds hollow or a bit 'woolly' in the lower register then try striking the string (dunno if you're a pick or fingerstyle player) closer to the bridge; you'll probably notice it sounds a lot tighter.

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='razze06' timestamp='1404825659' post='2496068']
(...)

The BB615 has a funny bridge that extends backwards in correspondence of the lowest string. This should give a scale close to 35 inch for that string only, as opposed to 34 for the rest of the strings. Perhaps a lighter gauge string could help...
[/quote]

Nope, your B will still be a 34" scale, if it were 35" the frets would have diferent spacing comparing to the other strings. The bridge has the B side longer to help with the intonation, it's made like that just to give the saddle more travel to the back.


There's always a diference in all strings. the B is more noticeable because of the phisics of the material. There are some basses that handle this issue better then others, both my TRB5PII and my Smith have a very well balenced scale and the diferences are tiny but on any other bass i've owned (i only play 5 stringers) and this include my current BB1025X the difference is a lot more noticeable.

In a band scenario all this fades, it's a issue that i never worried about. Like said a few posts back, you can use this diferences in your favour and play on diferent places for diferent results.

[fretmeister]

I find string choice to be more vital on 5 strings.

I have 2 stunning 5 string basses (Marleaux and Sandberg) and yet on both of them I thought they sucked with the original strings.

Marleaux own brand strings are bloody awful. I have no idea what was on the Sandberg but they sucked too.

They now have D'addario Prosteels and the low B on both sounds clear and deep as I wanted. I even tried D'addario Nickels on the Sandberg and it wasn't quite right. The B was a bit flubby, even if the other strings were all perfectly fine.

I don't know why I keep experimenting with strings - I always come back to them!

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1404837255' post='2496262']
I find string choice to be more vital on 5 strings.

I have 2 stunning 5 string basses (Marleaux and Sandberg) and yet on both of them I thought they sucked with the original strings.

Marleaux own brand strings are bloody awful. I have no idea what was on the Sandberg but they sucked too.

They now have D'addario Prosteels and the low B on both sounds clear and deep as I wanted. I even tried D'addario Nickels on the Sandberg and it wasn't quite right. The B was a bit flubby, even if the other strings were all perfectly fine.

I don't know why I keep experimenting with strings - I always come back to them!
[/quote]

I know wht you mean, Prosteels all the way for me too but now i'm thinking about trying the regular nickels on the BB, i don't think that the Prosteels are intended for a vintage-type-of-sound bass . Love them on the TRB and Smith though.

[pete.young]

Sometimes you get a bit more clarity with a tapered b string.

[discreet]

I stumbled across this when I was going through my 5-string phase... quite entertaining. Also, interesting info on how to fit a low B string - you have to avoid twisting it apparently... whether there's anything in that or not, I don't know.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLcwYNHDnPY[/media]

Edited July 8, 2014 by discreet

[hamfist]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1404846443' post='2496374']
Also, interesting info on how to fit a low B string - you have to avoid twisting it apparently
[/quote]

Good point. This is important. Still important with a std E string IME. Much less noticeable with A string and smaller. So, the thicker the string the more effect any twist in the string will have on playing, punch and tone.

[razze06]

Nice video, very informative.

I've played the bass at band practice last night, and realised that I was struggling quite badly with the overall tone, not just from the B string. My preference is for a strong presence, with plenty of low mids and punch. I swapped the Yammy for my warwick corvette and the Westone (strung with flats), and the difference in tone was massive.

I've decided to return the bass to the shop I bought it from, and pick another 5er. I need to like the overall tone before I can worry about the differences in timbre between strings

[ambient]

Increasing the size of the B will just accentuate the tonal differences of enharmonic notes across strings.

I use a 125 and have done for years.

[Hector]

A tip I picked up for double bass is that the lower strings (particularly the E string) don't need to be plucked as hard to get a similarly loud/deep sound. You could maybe try lightening your right hand touch on the low B a little bit and see if that helps?

[Roland Rock]

You mention that the B string has a low action, but this is not necessarily conducive to better tone. In fact, I've found that raising the action a bit can actually be beneficial.