Finger stretching

[timmo]

Can anyone remember when they first started playing the bass, and you had to use one finger per fret? Was it difficult at first, and how much time and practice did it take to get your fingers with enough stretch. The reason i ask, is my wrist is locked from having arthritis with barely any movement. I can`t seem to get my fingers stretching, so not sure if it is because the tendons are restricted through my wrist somehow. I can get 3 frets fairly well, but the fourth is taking some doing. It also hurts my wrist, but that is the reason for me taking up an instrument to get some movement back into my joints, which to a degree is working. So is that an excuse, or did you find it was a real problem getting your fingers stretched, and it just takes months of practising stretching the fingers? At the moment i have got homework of doing the Chromatic scales to get my fingers moving

Edited September 19, 2014 by timmo

[HowieBass]

I think one finger per fret is a good technique but it's not the only way you should approach playing, particularly if you have restricted movement. Pivot about the thumb on the back of the neck and get used to stretching but I wouldn't be afraid to move your hand/thumb up and down the neck as required if that's the only way you can get to the notes you're playing. You might find that your hand/fingers will loosen up in time but I don't know enough about your condition to say whether that will definitely happen. It's whatever works for you and doesn't hurt or aggravate an existing condition.

[EssentialTension]

I'd advise against OFPF below the fifth fret, especially if it hurts.

Just use Simandl,

[HowieBass]

This might help explain when to use the three finger (1,2,4) technique:

http://youtu.be/SPr3WjHDIOo

[Coilte]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1411146799' post='2556983']
that is the reason for me taking up an instrument to get some movement back into my joints, which to a degree is working.
[/quote]

That's a very unusual reason for taking up an instrument, if you dont mind my saying so. [size=4] IMO you would be better served getting the advice of a physiotherapist on what exercises would be of benefit. Failing that, check You Tube for yoga stretching exercises. [/size]

[size=4]If indeed you have a genuine interest in taking up the bass, i.e. for the enjoyment of playing music, then I would agree with the advice given so far. Be [i]VERY[/i] [i]CAREFUL[/i] when stretching, especially on the lower (1-5) frets. Also check You Tube for left and right hand technique. [/size]

[timmo]

[quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1411160885' post='2557233']
That's a very unusual reason for taking up an instrument, if you dont mind my saying so. [size=4] IMO you would be better served getting the advice of a physiotherapist on what exercises would be of benefit. Failing that, check You Tube for yoga stretching exercises. [/size]

[size=4]. [/size]
[/quote] I guess it s reasonably unusual. I have always wanted to play an instrument, but got arthritis in my teens which stopped me .Advancements of drugs has enabled me to have a go. I chose bass over guitar because of the wider spacin of the strings. The piano would probably be beetr in terms of full finger workouts, but it has never appealed.
I have told the nurse that deals with my artritis and she says it is a good idea as it will ease the joints. Because of the lack of movement, it does hurt, which is going to be the case, but i am getting finding my joints in the wrist and fingers easing. That is why i wanted to know if anybody found it hard to stretch over 4 frets when they were learning.. If everyone had found it easy, then i would think it will be difficult.If on the other people took a long time, then i know it will just take me lot longer

[cameltoe]

It took me a while and I did used to use this technique a lot, but have now drifted to a more 1,2,4 and just moving my hand more rather than keeping it planted.

It might be me getting lazy, but I actually feel I have better control this way, especially for muting/ghost notes.

[Coilte]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1411166233' post='2557283']
I guess it s reasonably unusual. I have always wanted to play an instrument, but got arthritis in my teens which stopped me .Advancements of drugs has enabled me to have a go. I chose bass over guitar because of the wider spacin of the strings. The piano would probably be beetr in terms of full finger workouts, but it has never appealed.
I have told the nurse that deals with my artritis and she says it is a good idea as it will ease the joints. Because of the lack of movement, it does hurt, which is going to be the case, but i am getting finding my joints in the wrist and fingers easing. That is why i wanted to know if anybody found it hard to stretch over 4 frets when they were learning.. If everyone had found it easy, then i would think it will be difficult.If on the other people took a long time, then i know it will just take me lot longer
[/quote]


Glad to hear that you have got the OK to play bass, from a medical expert. The OFPF can be too much of a stretch for a lot of people, regardless of the condition of their hands. As has been mentioned, use the thumb as a pivot and use fingers 1&4, especially on the lower frets.

Below is a link worth checking out.

I still think it would be a good idea to also include other exercises, like I previously mentioned.

Best of luck, and I hope your situation improves.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXkxu_7Tn48

Edited September 20, 2014 by Coilte

[KiOgon]

[quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1411203394' post='2557414']
Glad to hear that you have got the OK to play bass, from a medical expert. The OFPF can be too much of a stretch for a lot of people, regardless of the condition of their hands. As has been mentioned, use the thumb as a pivot and use fingers 1&4, especially on the lower frets.

Below is a link worth checking out.

I still think it would be a good idea to also include other exercises, like I previously mentioned.

Best of luck, and I hope your situation improves.


[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXkxu_7Tn48[/media]
[/quote]
+1

I have a lot of arthritis in my whole body, sometimes I can only play a short while & even that can be a struggle but usually eases off as I warm up. I found this video really useful - even for an old git who's pretty much set in his ways lot's of things to practise there

[timmo]

Thanks all for the replies. The videos have been helpful. Gives me something to work on .

[inthedoghouse]

I guess deep down it doesn't really matter if you can't make a stretch as long as you're overall sound isn't affected and you're playing the music to the standard you want. Look at what Django achieved with his disability :-)

[timmo]

[quote name='inthedoghouse' timestamp='1411246120' post='2557908']
I guess deep down it doesn't really matter if you can't make a stretch as long as you're overall sound isn't affected and you're playing the music to the standard you want. Look at what Django achieved with his disability :-)
[/quote]Yes. Some of the clips i have seen of people playing instruments with disabilities are very inspiring. It probably doesn`t matter if i can never achieve the stretch, but i assume it is better to try to play the proper way, and then try to compensate after with adjustments

[HowieBass]

You'll perhaps notice a difference in how flexible the fingers of your left hand are compared to the right after you've played for a while. I can curl the little finger of my left hand down towards the palm reasonably independently of the ring finger moving, whereas on my right hand if I try the same thing my ring finger moves to follow the little finger when I curl it.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1411250641' post='2557946']
... but i assume it is better to try to play the proper way ...
[/quote]
It is not the case that there is 'one proper way to play'.

[JTUK]

The stretch wasn't the problem, the strenght in the fingers was, iirc. especially the little finger.
I would only be taking your course of action under supervision of a good physio tho..
I persisted with mobility exercises when I had broken fingers and that recovery was total
and worth the hard work. I am not sure yours is quite the same. Depends what the medical advice is
from a specialist rather than a GP.

[timmo]

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1411285363' post='2558045']
It is not the case that there is 'one proper way to play'.
[/quote]I know. I believe most players would think that one finger per fret is the most efficient and smoother way of playing. Maybe it wasn`t the right way to call it the proper way, but it seems a popular method. I will perservere with that, and if no good comes of it i will try to adapt. I have already changed from right to left handed, so everything is possible.I am in it with too deep to quit easily.

Edited September 21, 2014 by timmo

[timmo]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1411286564' post='2558058']
The stretch wasn't the problem, the strenght in the fingers was, iirc. especially the little finger.
I would only be taking your course of action under supervision of a good physio tho..
I persisted with mobility exercises when I had broken fingers and that recovery was total
and worth the hard work. I am not sure yours is quite the same. Depends what the medical advice is
from a specialist rather than a GP.
[/quote] I have taken all sorts of advice. I was told by the specialist nurse that there will be pain, but it will be mainly from the stiffness. I can tell from experience the difference between stretching to much pain, and stiffness pain They stiffness pain hurts like hell, but there is no pain when i stop . It is getting easier. Who would have thought learning bass could be theraputic

[Coilte]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1411290528' post='2558094']
I can tell from experience the difference between stretching to much pain, and stiffness pain They stiffness pain hurts like hell, but there is no pain when i stop .
[/quote]


I'd be very careful and wary about [i]any[/i] pain, as this is the body's way of telling you that something is not right. Apart from the kind of burning sensation often experienced after exertion, playing the bass should never be a painful experience, and you should never play through it.

If you dont do so already, before a practice session on the bass, warm up with some [i]gentle[/i] stretches.

I realise it can be frustrating not to be physically able to play as you want to, but not heeding the body's alarm signals can make things worse in the long term.

It is not my intention to be alarmist or to come across as preaching, so sorry if it seems like that.

[timmo]

[quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1411294433' post='2558142']
I'd be very careful and wary about [i]any[/i] pain, as this is the body's way of telling you that something is not right. Apart from the kind of burning sensation often experienced after exertion, playing the bass should never be a painful experience, and you should never play through it.

If you dont do so already, before a practice session on the bass, warm up with some [i]gentle[/i] stretches.

I realise it can be frustrating not to be physically able to play as you want to, but not heeding the body's alarm signals can make things worse in the long term.

It is not my intention to be alarmist or to come across as preaching, so sorry if it seems like that.
[/quote] I appreciate your concern and don`t find you preaching at all. Any advice is really great. It may sound like i am putting my wrist in a vice and trying to force it, but nothing like that. It isn`t tendon pain, just from the wrist that hasn`t moved sideways for 10 years or so. I can be doing my scales with stretches and suddenly the wrist gives a little crack very occasionally. Maybe once a week it happens. The wrist then gets minutely better with less pain. I realise it will never get much better, but a little bit will help tremendously.

Edited September 21, 2014 by timmo

[Coilte]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1411295424' post='2558155']
I appreciate your concern and don`t find you preaching at all. Any advice is really great. It may sound like i am putting my wrist in a vice and trying to force it, but nothing like that. It isn`t tendon pain, just from the wrist that hasn`t moved sideways for 10 years or so. I can be doing my scales with stretches and suddenly the wrist gives a little crack very occasionally. Maybe once a week it happens. The wrist then gets minutely better with less pain. I realise it will never get much better, but a little bit will help tremendously.
[/quote]


You are obviously well up on what to do for the best and what to avoid. That is the main thing.

[steve-bbb]

why do you want to stretch your fingers? i swear if we had twelve fingers on each hand you would get people arguing that you should keep your hand fixed in one position to play one whole octave

looking at my own style the wrist is fairly 'fixed' in position, but not inflexible, and to compensate for not being either able or wishing to play one finger per fret down the low end, i prefer to slide my whole hand in position to make the fingers fit the frets (thus the movement is accomodated by allowing shoulder/elbow to move freely)

the frets dont move but your arm does! - take your fingers to the frets, not the other way round, it's a lot less hassle

Edited September 21, 2014 by steve-bbb

[timmo]

[quote name='steve-bbb' timestamp='1411296714' post='2558171']
why do you want to stretch your fingers? i swear if we had twelve fingers on each hand you would get people arguing that you should keep your hand fixed in one position to play one whole octave



[/quote] Who knows. Just what my bass tutors tell me to try

[steve-bbb]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1411298013' post='2558182']
Who knows. Just what my bass tutors tell me to try
[/quote]


aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarggggggggggggggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[Coilte]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1411298013' post='2558182']
Who knows. Just what my bass tutors tell me to try
[/quote]

If what a bass tutor advises, causes physical pain or discomfort, then it is OK to [i]diplomatically [/i]tell them so.

Everyone is different and there are no "one size fits all" rules. Any teacher worth his salt will know this.

[Doddy]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1411298013' post='2558182']
Who knows. Just what my bass tutors tell me to try
[/quote]
Don't try to forcefully stretch your fingers. I'd recommend playing one finger per fret when you get up to around the fifth fret, but
even then there is no problem playing over three frets if that is more comfortable. In the lower positions there is no reason to
stretch that far.Play over a three fret range and use your thumb to pivot your hand. Also, if you are playing something like a major scale there is no need to stretch because you can play a lot of them using open strings. Only changebto a four fret stretch when it is
comfortable for your hand.