Grangur Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 Do you mean "go for it"... find another band? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary mac Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 Got to commend you on sending in the lovely Mrs. G to infiltrate the WAGS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 [quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1412982804' post='2573953'] I've just got home from a band practice. Mrs G came along too. She was in the kitchen chatting with the other wives. Its amazing what she learned. Apparently the other guys have all known each other for years. Played for years too, but nobody in the band has EVER gigged ever, with anybody. So we're all total noobs at gigging. So when they talk about DIing everything and mic-ing up my cab, they are simply BSing... interesting. (Or scary) [/quote] There is always a lot of BS about bands, you just have to know who can live up to it. I never mind ego..upto a point, if the guy delivers. If someone knows they are good, then they know... but that doesn't mean you have to be a dick about it. You'll find out what guys and have read about and what they know. A good strong opinion can be good... but if they can't reference that then you could be heading for a blind alley. I think you need to have them know that you are all in the same boat as giggers, and so until someone prooves they know what is what..as opposed to reading about it a lot..then no one has the final say. You are going to have to work together.... and also expect to fall over on a few basics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 [quote name='discreet' timestamp='1412986780' post='2573981'] Might still be useful from the 'gaining experience' point of view. But you'll only be gaining experience of rehearsing, by the look. This kind of thing is a lot more widespread that you'd think. Musicians are right up there in the delusion stakes, along with politicians and clinical lycanthropists. [/quote] Agree...as in what other options have you got..and you may well learn something..or not, but both can be useful. You could probably find the delusionals out every week at your popular gigs. That in itself isn't a crime, as at least they are out there trying..as opposed to never getting out there, ever. Varying degrees of 'delusion' is what seperates everyone.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainbass Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 If you do decide to go for another band, then at least it won't be your first band ever, and that can make a big sub-concious difference to your confidence when going for an audition. Which is just one valuable thing you have picked up from this experience! As others have said, you also have experience from listening to the others (and I would say it is clear that you have good skills in this area, from what you have said about the way the band plays, so that is very transferable). It depends what you want out of a band - some people (your current band members) are clearly happy with a rehearsal band. If you want to play live, this outfit won't get you there. If you don't want that, no problem. Also, I'm curious about your level of skill on the bass - how long have you been playing the bass? How do you feel about your skill level? As a 57 year old bass player myself, I know that there are bands and gigs out there (not fame and wealth, but you can't have it all!). I'm playing in more projects now then ever before. Main thing is, have fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 [quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1413009137' post='2574024'] Thanks. Good luck to you too. In fairness, they/we play a lot of 12 bar blues rock n roll numbers. This in some way makes playing easy. Yet it also flags up a lack of knowledge of the genre when I keep finding they end the song without ending a bar, ket alone finishing the 12bar sequence. I think my best here is keep playing with them, but watch out for another band. For my part, I feel right now I struggle keeping on track following the chord changes when I'm playing whilst reading the lyrics to see when the change comes. My frustration is knowing that what we're doing is 12 bar blues, but they've designed the chord changes not following a 12bar sequence. [/quote] Get them to write out a chord bar chart, so you count the changes. That way they can't change anything..as you have the song template. and you are maybe then teaching them a discipline as well.... plus chords chart reading is always useful to have with new songs and bands anyway. 12 bars are so called for a reason.... and rock n roll endings always end at the end of the sequence... unless you really know what you are doing. It is a standard thing with muso's and bands so why you want to mess with it, I don't know...especially if the alternative version is a train wreck..?? I mean, why..??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 A bit more about myself: I have to say I don't have a massive amount of time to rehearse, due to work commitments. I'm 55 and been playing for 5 years, although most of my practice, so far, has been on theory, reading and playing from scores. I'm new to playing with others. I've also not spent much time playing to CDs either. What I'm looking for: I'd like to gig small venues. I'd like to be in a band of like-minded folk and have fun. I do believe, though, that a lot of time can be saved and the performance can be enhanced by the folk in the band all knowing a bit about the theory behind what they're playing. Here are 2 examples of the chord sheets we're playing to: [url="https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=88014765C749B87!271&authkey=!AJc3IgbimhhQLJY&ithint=file%2cdoc"]Peaceful Easy Feeling[/url] [url="https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=88014765C749B87!272&authkey=!ACOV6566igC8Gsk&ithint=file%2cdoc"]Wonderful Tonight[/url] I'd be interested to hear what others think of the sheets. Wonderful Tonight is an interesting arrangement. The Clapton part is played by the Keys. The bass line is played by the guitarist and I'm asked to play routes on the chord changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 (edited) [quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1413014401' post='2574078'] Varying degrees of 'delusion' is what separates everyone. [/quote] So true. My spirit guide, Chief Omnipomptu, told me that. Edited October 11, 2014 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 1st thing... I hate 'charts' like that. I am not interested in playing to words so it means next to nothing in musical terms, IMO. Write it out properly, with the chord in a bar and that way you can write half bars if you need to. You have the beat/tempo and you are playing that chord for the lenght of the bar..and if you need to, you sub-divide the bar with correct musical notation. A full bar could be written | C \ \ \ | Am\ \ \| F \G\ | G \ \ \ | Not sure what they hope to achieve by playing Wonderful tonight like that, tbh.. I guess you'd have to hear it, but that in itself suggests to me that these guys will never get out of just goofing around in rehearsal... Maybe, that is the band in a nutshell with that type of thinking ...??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 (edited) [size=4][quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1413016762' post='2574123']...Wonderful Tonight is an interesting arrangement. The Clapton part is played by the Keys. The bass line is played by the guitarist and I'm asked to play routes on the chord changes. [/quote] Interesting indeed. There are 3 guitar parts in there, plus 2 keys (piano and organ...). Who's playing the missing parts then, eh..? Rearrangements are fine , of course, if they work, but I'd have doubts about that one. +1 for the format. Not so bad (read 'ropey'...) for a singist, but not much help for anyone else. Who writes 'em out like that..? You..? The singist..? The keys..?[/size] Edited October 11, 2014 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 (edited) [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1413018217' post='2574156'] [size=4] Interesting indeed. There are 3 guitar parts in there, plus 2 keys (piano and organ...). Who's playing the missing parts then, eh..? Rearrangements are fine , of course, if they work, but I'd have doubts about that one. +1 for the format. Not so bad (read 'ropey'...) for a singist, but not much help for anyone else. Who writes 'em out like that..? You..? The singist..? The keys..?[/size] [/quote] Many thanks for all the input Guys. You're great. In response to Dad; it did cross my mind for me to work out playing the noodly-doodly organ part, but that would sound wild on the bass. I recon the simple fact is that the whole thing is ego-fest for the keys and guitar. Its all out for me to get a new gig, or resign myself to being a prop in their wet-dream. Thanks JTUK for the advice on the chord sheets. I think I'll do that, to keep the experience going while looking. Edited October 11, 2014 by Grangur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 Ok... just to expend the chord chart idea. The / is a crotchet/qtr beat so you are | C 2,3,4 | on a count in a 4/4 bar If you sub-divide or need a rest beat, then you use musical notation like quavers/rests etc etc to determine that. The only person who writes out a 'chart' like in your examples are singers who may play a gtr/keys and they mark the changes for their vocal purposes. For players, they have totally disposed of the bars..which rather defeats the point. And if ever drummers worked from those...well, they just wouldn't... You can do a lot of gigs without reading if you have decent chord charts ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 I think you should stay. You are learning loads. Maybe not loads about playing bass but you're learning about being in a band. You've been able to start an interesing thread with some great points and input from experienced band bass players and whether this is the band that see's you do your first gig are not you can now say "I am the bass player in a band". well done you. By all means keep looking for the next step but you have certainly taken the first step and have obvioulsly gained from it. good luck Les Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 Isn't playing songs in a different style just part of the fun? Back in the 60s, few of the artistes wrote their own songs, they just played other people's giving them a bit of a spin to their own style. We just added one song to our set list that the Beachboys did, but here in England, it's a Cliff Richard song - it has a new bit in the middle and is quite different style wise, and it's hard to unlearn a song you know so well, but it's just part of the job. If you like being in the band - stay in the band and grow a bit. Have fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubsonicSimpleton Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 Before you throw in the towel, how about trying getting them to play a new song, but you provide the charts - the lyrics with chords arrangements you linked look like the sh*te you will find on the online guitar tab websites. It is quite possible that these guys haven't played with a proper chart before, they might rise to the challenge and respond positively, in which case it might be possible to approach a couple of songs like this and then get them out to a jam night to break the gigging duck. Sounds to me like you have come to a situation where several musicians have been playing without a certain instrument, or with someone incompetant and they have adjusted their approach to compensate - I would expect them to continue to play the music they already know the same way they have been doing, so to really see whether they can accomodate you properly within the band, you need to see what happens when you all learn something fresh and you are an integral part of the process from the beginning. Just be smart about what you suggest they try - if you pick songs by artists they like, preferably with obvious key & guitar parts that will be fun for them to play and fairly easy for them to learn you are much more likely to be successful, anything that would take them outside their comfort zone will likely meet resistance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 (edited) I love the great thoughts here. Subsonic, I like your thinking. I might need to adapt this thinking a bit. I've been told they already have a "pad" of over 400 songs. So they're not wanting to learn any new ones. What I do have, this week, is the task of going away and working on my bass lines for a 2 track medally of "Promised Land" and "Route 66". This could be a great chance for me to bring in a proper chord chart. Otherwise, so far the play list I know about is: Addicted to Love - Robert Palmer Baby I Love You - The Ramones Baby, Baby, Baby - Original Bad Moon Rising - Creedence Clearwater Revival Brown Eyed Girl - Van Morrison Burning Love - Elvis Presley Cotton Fields - Creedence Clearwater Revival Crocodile Rock - Elton John Da Doo Ron Ron - The Crystals Do Ya Wanna Dance? - Cliff Richard I Bet Your Heart - Original I Can See Clearly Now - Johnny Nash I Only Want to Be With You - Dusty Springfield I Saw Her Standing There - The Beatles I'm a Believer - The Monkeys Johnny B Goode - Chuck Berry Let's Dance - Chris Montez Let's Twist Again - Chubby Checker Manic Monday - The Bangles Mustang Sally - The Commitments Nutbush City Limits - Tina Turner Peaceful Easy Feeling - The Eagles Promised Land - Chuck Berry Proud Mary - Creedence Clearwater Revival Roll Over Beethoven - Chuck Berry Route 66 - Chuck Berry Silver Threads and Golden Needles - Linda Ronstadt Simply The Best - Tina Turner Singing The Blues - Guy Mitchell Spirit In The Sky - Norman Greenbaum Then He Kissed Me - The Crystals Up On The Roof - The Drifters Walk In The Room - The Searchers Walk Of Life - Dire Straits Wild Side Of Life - Status Quo Wonderful Tonight Eric Clapton You're No Good - Swingin Blue Jeans Edited October 11, 2014 by Grangur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquipment Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Get fuzz pedals and start playing DOOM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davehux Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 The hardest part of being in a band is learning not to punch the guitard. Once you've got that nailed, playing the tunes is the easy bit. If you're enjoying it, and learning about band dynamics, stick with it. Otherwise, Join My Band, is your next port of call Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 [quote name='tonyquipment' timestamp='1413104216' post='2574854'] Get fuzz pedals and start playing DOOM [/quote] [quote name='davehux' timestamp='1413150139' post='2575362'] The hardest part of being in a band is learning not to punch the guitard. [/quote] This is gold!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted October 12, 2014 Author Share Posted October 12, 2014 The guitard worries me less than the keys guy. He plays everyone's parts all the time. So IMHO our sound is simply too busy. I recon I should keep an eye on JMB anyway. I'd hate to miss out on an opportunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 [quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1413151159' post='2575374'] IMHO our sound is simply too busy. [/quote] If this is your first band and you think it sounds too busy, then it must be REALLY, REALLY busy!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted October 12, 2014 Author Share Posted October 12, 2014 [quote name='discreet' timestamp='1413151233' post='2575376'] If this is your first band and you think it sounds too busy, then it must be REALLY, REALLY busy!! [/quote] LOL. I am used to listening to gigs and appreciate that the best ones have a clarity to the sound where the air isn't filled with noise ALL the time. They're talking about filming a rehearsal. So it will be interesting to watch it back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoonBassAlpha Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 [quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1413153183' post='2575394'] LOL. I am used to listening to gigs and appreciate that the best ones have a clarity to the sound where the air isn't filled with noise ALL the time. They're talking about filming a rehearsal. So it will be interesting to watch it back. [/quote] ooh yeah! post it up here for critique by the good folks of BassChat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) [quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1413153183' post='2575394'] They're talking about filming a rehearsal. So it will be interesting to watch it back. [/quote] Yes! It's good to record rehearsals anyway. Nothing brings home crap playing like evidence! Edited October 13, 2014 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted December 22, 2014 Author Share Posted December 22, 2014 [quote name='MoonBassAlpha' timestamp='1413182129' post='2575471'] ooh yeah! post it up here for critique by the good folks of BassChat! [/quote] Just to update those who're following this thread; I quit that band. We were having a rehearsal and in one of the numbers I lost the groove and paused to listen and get back in. I noticed that ALL the bass line was being played by the keys. "Why bother", thinks I. "All they need is to amplify the keys more and I'm redundant". Later in the rehearsal the keys-player/MD was telling the drummer to adjust the beat to hit the right syllable in a vocal line. Excuse me, but that's not right, is it? IMHO the beat is the pulse. It goes on regardless and everything fits round the beat; or so I thought. So the conclusion I came to was these plonkers don't know how music works. Next day or so I got and email asking how I thought the rehearsal went. I replied with my resignation. About 2 months later they're still advertising for a bass player. I'm still looking for a new band, but I'm also working on my technique and building repertoire. Thanks for your interest and advice guys. Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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