Help a moron understand day.........mark bass amp and cabs

[donslow]

Hey all, have just bought a new (new to me anyway) used mark bass little mark II and am hankering for some new cabs (reasons explained below) and I have some questions to help me understand my new head

I currently own 2 ashdown mag cabs, a 2x10 and a 1x15, both 8ohms, both 250w

The manual says the lmII puts out 300w at 8ohms and 500w at 4ohms

Now I kind of (kind of) get this as I've read about impedance in other threads, my questions are these

1) if I use the lmII with one cab, potentially the amp is running 50w more than the cabinet allows so will this damage my cab? Or does the volume need to be all the way up to get to 300w?! (I haven't used my amp with any of these yet just in case.......)

2) the amp has two speaker outputs, what is the difference between connecting two cabs that are daisy chained to one output and plugging each cabinet into its own output from the amp (does this make sense?)

3) in searching for new cabs I'm looking at a 4x10 and a 1x15 so so I could use one or the other or both at the same time should I ever play Wembley hahaha should I be looking at 8ohms each rated at minimum 300w each or am I missing a probably obvious point?!

4) anyone know how well a 4x10 and 1x15 is suited to this head?!

Think that's all, many many thanks in advance for any help or advice

[xgsjx]

Good choice of amp.

1. Ignore the watts. If you're planning on playing as loud as you can, use your ears & not some irrelevant figures.

2. There is no difference on how you connect. Do what you prefer.

3. You're missing an obvious point. Find a cab that you like the sound of & if you need more volume for big venues, buy a 2nd identical cab.

4. They're not. The only time a 4x10 & 1x15 are suited to any head is when it's Wembley or similar & the PA & foldback are doing all the work, with the rig just being for show.

[dincz]

1) If you use all of the available power, you could damage the cab but you should hear it complaining before the damage is done. "All the way up" - you won't know when it's all the way up. You could get max power with a high output bass or high EQ settings even if the volume control is not set to max.

2) No difference.

3) With both 8 ohms, each cab could get 250W but the 4x10 will divide the 250W between 4 drivers. The single 15 will get the whole 250W so will be the weak link.

4) As well as problems of power distribution, a 4x10 and 1x15 are not an ideal combination for reasons mentioned regularly here.

[chris_b]

If you run the amp flat out, then you might damage the 250 watt cab, but I never had my LM2 over half and it was loud enough for me. If you want more volume don't turn it up just add the second cab.

I always daisy chain cabs but you can do either.

Why do you need new cabs? The ones you have might sound great. Play this rig for awhile before you look to change it.

If you buy good cabs then you don't need a 15 for the low end. That might have been the case 30 years ago when bass cabs generally weren't as well designed, but you'll get more bass out of a modern 410 than any 15.

[JTUK]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1414051785' post='2585101']
If you run the amp flat out, then you might damage the 250 watt cab, but I never had my LM2 over half and it was loud enough for me. If you want more volume don't turn it up just add the second cab.

I always daisy chain cabs but you can do either.

Why do you need new cabs? The ones you have might sound great. Play this rig for awhile before you look to change it.

If you buy good cabs then you don't need a 15 for the low end. That might have been the case 30 years ago when bass cabs generally weren't as well designed, but you'll get more bass out of a modern 410 than any 15.
[/quote]

This... except I don't daisy chain the cabs.

I don't think this is the amp to be thinking about running 500w but neither do I think you'll need more than a 410 or 212 with it.
Having said that... a modular 2x112 would be a good way to go as that upscales perfectly and it is an easier carry.
An expensive was to do it mind, possibly, but worth it.

If you have designs on a theatrical bass stack... the amp wont work there...

[Guest monsterthompson]

The master volume isn't a linear control. You may have 99% of the wattage on tap available with the master at noon. Even with a 300w head driving a 300w rated cab, you can still damage the cab if you are running a strong signal (hot pickup, strong plucking, gain device in the signal chain, etc.). Listen for speaker distortion. If it is getting flubby and farty, you are killing the speaker. As for cab, there are some folks who love the mix n match of woofer size, and there are those who argue it isn't the best route. I've tried mixing and matching drivers before and it is a gamble. Find a cab that works and then get a second one. The current range of 12" driver cabs are great for modular rigs. Often a 212 is enough for most settings, so two single 12" cabs is a good option. For louder settings, two 212 cabs should get the job done, and still be pretty easy to load.

[Lozz196]

I prefer the 2 of the same cab option. If I had to mix speaker sizes it would be 210 & 115 - done it before and it worked fine - but ideally find a cab you like, get two of the same, get twice the amount of sound you already liked. As said, the Little Marks are loud amps - my band is a loud punk band and I never need mine on more than 4 on master volume, and that`s with gain set at noon, rather than on the just clipping setting which for my bass is around 7 or 8.

[donslow]

Thank you firstly for all of the input and help so far

Should've mentioned before for what it's worth, I'm playing a vm squier precision bass with upgraded pickups (fender original 62 reissue whatsits) upgraded cloth wiring and cts pots, upgraded bridge and machine heads and play exclusively with fingers

Reading through all the comments I'm getting the following

No need for anything as huge as a 4x10 and a 1x15 (as I suspected really but just had a gas attack for something different)

Daisy chaining is fine but some would prefer using two outputs for two cabs, I need to ask probably the most ridiculous question now (just for curiosity purposes) if daisy chaining, how do I / my amp know that I'm getting more than the 8ohm 300w if their daisy chained

Theoretically, with two 8ohm 250w cabs like I have, I SHOULDNT do any damage to the cabs if my amp is putting out 600w (100w more than the can specs) unless I'm running everything on full whack, which, as I understand it, with the lmII I probably will never have to do?!

Just wondering, would selling/trading my existing cabs for a different 2x10 and 1x15 but higher rated eg 8ohms 300w each (unless for a better brand than ashdown) be a waste of time and money

Long story short, from what I can tell,

the two 8ohm 250w cabs I have, either on their own or together will/should be absolutely fine and SHOULDNT damage unless really pushing my amp

A 2x10 and a 1x15 is a reasonable combination for a lmII and I SHOULDNT need anything more

Either daisy chaining or using separate outputs (which I may well do) is fine

Anyone here own a lmII? What speaker configurations do you use with yours? How do you find what you use?


I think that's everything, many thanks again for all your comments, please, do keep it coming

[donslow]

I'm thinking about adding a catalnbread or tech 21 vt di type pedal for a bit of dirt if I need it, would a pedal like this make any difference to how much power is being pushed to the cabs

Again, would they damage the speakers?! I ask as budget for the foreseeable won't allow new cabs unless I trade so am wondering if these cabs will do me a good turn until such a time I can get new ones (if I decide to)

Apologies if I've massively confused anyone as I certainly have done to myself

Many thanks again

[bonzodog]

I would stick with your current set up as it will work fine. Don't pay too much attention to the watts as different manufacturers state different watt ratings. Just make sure you keep the ohm's correct which you are doing by having 2 x 8ohm cabs into an amp that can handle 4ohms. The pedal will not damage the amp or cabs in anyway so just have a play around to get the sound you want.
As has been said before if you turn the amp up full, which you won't, thats the only time you will damage your gear and you will hear it doing so before any damage is done.
I agree its a minefield though as it took me a while to get my head round ohms, watts and decibels

[Dad3353]

The 2 o/ps on the amp, and the 2 sockets on the cabs are all wired in parallel so, electrically, the amp won't 'know' whether you've used its o/ps or daisy-chained. Use whichever configuration you find most convenient; to the amp there is no difference at all.

[Lozz196]

I use the LMIII which as far as I know is much the same as the II, but with a DI Level control on it. I put it through a Markbass 212. I also use an LMIII in the CMD121P (112) combo and have a n NY121 ext cab. With both set-ups I never need the volume on more than 4, and my band is loud/fast. With your 210/115 I can`t see you not being loud enough, without pushing the amp.

Through either of these set ups I have a VT DI as my main sound. So long as you`re careful there should be no problems - I always have the volume level on mine set to the same volume that the amp is running at, so no boost when it`s switched on. Because if you have full blend on the VT DI, having volume on full would be a really loud difference.

[donslow]

Thank you ever so much for all your help you lovely lovely knowledgable people

Think it's a sure bet that I'm best off sticking with my current cab setup without fear of damaging anything which, in the process has saved me a bit of time, effort and probably, money I don't realistically have hahaha

Always with the questions, if looking at pedals for dirt/tone shaping etc have been looking at the vt di and the catalinbread sft and/or formula 5f6

Basically something to give me a bit of variation in tone (maybe a little more vintage/old school) and a bit of dirt if I ever wanted it........has anyone got any recommendations out of the above 3 or for something I might be missing?!

[xgsjx]

Enjoy your rig.
Try both your cabs on their own & see if you prefer one over the other (place your 2x10 vertically, makes it higher & improves the audio spread). You might even find the one cab is loud enough on its own.

We might see you in the fx section soon.

[chris_b]

In my opinion you have moved up a rung with the new amp, so you should be checking out better cabs.

Are you looking at a 410 and 115 for volume, tone or looks? More volume doesn't always get you heard on stage, but better tone and definition will.

With my LM2 I used a Mesa Boogie EV 115, 2 Aguilar GS112's and then an Epifani UL410, all of which went pretty loud while making a great sound.

Now I'm using a 700 watt 212 cab that will go much louder and (IMO) sound a lot better than your current 2 cab rig. I'd look at using smaller, better designed cabs with your new amp.

[b7l4s]

My 2p, fwiw... I always prefer not to daisy chain. I think I read somewhere that if you do then the cable between the amp and the first cab is carrying all of the power, rather than when using two outputs each is carry half. I think (and am prepared to be put straight) that this means you could get more heat in the cable with the daisy chain option, and also that you have introduced a single point of failure to the signal path to both cabs.

Of course, a lot of people do daisy chain, and you don't hear loads of people telling you not to - so it is probably academic in reality, but for my setup (a pair of 1x12s stacked vertically under a head) it is no bother to use both outputs so I just choose to go the non-daisy chain route.