Weststarx Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 (edited) Hi Guys, Its something I've always wanted to ask... Often I will see a bass dated from the above times for sale and people will be asking for thousands for them and people will pay it. To me I find it very confusing why someone would want to pay such a ridiculous price for something thats over 30/40/50 years old! It confuses me even more when something like an 70/80s Squire appears and they are going for a price close of what you could pay for a brand new USA Fender!! Is it purely down to the fact that its a rare collectable in some peoples minds? and with guitar being so old and so expensive, after you've brought it do you even have the balls to play it live? If not whats the point in having it in the first place? [u]This is how I see it in my head...[/u] Noone would buy a car thats 50 years old and pay double/triple what it was worth new because of the fact that as things get old they break. Surely a bass would be the same? Then say you knew this and you change the electrics in the bass surely you've just paid thousands of pounds for what basically is two old pieces of wood bolted together? I just dont get it!! Edited October 27, 2014 by Weststarx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I'd take cover if I were you, pal! Truckstop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ead Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I would gently refer you to car prices of some of our venerable sports cars (not even the more exotic ones)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 (edited) Some people think that vintage instruments sound better, for whatever reason. They will point to classic recordings made in the 60s and 70s as proof. However, at that time the instruments were new, or very recent, so... For my own part I like vintage instruments from an aesthetic point of view and as collectibles. Though it it telling that I don't currently own any vintage instruments. Apart from a 1983 SB-2, which I bought for its sound and playability more than anything else. And I'm pretty sure it would have sounded and played like it does now in 1983, so... Oh wait, I've got a Hayman 4040, too. That's pretty amazing. But there's no modern equivalent (apart from perhaps a Wal), so... I'm totally 50-50 about the whole thing. I completely understand where everyone's coming from. Isn't that nice? And I would ask you Mr Starx (if indeed that [i]is [/i]your real name), have you ever played a vintage instrument yourself?? Edited October 27, 2014 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick's Fine '52 Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 [quote name='Weststarx' timestamp='1414416263' post='2589029'] Hi Guys, Its something I've always wanted to ask... Often I will see a bass dated from the above times for sale and people will be asking for thousands for them and people will pay it. To me I find it very confusing why someone would want to pay such a ridiculous price for something thats over 30/40/50 years old! It confuses me even more when something like an 70/80s Squire appears and they are going for a price close of what you could pay for a brand new USA Fender!! Is it purely down to the fact that its a rare collectable in some peoples minds? and with guitar being so old and so expensive, after you've brought it do you even have the balls to play it live? If not whats the point in having it in the first place? [u]This is how I see it in my head...[/u] Noone would buy a car thats 50 years old and pay double/triple what it was worth new because of the fact that as things get old they break. Surely a bass would be the same? Then say you knew this and you change the electrics in the bass surely you've just paid thousands of pounds for what basically is two old pieces of wood bolted together? I just dont get it!! [/quote] in simple terms, you just have to compare with other vintage items and/or antiques, like cars, furniture or art. Many of the so called collectibles now, were quite simple items when originally made, but due to their scarcity now, especially in goodcondition, they can command big prices by players and collectors alike. Whilst, the same with cars, you can buy a new equivelent, many people prefer the originals, and the original tone and feel of many old instruments, simply hasnt yet been replicated, the same is the case with many other vintage collectibles. and despite what you say, people do pay double and triple the cost of a new car, for a nice 50 year old one, they always have done. each to their own and all that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiOgon Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 See - a 70's Squier is like rocking horse poo I dunno about the rest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
molan Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 [quote name='Weststarx' timestamp='1414416263' post='2589029'] Noone would buy a car thats 50 years old and pay double/triple what it was worth new because of the fact that as things get old they break. I just dont get it!! [/quote] I used to own a 1958 Oldsmobile that was imported into the UK at £32,500. I kept it a few years and eventually sold it back to the dealer who promptly sold it to someone in Cannes for even more money. One of the big attractions was that it was almost completely original except for obvious things like tyres and break pads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 Friend of mine had a 62' P Bass... and he stripped off the paint as so many other did, down t bare wood. Apart from that, it was all original but I played it and didn't really like it as not a fan of P-Basses in general. We both wonder what it would be worth now with and without paint.. I had a mid 70's Jazz bass which was a pile of poo... and I'd say that would fetch around £1400-1500 in the right market. As for old gtrs being a working man's tool, you could pay 15 x weekly salary to get an average Fender so they weren't really for the masses, IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weststarx Posted October 27, 2014 Author Share Posted October 27, 2014 [quote name='Truckstop' timestamp='1414416494' post='2589034'] I'd take cover if I were you, pal! Truckstop [/quote] I dont want this to come across as me saying people who do buy these guitars are wrong, I'm generally interested in the reasons behind it. For example whether its been brought as an investment or for the tone etc like people have mentioned. Just in case I'm missing something! [quote name='discreet' timestamp='1414417316' post='2589046'] And I would ask you Mr Starx (if indeed that [i]is [/i]your real name), have you ever played a vintage instrument yourself?? [/quote] Never! The price tags have done their job scaring me off! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I have bought, sold and collected a very silly number of vintage basses (especially given that I'm neither an expert nor a pro trader!). I started by collecting vintage Hofners, at the time when people thought they were badly-made and you could get them cheap. And I did. The first bass I ever bought for myself was a Hofner 1963 Re-Issue, new, from Macaris on Charing Cross Road. It was lovely, but it had (by definition) no history. I sold it and started buying Hofners from the late 50s / early 60s. They had issues of course, which needed fixing of course, but there was a direct, physical connection to the early days of rock'n'roll because they were there. I suppose it helps that I was there too, wearing shorts and sandals and wondering where the next ice lolly was coming from. For me, that makes a huge difference. Many basses later I bought a 1965 Precision in CAR. It represents (rightly or wrongly) the "sound in my head" when I think of bass. I grew up absorbing the sound of the 60's Precision, without (at the time) knowing what 'Fender' meant, or 'Precision'. Every time I play that bass, it nails it. It absolutely hits the spot. I'm well aware that a significant part of this is because I know that it's a '65 P rather than because it actually sounds better than a modern bass, but it doesn't matter. It does it for me. Why the silly prices? Because there are loads of other people out there who feel the same as me. Far more than there are all-original 1965 Precisions ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 (edited) [quote name='Weststarx' timestamp='1414416263' post='2589029'] ...I just dont get it!!... [/quote] So it seems. Think about something else. Edited October 27, 2014 by chris_b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 Never owned a vintage bass but isn't there a certain amount of selection, in that those that have survived the test of time are probably the better examples of the day and many of the crap ones long since thrown in a skip? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamdenRob Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 What happens to the ones that don't survive? unless people are actually destroying them surely many of the older ones are still around? I guess they must have made less of them in the earlier days... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul S Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 Earlier in the year I decided I wanted to buy a quality Precision bass for under £1000. My two criteria were to buy one that might increase in value but also that I could use as a gigging bass. So for me it had to be under 9lbs with a slim neck. I also have a bit of a thing for mid 80s MIJ instruments. An 82 Squier 52 Re-issue model in tobacco burst JV0 series with large Fender Logo became available on here and it just ticked all the right boxes. It is superb in every respect and I consider it to be money well spent. I am sure if i walked into a shop with £1000 I might be able to buy an equally superb brand new bass, but I just like the idea of having an older one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inthedoghouse Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 [quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1414421304' post='2589118'] So it seems. Think about something else. [/quote] Lol, spot on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inthedoghouse Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I recommend this book http://www.amazon.com/GAS-Living-Guitar-Acquisition-Syndrome/dp/1411661796 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubsonicSimpleton Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 The thing that fascinates me about vintage instruments is how come the supply seems to become more abundant with the passage of time. [quote] [i]“This is a thoroughly SPECTACULAR [/i](note the capitals)[i] late 1960s Fender Stratocaster, with ALL ORIGINAL PARTS AND FINSH! The reason there’s about four years’ difference in the dates of the parts is that Hendrix’s road manager reserved the guitar before it was fully built. To clear an inventory at the factory, the neck was then shipped without the rest of the guitar – erroneously to a chimney sweep who wishes his name to be kept out of this. The chimney sweep used the neck to clean several chimneys, hence it being so noticeably soiled. When the mistake in shipping was dicovered, Fender recalled the neck, and assembled the complete guitar, as planned. Seeing that the neck was battered to crap, Hendrix’s road manager then cancelled the order. The complete guitar, with its parts from four different years, trashed neck, and brand spanking new body with FACTORY ORIGINAL FINISH, was then shipped to a store, who locked the instrument in a vault.[/i] [i]In 1978, Leo Fender himself was shown the guitar. It is not clear why Leo would have asked to see a guitar whose neck had been used to sweep a chimney, but we have verified this story with several top secret but reliable sources, and the fact is that he did. Upon plugging in the guitar, Leo did not find the sound to meet with his usual standards of perfection, so he personally rewound the pickups on the spot. This explains why the pickups are wound with late ‘70s coil wire.[/i] [i]You can be assured that this guitar is an ALL ORIGINAL late ‘60s Fender Stratocaster, except for the pickup rewind, which was done by Leo Fender himself, and accordingly adds another five grand to the price. We will accept £30,000 for this sensational, all original Stratocaster. Direct bank transfer or cash only, no returns.”[/i] [i][/quote][/i] quoted from [url="http://planetbotch.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/the-late-1960s-fender-stratocaster.html"]here[/url] Always cracks me up to see similar type tales on ebay/gumtree ads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 [quote name='SubsonicSimpleton' timestamp='1414424375' post='2589148'] The thing that fascinates me about vintage instruments is how come the supply seems to become more abundant with the passage of time. [/quote] Only to certain instruments, though. I used to know one of the better fakers in Denmark Street. His work was simply awesome. Even with him standing next to me showing how he'd aged certain bits, it still looked like a '54 Strat to me. And that's one of the biggest giveaways. He reckoned there was far more interest in any '54 Strat than in a '56 or a '58 (I have no idea why) so all of his fakes were '54 Strats. In case you're wondering, his speciality was Sonic Blue with heavy nicotine staining ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmjos Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 The thing for me about vintage basses is to remember that when you by a 60's instrument you are within spitting distance of the very beginnings of modern music. The music of our generation was truly born out of the efforts of a tiny handful of inovators like Leo Fender (for one) who made something almost completely new. For me the Fender P & J basses are at the heart of that. Some people feel that way about Gibson or RIcks. These designs hit the nail on the head so firmly that their design remains almost unchanged. I guess being born in the early 60's I grew up with these instruments at the heart of my earliest musical memories. I'm lucky enough to have a vintage P and soon (all being well) a J. When you pick up a 50 year old instrument that has been crafted well, looked after for all its life and pick it up to play you feel something. Crank that old P up with the tone rolled off just a bit and it growls punk tones at you, play it further up the neck and even with the tone rolled all the way back you still get distinct clear warm notes. You will pay a lot of cash to get that in a new instrument, and all it will be is a facsimilie of the 'real thing'. I own old basses becuase they sound wonderful, they have lasted the journey, they will remain precious. They are the heritage of every line of this and every other bass blog. Its an honour to keep and look after one, even if though its taken most of my life before I could aford one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I have a 70s Precision, which I favour over any other of the (many) Precisions I`ve had. But it`s because of the sound that I favour it so highly. It`s dented, has some good original wear on it and looks great, also plays fantastic. Take away the sound and the playing, would be worth nothing to me no matter when it was made and how cool it looks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highfox Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 The 3 nicest basses, (feel, sound and looks wise) that I have ever owned just happen to be fairly old, a 70, 73 and 84. There is something in it imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertbass Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 (edited) I started playing in 1964 and used to own / play many of the instruments that are fetching fantastic sums of money now and without exception they ranged from just OK to out and out crap and it amazes me that people are paying such vast amounts for these instruments. I used to pay about £5 for them. I've seen and played many of the 70s copies that appeared and they also ranged from just OK to out and out crap. What truly amazes me is the Kay / Woolworths specials that appeared, total rubbish yet people are paying vast amounts of cash for them, amazing. I wish I'd of bought a few at the time, I'd be a rich man now! I couldn't afford my first Precision until 1972 and that was a load of rubbish as well. For information, it cost £220, 10% extra for left handed and it would have cost me another 10% to have a solid colour rather than sunburst, so sunburst it was. I did get to play a 68 Precision when I did some recording in the 70s and I have to admit that that was very nice, right handed though. Of course, all of the above is just my opinion. Edited October 27, 2014 by bertbass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Telebass Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 I'm with Westarx here. The vintage thing is ridiculous, and I'm ancient enough to have owned new what are now vintage pieces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary mac Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 [quote name='pmjos' timestamp='1414430186' post='2589198'] The thing for me about vintage basses is to remember that when you by a 60's instrument you are within spitting distance of the very beginnings of modern music. The music of our generation was truly born out of the efforts of a tiny handful of inovators like Leo Fender (for one) who made something almost completely new. For me the Fender P & J basses are at the heart of that. Some people feel that way about Gibson or RIcks. These designs hit the nail on the head so firmly that their design remains almost unchanged. I guess being born in the early 60's I grew up with these instruments at the heart of my earliest musical memories. I'm lucky enough to have a vintage P and soon (all being well) a J. When you pick up a 50 year old instrument that has been crafted well, looked after for all its life and pick it up to play you feel something. Crank that old P up with the tone rolled off just a bit and it growls punk tones at you, play it further up the neck and even with the tone rolled all the way back you still get distinct clear warm notes. You will pay a lot of cash to get that in a new instrument, and all it will be is a facsimilie of the 'real thing'. I own old basses becuase they sound wonderful, they have lasted the journey, they will remain precious. They are the heritage of every line of this and every other bass blog. Its an honour to keep and look after one, even if though its taken most of my life before I could aford one. [/quote] Nicely said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paultrader Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 I adore my 76 Fender P because I bought it in 1980 and it has been my constant companion for just about 35 years. I stopped taking it to gigs for a time because I thought I didn't want it to get any more damaged, or nicked - but then I asked myself who it's actually for - what's the point of keeping it in the cupboard? It sounds gorgeous, plays like a dream and feels like part of me. When I bought it, it cost a fair chunk of my income, but it's monetary value now is only of any significance if it stays in the cupboard. These old instruments are wonderful, but they should be played, not mothballed. In the classical world, instruments of much greater age and greater frailty are being gigged constantly. And if the house catches fire... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.