lowendgalore Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) Does anyone else find the bass mix in a live concert very disappointing a real lot of the time? Ive been to recently Jools Holland, Stereophonics, Robbie Williams and just a couple of weeks a go Wiked in the west end and all of these i found the bass in the mix less than satisfactory! Robbie Williams- very low in the mix, there was no definition at all and became very muddy at points Jools Holland- It was literally none existent in the mix, it was as if he was miming, i was so frustrated the whole night! Stereophonics- no definition, could be hear in quieter songs e.g. piano and bass but when the band was in it was gone Wiked- very low in mix, very hard to hear, very much a lack of low end in the tone.. sounded like a guitar when i actually could make it out, just generally couldn't make it out and had to really really listen for it! Also when I'm playing live and you know, there will be a Professional Sound Company doing sound with a stack of double 18's for subs worth probably £10k and i take out my in ears i literally year no bass I'm just like what? at gigs my dad has been at he will comment something like i could hear G on the 4th string and everything else it just wasn't there (makes me feel annoyed and that i could have just sat at home, as I'm sure you guys would feel the same) Also... a lot of kick drum in some of these cases.... maybe filling in for lack of bass?? Hmmmmmmm......Maybe I'm just extremely picky... but hey, lets hear some of your thoughts and experiences!! Edited November 24, 2014 by lowendgalore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Rearing it's ugly head again - my 21st century gripe - lack of bass definition! For a long while, I thought it was just me. Reassuring to know that others feel the same way - I can't fathom as to why bass has been reduced to a dull thump in so many cases. Musical mush! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowendgalore Posted November 24, 2014 Author Share Posted November 24, 2014 Good to hear someone else is in the same boat and its not just me!! It just absolutely pushes my buttons... i just don't know how these top engineers who are with these top bands who you would assume are the best in the business cannot hear this.. ?? Hmmm.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 It's not what the engineers what to hear though. They have to provide what the artist, audience or label want don't they? Doesn't everyone now want that sub going on with thumping kick drum? Just listen to the kids in their hot hatchs. I agree it's pretty poor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barkin Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 You're not alone. I rarely bother going to big, name gigs these days, as the sound (overall - not just bass) generally has me thinking "WTF..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowendgalore Posted November 24, 2014 Author Share Posted November 24, 2014 Pfff i am glad to hear that you guys are thinking the same! I was at Eric Clapton a few years a go, Willie Weeks was on bass, couldn't wait.... destroyed by no able to hear him at all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartelby Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 The last bunch of gigs I've been to (Loop, Godflesh, Goat and 2 Einstürzende Neubauten) the mix has been spot on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowendgalore Posted November 24, 2014 Author Share Posted November 24, 2014 Cool, always good to get another point of view! You found the bass spot on then? I await that day when i have that pleasure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 There was nothing wrong with Norm's bass mix when I saw The Blockheads last week Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madshadows Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Me and a mate saw THUNDER at the O2 London Brooklyn Bowl on 6th November and the bass seemed just right in the mix to my ears, it was a fantastic gig John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heathy Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 [quote name='madshadows' timestamp='1416857661' post='2614410'] Me and a mate saw THUNDER at the O2 London Brooklyn Bowl on 6th November and the bass seemed just right in the mix to my ears, it was a fantastic gig John [/quote] I second this - great gig - can't wait for Hammersmith in March. Anyway, as I always say - I don't mind if I'm not heard, just as long as I'm felt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Rock Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Sounds like some of these venues need a visit from The Darth Fader: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Saw Cannibal Corpse recently, got one of the best bassists in extreme metal and he was literally inaudible. Top flight gear - Spector bass, Radial Tonebone and Darkglass B7K on his pedal board, into an Aguilar DB750 and DB 8x10, when he played a couple of notes between songs it sounded great, however I was watching his hands, stood next to the sound desk and couldn't hear a single note. They had their tour manager on the sound desk, so no real argument about not knowing their sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) [quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1416857491' post='2614404'] There was nothing wrong with Norm's bass mix when I saw The Blockheads last week [/quote] You were about 10ft from his bass rig though. I think we're talking about sound from PA after the front of house mix. Most small gigs <300 people seem to be spot on. . Edited November 24, 2014 by TimR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gelfin Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Saw Steve Hacket a few weeks ago. Bass sound was great and that includes the bass pedals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UglyDog Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 I went to see Rush on their Hold Your Fire tour at Wembley Arena in 1988(?). Ged was playing his black Wal, and looked like he was on great form -- a bit hard to tell though, because I didn't hear a single bloody note he played all night Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 For my band, I should walk off the stage and take a listen for myself. I have no idea how I sound in the mix, I only hear the stage mix. I ask people how was our sound; [i]" Everything sounds great"[/i] yeah right. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gelfin Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 At sound check I walk around the hall (wireless kit) to check out the whole sound. More often than not what sounds great out there is pretty poor for me on stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtcat Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 I genuinely believe big pa systems with masses of subs can destroy a bassist's sound if the engineer isn't focused on getting the bass through but a decent engineer can make the bass sing. You can have as much kick as you like as long as the bass sits in a different space. For me it's the mids that usually get lost and in a big venue they're soooo important. If you're gonna give the kick a big boost at around 60hz that's fine but make sure the bass sits above it and give it a boost in low mids. My general experience though is that you need both a good engineer and a good seat. In huge venues the sound by the desk can be totally different to the sound at the back or in the gods. If you stand / sit near the engineer and he's good / cares then it's usually ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) The last named band I saw was The Darkness about a year ago, and the bass mix was fine, Frankie on fine-pirate-bass duties. But on the whole I agree with the sentiments that largely bass is condemned to a low rumbling mush, almost a get it out of the way practice. I put a post on here on Sat, called 1980, where listening to Tony Blackburns Pick of The Pops for that year, bass was well defined, audible, good presence and good bass lines through the majority of the songs. Doesn`t happen much now in recorded music from what I hear, both on radio and on the music I buy, so I suppose we shouldn`t be that amazed that live performance reflects the recordings? Edited November 24, 2014 by Lozz196 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowendgalore Posted November 24, 2014 Author Share Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) Responding to the few that said about walking around a venue to check the sound - yes if im on a small gig and we are maybe doing sound ourselves i will do this, and im usually pretty happy with where we get things sitting. Generally speaking, the smaller gigs where the band do they sound themselves i usually find the bass experience fairly good generally! Its big gigs/proffesional gigs 1000+ to arena tours that disapoint me. Theres one company that when i look and ask them about some of there eq-ing they boost nothing, they only take out... So i might i ask whell hows my bass sitting guys and they will say something like "took out 62hz, it was a bit heavy there" and im like ahhh:( thats where id be wanting them to boost it;) haha Cool to hear your thoughts! Edited November 24, 2014 by lowendgalore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh971 Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Definitely agree on this. Depends on the band, venue and engineer though. I think most engineers try to get a smooth, bottom end heavy bass tone but that sound doesn't sit in the mix at all for most music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodinblack Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 [quote name='UglyDog' timestamp='1416860660' post='2614479'] I went to see Rush on their Hold Your Fire tour at Wembley Arena in 1988(?). Ged was playing his black Wal, and looked like he was on great form -- a bit hard to tell though, because I didn't hear a single bloody note he played all night [/quote] Hmm.. I also went to the Hold Your Fire tour at Wembley Arena, and I heard it fine. The only problem I had was that he was singing off on a few songs, like he couldn't hear himself properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Cloud Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 [i]"Turn it up...or turn it off!" - [/i]Miles Davis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmchich Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Because of my taste in music i rarely go to big gigs. The last big-ish one was orange goblin and st vitus at heaven. The bass was incredible, you could feel it in your chest. And the eq-ing meant the bassists came through perfectly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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