Weak sound on D and G strings

[mr.noisy]

Hi guys, sorry if this topic was already discussed here, tried search option but couldn't find anything, maybe I was trying wrong words, if there is anything on this already, please point me there.

So, I got a problem with my custom bass. It is a 5 string 33" bass currently set up B to G, but I had it strung E to C too with same problem on the G and C strings while it was set up that way. Basically when I play in a live situation with a band and I am playing on the higher strings sometimes I can't even hear myself. When I practice at home it is all good, but on rehearsals with other musicians the sound just disappear in the air. when I play on the lower strings (B, E, A in current set up) it sounds fine. First, I thought it might be just that E to C set up that is very weak and decided to change it to B-G with same results.

I did a bit of research on it and I know that the gauge does matter. Today I have lowered the pickups on the 'low' side and will see on next rehearsal if that makes any difference.
Do you have any other suggestions what could I do to fix this problem? I would really like to set up this bass back to E-C tuning, because I got another 5 string bass with low B, and I wanted to have this one for more soloing situations (fusion/jazz style), but what's the point if you can't hear anything when I play the solo?
Just want to add that the bass has Bartolini soapbar pickups and Noll 3 band eq preamp, currently set up with Dunlop Super Bright Stainless Steel strings (previously D'addario Pro Steels)

[HowieBass]

Two points come to mind, you've already done something about the first which is balancing the volume across all strings (as much as can be achieved with the pickup height). You usually want around an 1/8" gap between string and pickup with the strings held down at the last fret but it's common to have a smaller gap for the G (or in your case C) than that of the B (or E) strings. Secondly you might be competing for the same block of frequencies that other band members are hogging (guitars/keys?) when you play on the G (or G and C) strings when you go for your solo - are they giving you the space?

[mr.noisy]

Frequencies is a good point too, will speak with my guitarist about it on next rehearsal. But it is not only about soloing in the 'dusty end' of the neck, the problem occurs when I play in the more usual region of the neck too. For example, let's just say I am playing a line with simple octave pattern C to Co octave up, playing lower note on 3rd fret of the A string and then higher one on 5th fret on the G string, or another octave G to G, playing lower note on 3rd fret on E string and higher on 5th of the D string, the higher notes in both situations are super hard to hear. I am sure that tweaking the settings on the amps to avoid frequency clash will help a little bit, but I think there is something else to it too. And unfortunately in some situations I don't have the possibility to speak with other band members on stage to adjust everything, I am currently doing music degree in one of the schools and we have weekly Live Performance Workshop, and because of lack of time we just have to get on stage, plug in and play.

[HowieBass]

Hmmm, well if you're playing in front of music tutors at degree level I'd hope one of them would be able to pinpoint the issue; no harm in asking - plus if it's anything like my visual art degree I'd have thought you'd have a group crit afterwards where you could also pursue the topic. After you've satisfied yourself that you have an even volume across all strings I'd look at beefing up your mids and maybe cutting some bass for when you're playing in the group situation - that ought to help you hear yourself better.

[mr.noisy]

My tutor pointed out that during one of our performances when I hit those upper strings it was quite hard to hear me, but the only suggestion he had was 'maybe it is a strings gauge?'.
Since that time I don't play this bass on my Live Workshops and use the other one instead.

I have ordered new strings, D'addarios in singles, this time I will try a little experiment with gauge, 90,70,65,45,35.

[HowieBass]

Well it's true that heavier gauge strings are reputed to be louder but I've usually used either a 40 or 45 for the G and can't say I notice any difference in volume (though I always have matched sets so the rest will follow suit). I reckon you'll get more volume by adjusting the pickup height. By the way, are you using the same gauge strings on your other bass? Good luck with the experiment anyway!

[rogerstodge]

What amp set up are you using?

[mr.noisy]

Basically at the moment on my other fiver, Lakland DJ5 I got exactly the same set of strings with the same gauge, Dunlop Super Bright Steels (got them on buy one get one free deal ) and I must say that when I play on Lakland you can't really notice it as much and I can still hear what I play.

I am using whatever is in the Live room at the given time, mostly Markbass head with 4x10 Markbass cab, but in the other room I played on some Ashdown stack where I couldn't hear anything at all!

[HowieBass]

As I mentioned earlier you might need to boost the mids to hear yourself in the band setting.

[Phil Starr]

There's all sorts of things to look at.

Amplification, I've found Ashdowns to be pretty dead sounding, 4x10's will radiate mids and highs in a narrow beam which people out front will hear but will pass you by at knee height, all you'll hear is the bottom notes. If you can raise the cab or tilt it back you'l get a better picture of how you sound.

The eq settings you need for live performance are completely different to the ones you practice with. Basically boost the mids and roll off deep bass. Once you are playing with drums and a couple of guitars all your mids are drowned beneath theirs.

I find when I play live my fingering becomes much stronger, adrenaline rush I suppose. This seems to affect the bottom strings most and I tend to lose the upper note when playing octaves, worth looking to see if your technique changes under pressure.

You are getting less treble volume with some guitars/pups than others. Heavily overwound high impedance pups will filter out the highest frequencies and adding a long guitar lead won't help. Use a shorter lead or go for one with low capacitance.

[Guest]

I solved this problem on my Thumb by changing the Pickups. I experimented with Pickup height for a month or so without much success so....out came the MEC's and in went a set of Barts (other pickups are available)
I have even volume across all the strings now and I can clearly hear the notes all the way up the G.

[Lozz196]

As mentioned, pickup height and mids. I have my pickup height a lot lower on the E side, as I hit quite hard. Plus, when playing low down the neck the lack of volume isn`t that apparent on the D/G but the higher I go, the more it is if I have a "pleasing" mid-scooped sound, Once I up mids, and reduce highs to compensate for that, the problem is dealt with. Doesn`t sound so good soloed, but in the mix it works really well. What`s really highlighted this to me recently is swapping to flats, which don`t have the real highs of rounds. Suddenly there is a lot more presence in the tonal spectrum which the bass belongs in, and less being swamped by the guitar when going higher up the neck. I suppose it`s cos I`m not competing for the same space.

[mr.noisy]

I had rehearsal today and it looks like the gauge experiment and lowering the p-ups on one side did the trick and I heard myself much clearer (played through some Peavey stack). Will give you update on monday after the Live Performance Workshop when I'll be playing with a bunch of different guitarists, singers and drummers, and probably through Markbass stack.

[rogerstodge]

[quote name='mr.noisy' timestamp='1417728464' post='2623607']
Basically at the moment on my other fiver, Lakland DJ5 I got exactly the same set of strings with the same gauge, Dunlop Super Bright Steels (got them on buy one get one free deal ) and I must say that when I play on Lakland you can't really notice it as much and I can still hear what I play.

I am using whatever is in the Live room at the given time, mostly Markbass head with 4x10 Markbass cab, but in the other room I played on some Ashdown stack where I couldn't hear anything at all!
[/quote]i had the exact same problem as you, I also use markbass, i did ask the good chaps on here about it and the advice i got was turn the VL filters right off (fully anti clockwise) and up the lower mids, i ca now hear every note/string that i play.. Thank you basschat.

[mr.noisy]

[quote name='rogerstodge' timestamp='1417885595' post='2624887']
i had the exact same problem as you, I also use markbass, i did ask the good chaps on here about it and the advice i got was turn the VL filters right off (fully anti clockwise) and up the lower mids, i ca now hear every note/string that i play.. Thank you basschat.
[/quote]

That is one thing that I will look at but as far as I know we have all these settings like VL etc turned down anyway and for me it was happening on the other amps too, but thanks for this suggestion, I will make sure to check it every time now before playing on this amp.

[fingerz]

Does the bass do it acoustically?

That's a really good way to isolate electronics from the physical/set up issues. If not then sounds like you're found your problem. The only other thing I was initially thinking was how the Barts work? If there is some coil that is under the top two strings like a split hum bucking type system then it could be to do with the balance of the coils.. again, lowering one side would help massively with this..