Sparky Mark Posted December 11, 2014 Author Share Posted December 11, 2014 I agree that markbass are a great company and I personally own many of their products. However the LM2/3 is such a good perhaps classic design that a fundamental change like this got me wondering. We could all probably remember products whose later models weren't as good as the original. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Mark Posted December 11, 2014 Author Share Posted December 11, 2014 Riccardo has confirmed that the power amp section of the current LM3 is the same as that in the Big Bang head. Mystery solved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismuzz Posted December 12, 2014 Share Posted December 12, 2014 (edited) Yep! The LM3 is now a Class D amp (like the Big Bang, not the F1) which means better headroom, possibly lower weight, and no change in tone!(?) One of the common complaints about Class D amps is the lack of warmth but it seems yet again Markbass are leading the way. I'd be interested to hear an A/B comparison I've also asked Riccardo if the LMT800 has had a power amp upgrade, because I have read lots of negative feedback about the head, saying it is even more sterile than the F1, but my brand new one sounds lovely and full even without engaging the tube preamp EDIT: My LMT800 was assembled in Indonesia and its the best amp I've ever used, build quality is actually of a higher standard than my Italian F1! Edited December 12, 2014 by chrismuzz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismuzz Posted December 12, 2014 Share Posted December 12, 2014 Apparently the LMT800 power amp has never changed, which surprised me... just goes to show that what may work for some won't for others! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbonepete Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418213350' post='2627981'] Here is a photo of two lm3s. 2011 model on the left and a 2013 on the right. Can anyone explain the reduction in the size of the power amp section of the newer one? [/quote] could you tell me which one is which? I'll be taking the amp from my cmd102p to see which one is in. For me I'm hoping I have the A/B power section. Many thanks, Cheers Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbonepete Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 Oops, just read the first post properly, and I have my answer. My amp was bought in 2012 so I've got my fingers crossed that I have an old one, Cheers Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='tbonepete' timestamp='1418479357' post='2630526'] Oops, just read the first post properly, and I have my answer. My amp was bought in 2012 so I've got my fingers crossed that I have an old one, Cheers Pete [/quote] But, do you like the way it sounds? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbonepete Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1418479529' post='2630530'] But, do you like the way it sounds? [/quote] It's alright. I thought the sound from an original series combo (yellow combo head) that I used on a gig share for about a year was nicer, and I've had many posts privately back and forth with Marco on the sound difference between the two models, primarily concerned about the speaker changes, and move to Asian production with no clear indication as to the changes. So I guess it's a yes, AND no to your question. To me it's important that I get what I thought I'd paid for, and I bought the combo on the strength of the old one I'd used, but I appreciate that to others this isn't so important. Cheers Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Mark Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 I have noticed that the new head takes 8 seconds for the output relay to 'click' after switching the amp on. This is much longer than the original design and may be an easier way of telling which version you have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Mark Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 What speakers did the combo you tried before have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='tbonepete' timestamp='1418480770' post='2630547'] It's alright. I thought the sound from an original series combo (yellow combo head) that I used on a gig share for about a year was nicer, and I've had many posts privately back and forth with Marco on the sound difference between the two models, primarily concerned about the speaker changes, and move to Asian production with no clear indication as to the changes. So I guess it's a yes, AND no to your question. To me it's important that I get what I thought I'd paid for, and I bought the combo on the strength of the old one I'd used, but I appreciate that to others this isn't so important. Cheers Pete [/quote] I was asking trying to see whether the answer would actually explain anything you feel about its sound. I guess if the one you used before and this one have a slightly different design, that could explain it and would be reassuring to know that you were not imagining things and you're -probably - not crazy Mine is dated 01-13, so I guess it uses the D-type power module. I'm happy with it, so I don't mind... but they should really update their specs to reflect what they're actually selling, I agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418480868' post='2630549']I have noticed that the new head takes 8 seconds for the output relay to 'click' after switching the amp on. This is much longer than the original design and may be an easier way of telling which version you have.[/quote] My BB head does the same. Can't fault the tone from it either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418480868' post='2630549'] I have noticed that the new head takes 8 seconds for the output relay to 'click' after switching the amp on. This is much longer than the original design and may be an easier way of telling which version you have. [/quote] Really? Just tested mine (01-13) ... just under 2 seconds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Mark Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1418483097' post='2630578'] Really? Just tested mine (01-13) ... just under 2 seconds. [/quote] Are you sure that yours is class d? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418484924' post='2630601'] Are you sure that yours is class d? [/quote] No, I have no clue! It's just that the date (01-13) appeared to suggest it would be... but if it clicks in so quickly then maybe it isn't. I don't knooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Mark Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 There are plenty of clues within this thread including the photo at the top. If you like the way it sounds then it really doesn't matter one way or the other. If you are simply curious you can undo 4 bolts and slip the head out and compare with my photo. It's likely that both versions were made in 2013. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbonepete Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418481083' post='2630553'] What speakers did the combo you tried before have? [/quote] Hi Sparky Mark, Its some time ago now but from memory there were posts around that time that Said that handle designs had changed, weights had changed, and country of origin had changed but price had remained the same. I had recently bought my combo on the strength of using one three nights a week for a year and mine didn't sound anywhere near as good. The original had b&c drivers in, and after a lot of faff I found that mine did too, but the frame looked different. There was no mention on the b&c site stating that they still made drivers for markbass and to be honest all I got were politicians answers to my straight questions. Cant really tell you more than that. Back to the op though, so do we now have a lm lite, or a big bang head with reduced functionality, ie no aux in, and phones out? I tend to keep amps for 8-10 years so will plod along while it still works, but if it turns out to be a class d its not what I bought! Cheers. pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418487926' post='2630626'] There are plenty of clues within this thread including the photo at the top. If you like the way it sounds then it really doesn't matter one way or the other. If you are simply curious you can undo 4 bolts and slip the head out and compare with my photo. It's likely that both versions were made in 2013. [/quote] Mine is in a CMD121P combo. I think it takes a bit more than the 4 screws and I'm not curious enough to check it out today. Tonight it'll be travelling with me to a gig 60 miles away, together with the BF Compact cab as an extension. If I get bored after soundcheck I might ask for an allen key, but it's unlikely. So... no, no clue yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Mark Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 (edited) Mine are in CMD121P and CMD121H combos. Both use the same 4 bolt fixing. Definitely not a job to do just before or at a gig though. I gig my 121P with a NY121 cab and they sound great. Have a good one tonight. P.S, If you play quite loud with both input and output at noon, the analogue head gets pretty warm whilst the class D stays much cooler. Edited December 13, 2014 by Sparky Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismuzz Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418495036' post='2630715'] P.S, If you play quite loud with both input and output at noon, the analogue head gets pretty warm whilst the class D stays much cooler. [/quote] This is something I discovered about Class D amps, they're a lot more efficient! You also seem to get much better headroom particularly in the low end. Apparently the dynamics are better too but I use so much compression you'd never tell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbonepete Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418495036' post='2630715'] Mine are in CMD121P and CMD121H combos. Both use the same 4 bolt fixing. Definitely not a job to do just before or at a gig though. I gig my 121P with a NY121 cab and they sound great. Have a good one tonight. P.S, If you play quite loud with both input and output at noon, the analogue head gets pretty warm whilst the class D stays much cooler. [/quote] Thanks Sparky Mark, This would point to mine being an A/B model, as its quite toasty at the end of a gig I've noticed. That'll save me taking the head out. Cheers Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Mark Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 You're welcome Pete. When I asked about the speakers I was wondering what size and how many? If the design of the speakers has also been 'refined ' then that might explain why you hear a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbonepete Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 [quote name='Sparky Mark' timestamp='1418497946' post='2630762'] You're welcome Pete. When I asked about the speakers I was wondering what size and how many? If the design of the speakers has also been 'refined ' then that might explain why you hear a difference. [/quote] Ah, sorry, I have a cmd102p (2x10), and a 104hr (4x10, which was the only Italian cab I could find at the time even though I wanted a 2x10hf, but could only find Indonesian ones). Marco said that the drivers probably needed to run in, and to an extent it has improved, but still nowhere as full sounding as the old combo I played. I cant comment on 12s or 15s though. Cheers Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 So if they have the same amp module now what is the difference between a little mark and a big bang? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbonepete Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 [quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1418732290' post='2632721'] So if they have the same amp module now what is the difference between a little mark and a big bang? [/quote] If the changes in power section are true then the difference should be that the little Mark is really a Big Bang head but with no aux in, or headphone out. Hmmm......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.