How can I do this?

[NoirBass]

Right then I need the collectives help here. Let me try to explain.

I'm currently working in a trio and I've been trying to thicken up things with a bit of Royal Blood style fake guitar. It struck me though that I might be able to add some faux keys too….

I've split my signal. Channel A is clean bass. Channel B is being sent through a POG with just the octave up - this is then sent to a Zoom G1on. Using the Organ sim on the Zoom I can get a reasonably convincing B3 sound doubling my bassline.

Now for those of you still reading, the science bit:

What I'd like to do is use an EHX Freeze pedal with the organ sound to sustain the first note of a riff (which is usually the root anyway), then somehow turn off channel B and play the rest of the baseline on top whilst the sustained organ note continues. With two feet this is possible, but its a bit tap dancy. I was thinking a sopohisticated noise gate might work and just try to attack the first note a little harder each time to open the gate. That would leave me to concentrate on operating just the EHX Freeze.

Can you lot offer any solutions that I might not have thought of.

Edited February 3, 2015 by NoirBass

[TG Flatline]

One solution would be an A/B/Y box with radio switching - ie a footswitch for each mode and only one footswitch needs to be pressed to select any of the three modes. Failing that, a normal A/B/Y box seems to be a good choice here, but still lots of tap dancing to do to combine the Freeze too.

I would imagine something envelope controlled would be a bit of a pain.

Interested to see how you get on though :-)

[NoirBass]

Thanks for the response, I knew I would not explain myself very well.

I'm already using an LS-2 to add Channel 2 (oct up) to the Channel 1 (Clean bass) signal. I then have a tuner post LS-2 to mute Channel 1 (Clean bass) so I can solo the upper octave.

My issue is to sustain just the first note of channel 2 my tap dance is this:

a)Both channels open - b)hit note on bass / hit freeze - c)switch off channel 2 - d)play rest of riff - e)switch channel 2 back on - repeat till finished.

Is there any way to get that process down to just "b)hit note on bass / hit freeze" and have something else control the channel switching - like an envelope?

The other thing I thought of was to mod the switch on the Freeze to mute the incoming signal with a short delay, although I have no idea how you would do it?

I should probably post my signal chain as it might make it easier to see what I'm up to?

Edited February 2, 2015 by NoirBass

[NoirBass]

Signal Chain:

[size=3]Bass->EBS MultiComp->LS-2 (set to A+B Mix-basically Channel A plus LS-2 output blended)[/size]

[size=3]-------Channel A->MicroPOG->Boss PS-6->ZoomG1on->EHX Freeze->Radial JDI->FOH[/size]

[size=3]-------Output->TC Polytune->Keeley Looper->Zoom MS-60B(In Loop)->Tech21 VTbass DLX->FOH[/size]

Edited February 3, 2015 by NoirBass

[ubit]

Sounds way too complicated for me! Sorry, I would just hire another musician!

[NoirBass]

[quote name='ubit' timestamp='1422865688' post='2677574']
Sounds way too complicated for me! Sorry, I would just hire another musician!
[/quote]

Ha, you're probably right! ethically for sure. But I'm keen to go down this road.

[Musky]

A noise gate with a sidechain controlling ducking? Although you'd have to make sure the gate would hold long enough for what you're playing. You'll probably be looking at rack gear though, as I can't imagine a pedal being specced well enough for this.

[elephantgrey]

A quick google found [url="http://www.mattgallagher.me/2011/07/replacing-the-footswitch-in-an-ehx-freeze-pedal/"]this[/url]. looks like the freeze is controlled by a SPDT, so maybe its possible to bypass the switch, and connect it to an external switch via a stereo cable. Might be able to rig up a loop pedal that also activates the freeze.

[cheddatom]

If you had an ABY switch, you could have it set to Y, then play the note, then switch back to just A. Have the output of both chains blended back together using your LS-2. So, you don't use the input or sends from the LS-2, you just use it as a mixer.

[dannybuoy]

I would put the freeze before the organ sim. Assuming the organ has some kind of rotary speaker sim or other modulation, it won't sound quite right when 'frozen', but if a frozen note is put into it, it can add its goodness on top.

Also consider getting an EHX B9 or C9 for organ sounds, there is nothing better!

[NoirBass]

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1422958200' post='2678736']
If you had an ABY switch, you could have it set to Y, then play the note, then switch back to just A. Have the output of both chains blended back together using your LS-2. So, you don't use the input or sends from the LS-2, you just use it as a mixer.
[/quote]

I would still need to use both feet to operate the switch and the Freeze, wouldn't I?

[quote name='dannybuoy' timestamp='1422961790' post='2678796']
I would put the freeze before the organ sim. Assuming the organ has some kind of rotary speaker sim or other modulation, it won't sound quite right when 'frozen', but if a frozen note is put into it, it can add its goodness on top.

Also consider getting an EHX B9 or C9 for organ sounds, there is nothing better!
[/quote]

I tried the Freeze before, but I like to Freeze one sound and be able to switch to another patch to play over the top.

Believe me, if I can sort out this switching problem I'll be buying a C9 immediately.

Having browsed the Youtube a bit this morning I noticed that the EHX Superego has an Auto mode, which could solve my problem? leaving me to just switch channel 2 in and out.

Edited February 3, 2015 by NoirBass

[NoirBass]

I just noticed my signal chain diagram is wrong, so I've corrected it.

Also, please note my question is purely concerned with being able to Freeze an effected note and play clean bass over it. The fundamental switching of the two signal paths I have sorted, I think?

Edited February 3, 2015 by NoirBass

[cheddatom]

sorry, yes, you're right. Replace the footswitch in an ABY pedal with a momentary switch. Connect this switch to a new jack socket (as well as retaining the ABY connection) on the ABY pedal. Drill a hole in the side of your Freeze, put a jack socket in connected to the footswitch. Plug a patch cable between the two new jack sockets. Sorted!

That sounds like a right PITA

the Freeze is a momentary footswitch right? And I think the zoom has a footswitch input? I'd wire half a jack cable to the footswitch in your freeze, just tape it on, then plug the jack end into the zoom's socket, and see if you can make the freeze footswitch control the zoom.

[NoirBass]

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1422962977' post='2678828']
sorry, yes, you're right. Replace the footswitch in an ABY pedal with a momentary switch. Connect this switch to a new jack socket (as well as retaining the ABY connection) on the ABY pedal. Drill a hole in the side of your Freeze, put a jack socket in connected to the footswitch. Plug a patch cable between the two new jack sockets. Sorted!

That sounds like a right PITA

the Freeze is a momentary footswitch right? And I think the zoom has a footswitch input? I'd wire half a jack cable to the footswitch in your freeze, just tape it on, then plug the jack end into the zoom's socket, and see if you can make the freeze footswitch control the zoom.
[/quote]

I think I'd need a diagram to fully understand what you are suggesting at the top - sounds like it could work though.

I'm happy to undertake a PITA if the result is favourable.

The switch on the Freeze is either momentary or latching depending on how you have the switch set. The Zoom however does not have an expression pedal input.

Edited February 3, 2015 by NoirBass

[cheddatom]

ahh, OK, sounds a little more complicated that I thought it'd be. I'd need to see the inside of the freeze to figure it out. I once wired two pedals together so that pressing one footswitch would do both of them, which is really simple. If the Freeze has the option to be momentary or latching, then I guess it's a fancy complicated switch which might not be easy to wire like this

[NoirBass]

There are some good gut shots here (thanks Elephantgrey), but I can take some new ones if you needed something specific:

http://www.mattgallagher.me/2011/07/replacing-the-footswitch-in-an-ehx-freeze-pedal/

[NoirBass]

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1422968539' post='2678924']
ahh, OK, sounds a little more complicated that I thought it'd be. I'd need to see the inside of the freeze to figure it out. I once wired two pedals together so that pressing one footswitch would do both of them, which is really simple. If the Freeze has the option to be momentary or latching, then I guess it's a fancy complicated switch which might not be easy to wire like this
[/quote]

I think my main problem here is the switch would have to have a short delay so that after the freeze has taken its snapshot the input mutes. Then you'd need to somehow un-mute again before the next snapshot is taken - i.e. before I'd pressed the Freeze's switch for the capture.

Its a proper chin scratcher!

Edited February 3, 2015 by NoirBass

[cheddatom]

OK, so it looks like a standard momentary switch. If you were to get an ABY pedal, replace the Y footswitch with a momentary one, then connect the switch poles to the switch poles on the Freeze, or to the two solder points on the white cable, your ABY should then switch your freeze on and off, as well as switching the Y on and off at the same time. Then you just mix the two chains back together with an LS-2

I'd do this temporarily at first before making any holes in the pedals. You could get a momentary footswitch from maplins for £5 and an ABY off ebay for £15 or so

[cheddatom]

I've not used the freeze myself, is it not instant when you turn it on?

[NoirBass]

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1422971187' post='2678979']
I've not used the freeze myself, is it not instant when you turn it on?
[/quote]

Yes, it should be.

[NoirBass]

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1422971123' post='2678978']
OK, so it looks like a standard momentary switch. If you were to get an ABY pedal, replace the Y footswitch with a momentary one, then connect the switch poles to the switch poles on the Freeze, or to the two solder points on the white cable, your ABY should then switch your freeze on and off, as well as switching the Y on and off at the same time. Then you just mix the two chains back together with an LS-2

I'd do this temporarily at first before making any holes in the pedals. You could get a momentary footswitch from maplins for £5 and an ABY off ebay for £15 or so
[/quote]

This is very interesting, you've gotten round the problem of switching the effected channel very nicely. If I can figure out how to implement it into my signal chain this is a goer. Many thanks!

[NoirBass]

Actually, sorry, on closer inspection:

if I press the new switch the freeze will capture and the organ sound will be heard. If I release the switch the freeze will stop and the organ sound will mute. correct?

Edited February 3, 2015 by NoirBass

[cheddatom]

ahh, balls, yes you're right, as soon as you let go of the ABY switch, it'll turn the freeze back off. What if you put the freeze into latching mode? Does it stay on after one press of the switch? If so, in this mode, you would just have to tap the switch again when you want it to turn off

[NoirBass]

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1423042421' post='2679802']
ahh, balls, yes you're right, as soon as you let go of the ABY switch, it'll turn the freeze back off. What if you put the freeze into latching mode? Does it stay on after one press of the switch? If so, in this mode, you would just have to tap the switch again when you want it to turn off
[/quote]

Yes, I'm latching mode that might work. Ill mock something up and see how I get on.

Thanks for all your help Cheddartom!

[cheddatom]

let us know how you get on!