charic Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Get out there and try it Froggy I played my first gig after only 4 weeks of playing and it went down a storm. You don't know until you try Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 (edited) [quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1423561877' post='2686236'] Blimey JTUK, thats a bit of an ask. I play a mixture of fingers and plectrum depending on the track but Dakota is strictly a pick song for me (must chuggers will be pick - fingers used for more feel). I've only been playing bass properly for about 5 years (plus 25 years on six strings) and still developing my right hand technique but I reckon Dakota on fingers comes under advanced. Lack of finger technique didn't stop me depping at a 2 hour gig on bass a week after picking up the bass. [/quote] Yes, understand it isn't easy..at all, which is why a lot of fingerstyle bass players can't do it. It is ideally suited to plectrum players as it is a rythmic down and up motion and being very regular and precise in the strike is another issue. For Froggy, these sorts of things are exercises, first and foremost and you don't get exposed to it until you get asked to do it... and a band will want to do it as it is very popular and everyone elses parts are easy enough. The drums and bass can have quite a work out at it though... The type of thing that is very easy to assume and cheat but this track has no let up for a fingerstyle bass. Use it as a benchmark to 'aspire' to at some point.. as that is what we are really talking about here, IMO. Oh... the work around for a fingerstyle player is single digit plucking with the index... but that is also kinda cheating Edited February 10, 2015 by JTUK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 (edited) Strange, I would have expected two fingers would be pretty much similar to one plectrum up and down speedwise. I have done a little with a plectrum, but I feel much more comfortable fingerstyle. There's my lack of experience showing up again! Benchmark, that was the word I was looking for! Edited February 10, 2015 by Froggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No lust in Jazz Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 [quote name='Froggy' timestamp='1423562869' post='2686253'] Here's a question though, what makes it harder fingerstyle compared to plectrum? When I play if feel that my hands work independently but in concert with each other. What would be different if I was playing with a plectrum? [/quote] Both fingerstyle and plectrumstyle are just techniques that require practice, at your stage I would choose one and go with it - play gigs and have fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicko Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 [quote name='Froggy' timestamp='1423562869' post='2686253'] Here's a question though, what makes it harder fingerstyle compared to plectrum? When I play if feel that my hands work independently but in concert with each other. What would be different if I was playing with a plectrum? [/quote] No. The hands still work independently - you have to play the notes in the same place either way. For me some things just work better with a pick. Some things are too hard for me speedwise to use fingers even if I want to (Somebody Told Me by the Killers for example) and I struggle with a plick on others (Valerie by the Zutons). I dont really aspire to only play with fingers or only play with a pick. Frankly I think its only bass players who get their cacks in a twist over this the audience and the rest of the band couldn't care less. Sorry I think I just outed myself as a heretic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Me, I do everything with just my hands but I might use a double thumb stroke to imitate a pick but it doesn't really have the heaviness or authority that a pick does...but its my bed and I'll lie in it and use it as a challenge. I like the versatility of fingers and I swapped over after about 4 years of playing so no going back really. I also get more satisfaction nailing a typical pick line with fingers anyway. You need something to amuse yourself.. I think most players are 'born' pick or fingers anyway and this is mostly down to what they listen to and therefore they hear... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancient Mariner Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1423538740' post='2686106'] My take is a little different. I started playing bass in 1964 and started gigging in 1966 at age 11. It was different back then every kid in the neighborhood was learning to play electric guitar, bass guitar or drums. All spawned by the Beatles appearance on American Television on February 9th, 1964. At the time I thought everybody was in a band. We practiced, learned to wood shed and we took lessons. 50 years later I'm still at it, practicing for hours on end and still gigging every weekend. I say it's never to soon, today there are kids out there on big tours that know little more than how to get around E, A , D and G root notes and haven't been playing more than a year. Blue [/quote] I may have over-estimated on the timescale, so maybe a little sooner. I'd always wanted to be Eric Clapton, and it was a big ask to learn to play and improvise adequately that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancient Mariner Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 [quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1423568527' post='2686347'] Me, I do everything with just my hands but I might use a double thumb stroke to imitate a pick but it doesn't really have the heaviness or authority that a pick does...but its my bed and I'll lie in it and use it as a challenge. I like the versatility of fingers and I swapped over after about 4 years of playing so no going back really. I also get more satisfaction nailing a typical pick line with fingers anyway. You need something to amuse yourself.. I think most players are 'born' pick or fingers anyway and this is mostly down to what they listen to and therefore they hear... [/quote] I'm really a pick player for guitar & won't do otherwise, but for bass I prefer finger and thumb because it sounds much better than a pick (unless using compression ). I say finger, so I guess that's taking the place of the pick, but I just can't usemore than 1 finger and maintain acceptable timing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Fingers all the way for me. Even if I have to use all four. Froggy, in think your main stumbling block is going to be finding guys of your own age and standard. They are about, I ended up believing some guys in an audition and joined their band only to be very disappointed that their gig experience and playing ability didn't match up to the audition. We never really left the church hall where they practiced. On the plus side stick yourself on bandmix. Be honest about your age and ability and you'll find a bunch of guys that'll give you a chance. Might not be the type of music you particularly want to play, but beggars can't be choosers and it's a start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Just go for it mate. Music is all about enjoyment. Concentrate on getting the root notes solid and don't try to be too fast too quickly. Concentrate on getting a good technique. Speed happens naturally after you have a piece off pat. You'll be amazed at how many easy songs you can play with a band and you can gradually improve your technique whilst jamming. Nothing brings you on more than playing live. You can play forever in a bedroom, but playing live makes you a complete player. Good luck and remember to enjoy yourself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted February 16, 2015 Author Share Posted February 16, 2015 I got rocksmith 2014 on Saturday, it's showed me that no way am I ready for a band yet! Good job I'm enjoying practicing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taunton-hobbit Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 About the same time Noah was building the Ark, the band that I was 'vocalist' for (mainly because I knew the lyrics to 'Baby Please Don't go) had their bassist jack it in, but left the guitar behind, so I got appointed bassist....it was a disaster (even worse than my vocal sh*t) - which is why I took up Sound System work & made a few bob - moral - find what you can do & earn off it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 [quote name='SpaceChick' timestamp='1423513224' post='2685827'] JTUK - I think you are coming across as quite harsh in your last post. I'm sure we were all ropey when we started out. However, everyone has to start somewhere in a band environment and I think if Froggy can find others that want to play with him and he wants to play with then it will be a great development experience. We all need to find our level whether we've been playing 3 months or 30 years and everyone was a beginner once and not everyone is going to be the next Pino or Jaco!! [/quote] I think it depends on what kind of band a newbie plans on playing with. Wouldn't you all agree that to play in a band where your only required to play simple rock 4/4 root notes around A,E & C would happen sooner than playing in a band where your going to be required to play in multiple keys, time signatures, complicated melodies and riffs? Just my opinion, there will always be new and great bass players that come to the surface, however there will never be the next Joco, Pino, Larry Graham, ect ect.. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) [quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1423514335' post='2685844'] I may have got hold of the wrong end of the stick, but I got the impression that you're a long-distance driver? In that case, your job may keep you away from any regular jams near home, but it takes you close to loads of regular jams in other places. The internet is your friend. At many/most jams, you don't even necessarily have to bring a bass. It's pretty much the tradition that the house band will lend an instrument to anyone who needs it. Incidentally, I started playing nine years ago, which is recent enough that I can remember the timescales.[list] [*]3 months in, starting to jam with CDs designed for the novice bass player to play along with [*]6 months in, starting to jam with individual guitarists, most at the same stage of development as me [*]8 months in, attending a local jam session and just starting to get up [*]11 months in, joined my first band [*]16 months in, played my first gig in front of a genuine audience [/list] [/quote] My generation, we did not have CDs, computers or any type of digital technology. We had to learn songs by moving that needle on the record player back and fourth over and over again. Any guys here that started playing back in the 60s will remember those days. We did have jam sessions, not to be confused with the "open mic". Blue Edited February 17, 2015 by blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Thing is mate, you have a bass, you've learned a couple of songs........you're a bass player! Don't let anyone tell you any different! As for ability. Everyone has varying degrees of it. Some people on here are awesome, some not so, but as long as you put the time in on practising, you can count yourself among the club that we are. Keep at it man ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) [quote name='ubit' timestamp='1424148624' post='2693160'] Thing is mate, you have a bass, you've learned a couple of songs........you're a bass player! Don't let anyone tell you any different! As for ability. Everyone has varying degrees of it. Some people on here are awesome, some not so, but as long as you put the time in on practising, you can count yourself among the club that we are. Keep at it man ! [/quote] Agreed, were all in the same club. I have been gigging for 45 years. I talk a good game and have a lot of opinions. However, and let me be real clear, if you ask me how good I am? My answer is always the same, [i]I'm ok, I can hold my own and I have good nights and then I can have nights when i wonder why I'm even playing.[/i] Blue Edited February 17, 2015 by blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted February 17, 2015 Author Share Posted February 17, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1424153674' post='2693169'] Agreed, were all in the same club. I have been gigging for 45 years. I talk a good game and have a lot of opinions. However, and let me be real clear, if you ask me how good I am? My answer is always the same, [i]I'm ok, I can hold my own and I have good nights and then I can have nights when i wonder why I'm even playing.[/i] Blue [/quote] I have no illusions about being the next Jaco, but right now, if I was asked I wouldn't be able to say I'm ok, in fact, right now I wouldn't even call myself adequate. However, using rocksmith as a tool alongside taking lessons I've identified areas I really need to work on. Fretting accuracy being my biggest issue I think. So next stage for me is lots of practice trying not to look at the fretboard for shifts. I know if I was playing in a band of similar ability I'd be able to just play root until I'm more comfortable, but for a few months at least, I'll be remaining as a bedroom bassist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 [quote name='Froggy' timestamp='1424159424' post='2693190'] ...I know if I was playing in a band of similar ability I'd be able to just play root until I'm more comfortable, but for a few months at least, I'll be remaining as a bedroom bassist. [/quote] In fact the quickest possible way to up your game is to do lots of gigs in a band where everyone is much better than you. You will get up to speed super-quick. If you stay in your bedroom you will progress much more slowly and be much less motivated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvin Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 The one thing that playing in a 'bedroom' to backing tracks etc won't prepare you for is actually playing with other people...it can be a whole different ball game. You can learn a song at home, think you've really nailed it, get into a practice room with others and it'll sound 'different'...others may not be playing what you expect them to and you have to respond to that. Over analysing your playing can be a destructive path..it was for me and resulted in a miserable 2 years of thinking I wasn't good enough to be in certain bands. What you realise is that the really good players are both encouraging, polite and humble. The one's who think their excrement smells better then the rest, they're not worth being in a band with anyway. Enjoy playing, and one of the best ways is to play in a band. You'll learn more and improve quicker than staying home. My playing has massive holes in it, there's straightforward stuff that I'm absolutely crap at...but I've never failed to get in a band I've tried out for. This to me is really odd, but what the hell. If you can fit it in with your job, go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 [quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1424174628' post='2693391'] The one thing that playing in a 'bedroom' to backing tracks etc won't prepare you for is actually playing with other people...it can be a whole different ball game. You can learn a song at home, think you've really nailed it, get into a practice room with others and it'll sound 'different'...others may not be playing what you expect them to and you have to respond to that. Over analysing your playing can be a destructive path..it was for me and resulted in a miserable 2 years of thinking I wasn't good enough to be in certain bands. What you realise is that the really good players are both encouraging, polite and humble. The one's who think their excrement smells better then the rest, they're not worth being in a band with anyway. Enjoy playing, and one of the best ways is to play in a band. You'll learn more and improve quicker than staying home. My playing has massive holes in it, there's straightforward stuff that I'm absolutely crap at...but I've never failed to get in a band I've tried out for. This to me is really odd, but what the hell. If you can fit it in with your job, go for it. [/quote] Absolutely! I don't think I'm an amazing bass player by any means. The thing is, I have played in a band for years and years and I KNOW I'm a solid player who fits in very well with the band. Playing with other people is a whole different kettle of fish than playing along with cd's , but it's also a lot more enjoyable . It's great fun locking in with a drummers beat and it brings your dynamics on by a long way. When we started years ago, we were all pretty much the same level, so it didn't matter that we were rotten , but we evolved together and that journey is what it's all about. It's great fun and that first public performance still sticks with me. The joy of knowing that you are partly responsible for making a nice sound that people will dance around to and that you can have made someone's evening a really good one, is amazing. Stick with it and believe you can do it , because you will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1424142364' post='2693155'] My generation ... [/quote] Yes, but My Generation wasn't available on CD until 15 years later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 [quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1424174628' post='2693391'] The one thing that playing in a 'bedroom' to backing tracks etc won't prepare you for is actually playing with other people...it can be a whole different ball game. You can learn a song at home, think you've really nailed it, get into a practice room with others and it'll sound 'different'...others may not be playing what you expect them to and you have to respond to that.[/quote] Very astute comment! I hope that folks new to playing bass with aspirations of playing in a band with others at some point understand, when your practicing and playing along to tracks in the bedroom, your playing in an ideal environment. Your actually being pushed by the track and your hearing subtle ques leading you into the changes. Plus you can stop and start over. In other words, your abilities might be jaded by how you sound in the bedroom. Playing live with other musicians is a completely different challenge. I can almost guarantee it will not be ideal. You can know a song inside and play along with the track flawlessly and then be completely thrown off when you play with a live band. Blue Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Even the sound of your bass sitting down compared to standing up. The difference when you first attempt to play live can throw you. It's not what your used to. Lots of little things can conspire to make your first ever gig a disaster. Playing in a bedroom, as stated by Blue, is a safe environment. It's better to get used to live playing or at least standing up playing as much as possible so that you can ensure it all goes to plan when the big night arrives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Keep working at it Froggy, and put the time in. You wont notice week 1 and week 2, but you will notice things at some point and it is all building blocks. If you don't do anything else, do an hour a day of solid driven exercises witha goal in mind but don't beat yourself up on it..too often, too much. Just enough to care but not enough to drive you into the ground and give up. My formative years were were wearing out albums up in my bedroom but there are far 'better' learning tools that that these days. Keep the lessons going if you feel the teacher is giving something back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted February 18, 2015 Author Share Posted February 18, 2015 I'll keep working at it, no worries about that. I generally put in an hour a day, with more on weekends, plus a weekly half hour lesson, and I think the lessons are great, I'll be keeping those going, especially as I'm the kind of person who likes to collect bits of paper, so I intend to do my grade exams. As for a band and gigging, I'll grab any opportunities that arise, but until I find a more sociable job I won't seriously be searching as I feel it would be better to be able to commit fully to the band. Thanks for all the replies and encouragement, even the more negative posts have showed me what I need to be concentrating on. Now then, other than jam/open mic nights, does anyone have any tips on finding a band? With my eclectic music tastes I'm not too worried about genre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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