spectoremg Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Lining up a rehearsal next week. Just contacted the guitarist about tunings and they're doing tons of stuff in the original (blacknote) keys, ie Don't Believe A Word in Ab/G# and other stuff that at some point go down to that beautiful open E (if you take a bit of trouble and retune them)! Seething in the south! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alyctes Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Had a guitarist leave over tunings. We should have chosen our songs more carefully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameronj279 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 (edited) Can't say I have. I've almost always played 5 strings so never really had a problem with the tunings of guitars. Edit - I've left a band because if guitarists not owning a tuner/refusing to use one because "my ears are better". Edited February 28, 2015 by Cameronj279 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Yes, I have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RhysP Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I've left a band because they started saying they wanted me to play a five string & I had absolutely no intention of doing so, especially when there was nothing about the music that needed it. I'd have no problem with tuning down a semitone or something similar if it was required though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Badderer Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 why would a band not doing things in a tuning that you want cause you to leave?? I'm a bit puzzled and in no way being critical. Surely the tuning chosen should best reflect the overall sound of the song based on all the band members abilities. I believe the person with most say in tuning selected is the vocalist. The song must work in their range or you're on a hiding to nothing. Then it's a discussion between The rest of the band to make sure the song works in the range of keys they can sing it in... i.e. there's no point playing the song 1 semi-tone too high or low that makes the song a complete pig to play for someone. If you can move the song by half a step in 1 direction or another to make it easier to play, you'll get a much better overall performance from the whole band. Surely that is the most important choice with tuning. Can the singer sing it and can the instrumentalists play in well in that key? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectoremg Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 I've been in bands where a female's had to sing man songs and we've shifted the key miles to accommodate - no problem with that, but I'm talking about for example 'Sweet Child...' - does anyone actually do that in Db?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Badderer Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 well if it's the key that works for the band and that's the original key and it sounds good in it then does it matter what key it's normally played in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Badderer Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 (edited) it was originally written in D if these chords are correct , and with those type of bands it's been fairly standard procedure to tune your instruments down half a step to get a heavier sound. So all they're doing is tuning instruments down 1 semi-tone then play the D chords.... sounds fairly normal? is it that they are mixing detuned songs with Non detuned songs and that is making it complicated? http://tabs.ultimate-guitar.com/g/guns_n_roses/sweet_child_o_mine_acoustic_crd.htm Edited February 28, 2015 by The Badderer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectoremg Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 I'm talking about a semitone shift to make it a bloody sight easier to play? Everybody seems to play Superstition in E (from Eb). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectoremg Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 Yes they're mixing a lot of detuned and not. I think the whole of 'Appetite for Destruction' was done that way wasn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rushbo Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 The only time I've ever had a problem was when a keys player wanted to do "Superstition" in the original key. Other than that, the beauty of playing a (generally) non-chordal instrument is that transposition is fairly straightforward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Badderer Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 My opinion would be. If they are desperate to do the Detuned instruments thing, then you all detune your instruments and play in the easier to play keys, i.e. playing in D but tuned down half a step. If they don't want to do that and insist on swapping between detuned keys and non detuned keys, the set is not going to work as you'll all be constantly changing instruments. you could do one set with detuned instruments and keys then retuned your instruments between sets and play the rest in normal keys. Seems stupid. If the guitarist is insisting on doing stuff in Db when the song will obviously work better in D then i would have a chat about that because it will effect the whole band because if one band member is calling the shots on tunings (who is not the singer) then the band won't work because the instrumentalists have to work together to make the best possible performance. My position would be, we either decide on standard tunings and play in simpler keys so the performance is better, or we downtune for everything and come to a sensible agreement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectoremg Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 Well said The Badderer, that's exactly the system I've used previously: compromise and make life easy. This guy tried to tell me today that it made life easy for the singer - really? In Phil Lynott's range? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 [quote name='spectoremg' timestamp='1425135224' post='2704360'] I've been in bands where a female's had to sing man songs and we've shifted the key miles to accommodate - no problem with that, but I'm talking about for example 'Sweet Child...' - does anyone actually do that in Db?! [/quote] Yep, a band I depped for does exactly that. So I found out, when I arrived at the first rehearsal with them, as well as now having to play it a fret lower, I also had to play it on guitar as the singer played bass on that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Badderer Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 [quote] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]This guy tried to tell me today that it made life easy for the singer - really? In Phil Lynott's range?[/font][/color] [/quote] The guy's talking total bullcrap. 1 semitone makes no difference to a singer as if 1 semitone is the difference between them being able to sing it or not, it still means the top note is absolutely at the top end of their range, so they're still going to be caning their voice to get through the song. 1 entire tone does make a difference as there's a big difference between a top F and a top G. Sounds to me like the guitarist controls the band and is trying to use the singers vocal range to control you. the person who decides the key based on vocal range is the vocalist... if the vocalist is insisting on Db then you should ask for the song to be done in C as it makes the song even more manageable and you're not buggering around playing in semitones. If the guitarist insists on staying in normal tuning then ask to drop the song to C not Db. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norris Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 We down tune a semitone but it's not so much about the singer's top range as making it a bit more comfortable to get through the night... and the next one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB1 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Cameronj279' I've left a band because of guitarists not owning a tuner/refusing to use one because "my ears are better". MB1. ...This! At a audition I'd used a Boss Tuner and offered it to the guitarist And due to his guitars volume he responded (after waving said tuner at him.) "No your alright mate,I tune by ear, you must be out!" ...and with that I picked up my gear and was! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0175westwood29 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 [quote name='MB1' timestamp='1425152299' post='2704592'] Cameronj279' I've left a band because of guitarists not owning a tuner/refusing to use one because "my ears are better". MB1. ...This! At a audition I'd used a Boss Tuner and offered it to the guitarist And due to his guitars volume he responded (after waving said tuner at him.) "No your alright mate,I tune by ear, you must be out!" ...and with that I picked up my gear and was! [/quote] i just make them not having a tuner a joke until they went and got one. andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismuzz Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I have 7 basses, purely because every time I join a band with a different tuning I buy a new bass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6feet7 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 (edited) No, but I turned down a band a few weeks ago because they played too many Thin Lizzy songs (I hate Thin Lizzy). Edited February 28, 2015 by 6feet7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I've left bands because of guitarists not tuning. So yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtcat Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I have left a band before because a guitarist would refuse to play a guitar that was detuned by a semitone (he claimed that only wimpy guitards tuned down as it made it easier to play). Ultimately I'll play any song in any key as long as it's the key that is best for the singist. I take two basses to gigs if the band requires something like Sweet Child in Db. I just use an A/B pedal so changing bass takes approx 4 seconds. In my main band a semitone on sweet child / forget you / higher and higher etc makes a big difference for our singer in terms of comfort and reducing the strain on his voice. So much so that we can do two gigs in one day if we drop tunings on just a couple of songs. Our guitard uses a digitech "the drop" pedal and it makes it easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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