Is the live scene dying?

[chris_b]

The live music scene isn't dying, but it is seriously contracting.

If you're feeling the "heat" and want to continue you've got to raise your game and get better than the competition.

[PaulWarning]

had a call from an agent last week saying the pubs he deals with were asking him for something else besides classic rock covers bands, so he thought of us (punk covers and originals plus punked up pop songs) Ska and Mod bands are popular too, I do think it's important to try and stick to roughly one genre though, if you try and please everybody you finish pleasing nobody.
Sorry bit of topic but sort of related, if pubs put on a diet of classic rock covers bands doing the same old songs folk are going to get fed up

[lowhand_mike]

find really hard to get booked round my way, we do get gigs and ones that repeat year on year but picking up new venues is hard, there are a couple of good venues but they book up really quick so its hard to get in the door

[Marvin]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1427876753' post='2735225']
At the risk of coming across as unsympathetic, think if you live somewhere "off the beaten track" then you really can't expect to be well served by live music and especially so if your tastes run mainly to bands from the US.

I know because I spent a year living somewhere like that in the late 70s. During that time there were a grand total of 8 gigs locally by known touring bands of which only 1 was a band that I really wanted to see. Most tours didn't come any further west than Cardiff which meant either getting the train (expensive and you ended up spending the night on the station platform as there were no trains back after the gig finished) or hitching (no one I knew had a car back then).

Fed up with all of this I moved to Nottingham, was going out to gigs at least once a week and all by bands that I actually wanted to see (and that was before Rock City had been built!)


And who actually GOES to see covers bands? From my own experience my covers band audience were either friends of the band members or people who would have been in the pub anyway. When I've been in the audience at a covers band gig it's either because I know someone in the band or because I'm there to check out the venue on a gig night. I can't help but think that the majority of the audience would be better served by a well-stocked juke box hooked up to a decent sound system.
[/quote]

I wouldn't argue with you at all. The location and demographics of where I am tend to work against me.

Small example, I went to Wolverhampton last year to watch a band I desperately wanted to see...by the time I got back in the early hours of the morning I had 2 hours of sleep before having to be at work. If I was in my 20's it wouldn't have been an issue and although I'm not old, it still takes several days to get over doing something like that.

[JTUK]

Was undecided whether to post this in this or the 'Slipping standards' thread but it is true, IMO,
to say that some bands seriously need to up their game.
The main culprits around here are 3 piece blues bands with minimal gear or show
as basically it is a a very capable gtr who has said everything he is going to be able to say
20 mins into the set. No lights, no decent P.A and all a minimum carry.

If bands upped their game enough, then these types would be the first bands to drop off and struggle to get gigs.
Then the better bands wouldn't have the low cost issue/effort to contend with when setting fees.

But...by the same token, you can't hold a LL/pub/Venue to ransom if they are going to be the only ones
taking the risk or hit potentially. Bands and Muso's are to blame if they don't get attendences or get
people to come down. This is of course, very hard to actually do, gig after gig, but you are paid to
bring people to the venue... and it is more critical these days than it ever used to be.
Maybe the Live music audience is getting older and can't afford or be arsed to go out 2 nights a week
but it was harder years ago with no social media.
I see a few bands who make a splash on the first gig as they storm it with their mates, and that gets them
a leg up with the venue who probably wouldn't book them otherwise on the strenght of their promo
so that is a double edged sword as well, when they come back and can't hold the audience.

For a pub date, I'll say £250 min and £350 plus if we do very well... but then you have to pick the pub that will 'honour' that.
I quite like doing a few of the better ones but as always, it is hard getting people to want to do them.

[Muppet]

[size=4][font=Calibri][color=#000000]I think the scene is changing but not dying. The gigs are still out there, but the bands have to do the work to get them.[/color][color=#000000] [/color][color=#000000]The good bands will get them and can be picky about those that they choose. [/color][color=#000000]But the bands have to work hard to be good, to target the right market with their music, maybe be prepared to go further afield AND be prepared to shoulder some of the responsibility for promoting themselves and the gig.[/color][color=#000000] [/color][color=#000000]And that doesn’t mean just sending out a Facebook invitation and a link to some Soundcloud recordings and expecting the venue to do the rest. The internet has made us lazy….[/color][/font][/size]

[font=Calibri][size=4][color=#000000]I know some bands in my area (both covers and originals) that have put a lot of work in (and continue to do so) and are reaping the rewards.[/color][/size][size=3][color=#000000][size=4] [/size] [/color][/size][/font]

Edited April 1, 2015 by Muppet

[louisthebass]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1427884387' post='2735358']
The live music scene isn't dying, but it is seriously contracting.

If you're feeling the "heat" and want to continue you've got to raise your game and get better than the competition.
[/quote]

Yep, agree with this where the "covers band scene" is concerned.

If the band is lacking in any area, they will very rarely be asked back (unless they bang the place out). There is one venue in my part of the world where there's about 6/8 bands (mostly pro players or ex pro players) that have got the place completely tied up.... In some cases, that's what a lot of bands have to compete with.

[JTUK]

[quote name='louisthebass' timestamp='1427907167' post='2735768']
Yep, agree with this where the "covers band scene" is concerned.

..... There is one venue in my part of the world where there's about 6/8 bands (mostly pro players or ex pro players) that have got the place completely tied up.... In some cases, that's what a lot of bands have to compete with.
[/quote]

I think that is good... as it sets the standard and if you can get in there, you'll be regarded as the same, treated the same, paid the same-ish..!!

[redstriper]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1427891107' post='2735481']
For a pub date, I'll say £250 min and £350 plus if we do very well...
[/quote]

Is that including PA and lights?

[Marvin]

Sounds like a recipe for a dull live music scene if you're going to limit who gets to play to a clique.

[JTUK]

Not hired in ..but bands are expected to run good P.A and lights and the better bands invest in a decent vox P.A
and lights anyway...but you have to treat pub gigs as loss leaders...or I do.

[louisthebass]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1427907827' post='2735778']
I think that is good... as it sets the standard and if you can get in there, you'll be regarded as the same, treated the same, paid the same-ish..!!
[/quote]

Agree - the landlady at the venue gets inundated with bands wanting to play there and won't budge an inch. The place is usually banged out on a Saturday night, so it's obviously a winning formula!

[chris_b]

If you're talking about the place I think you are, I've played there for over 12 years in other bands and doing various deps, but I just can't get my band in!

[blue]

[quote name='grandad' timestamp='1427820184' post='2734673']
Stopped last year after 10+ years of weekly gigging.[/quote]

Your probably not done yet.

Playing in a band is not like a traditional job where you retire at 65. Being in a band is not a work thing it's a playing thing and most of us that are really in it will play and gig until we drop to the floor. With the exception of serious health issue where you can no longer do it.

For example Johnny Winter and other rock, pop, R&B and blues artist are out there gigging until they die.

Blue

[bassjim]

...................ive been playing in cover bands for 30 odd years now. apart from a couple of near misses with pop stardom its all been cover bands playing in pubs,clubs and functions

ive noticed over the years that people who go to the pubs and clubs most who are aged between 18-30 just dont have the same interest in bands that i did growing up especially in bigger towns.

yes there are still young folks that are into it but its just not as much. also you can buy all this entertainment and booze for next to nothing and stay at home

i play classic funk, soul, disco old and new plus stuff you can dance about to from recent charts like bruno mars for example. i will go as far to blow my own trumpet and say the quality of my band and musicianship within it is very high. we do ok for gigs and money is between £250 - £350 with functions being the main big earner.

this has been more or less the template since i started. good players + play what they want to hear = good regular gigs.

I have played in a rock indie cover band at one point for about 3 years and that also had very good, high musicianship type players.same template but different style of music also = regular gigs

now if im a 18-30 year old punter and i walk in a pub with my mates and there is either a bunch of geriatrics playing staus quo badly or some bunch of amater have a go at it band i probably will leave.

the change from when i was young is that the young crowd would rather be in the pub with a sh*t band than at home watching 321 or the generation game and would have put up with it cause at least all the girls are doing the same but now they have more choice. be that stay at home or go to bar full of young birds with thumping disco music it doesnt matter as long as they arent being subjected to some old farts personal music collection.

Now you could say these days i am that old fart but i know through years on experience how to play,how to entertain and when to stop playing irrelevent tunes. never learnt how to spell though.

maybe we could all put our set lists up here and compare. might help us all freshen it up a bit. oh and another thing whilst I'm ranting........I never had an xbox so all I had for entertaining my self at home was my bass to practice on and my k**b!!

[louisthebass]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1427931852' post='2736129']
If you're talking about the place I think you are, I've played there for over 12 years in other bands and doing various deps, but I just can't get my band in!
[/quote]

The public house on the corner at one end of the Carshalton Road.... Yep, I've tried getting in with a couple of the bands I've played in - no chance....

[blue]

[quote name='bassjim' timestamp='1427989898' post='2736796']
...................ive been playing in cover bands for 30 odd years now. apart from a couple of near misses with pop stardom its all been cover bands playing in pubs,clubs and functions

ive noticed over the years that people who go to the pubs and clubs most who are aged between 18-30 just dont have the same interest in bands that i did growing up especially in bigger towns.

yes there are still young folks that are into it but its just not as much. also you can buy all this entertainment and booze for next to nothing and stay at home[/quote]

You have nailed it Jim, well I should say I agree.

When the 21-25 year olds happen to wonder into a club my band is playing, they usually ( meaning all the time) walk right back out the door. I don't think they know what we are or what were doing. And it's not because were an older band, they walk out on all live rock music.

Back in the 60s rock bands were a novelty. If a club had a rock band playing good or bad the place would be packed and everyone was more than happy.

For the OP;

Yes, the live rock scene is dying.

Blue

[mcnach]

[quote name='ubit' timestamp='1427808807' post='2734479']
I agree with the statement that bands need to be good, but I know we are good and I know a couple of the other local bands are good too. Even so, bars are just not entertaining live music round here. It's like they think they will get enough folk in with a sh*tty disco, so why pay more for live music.
Long gaps between songs is my hate and I continually battle with a guitarist with OCD., so I suppose we can be guilty of that, but I don't think that is the reason for the lack of gigs.certainly not in this town .
[/quote]


not just good, but entertaining.

actually, I know a local band doing VERY well, and they were not very good... but they were hugely entertaining. They're gigging all over the place now, because they have build a following and fill venues.

The bar is a business, a band could be great technically but if it doesn't make people take notice and follow them a bit, they are unlikely to do well.

[mcnach]

[quote name='lou24d53' timestamp='1427815107' post='2734572']
Will do neepheid...when I politely but firmly turned it down, the promoter replied back to me asking which parts I found to be unacceptable?!
[/quote]




did he?

don't be shy!

Unfortunately, your experience is not unique, we've been offered similar terms by a number of promoters over the years. They quickly stop calling us. WE haven't stopped gigging

Much easier to promote your own gigs, sometimes. We do that from time to time. INvite a couple of other bands we know and like, and end up having a really good time without idiot "promoters"... sometimes you don't make much money, other times you make a nice cut... but you ALWAYS make more than with the promoters that send you that list of conditions.

[blue]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1428003725' post='2737026']
not just good, but entertaining.

actually, I know a local band doing VERY well, and they were not very good... but they were hugely entertaining. They're gigging all over the place now, because they have build a following and fill venues.

The bar is a business, a band could be great technically but if it doesn't make people take notice and follow them a bit, they are unlikely to do well.
[/quote]

Ok, but then another issue is good and entertaining to who? Unfortunately whats entertaining and good is not universal.

I saw a 9 piece band at a packed club playing funk, disco dance music this past Saturday night. They were good, tight horn section, great key board player and the PA was great ( it was being run by my bands dedicated sound tech). And to boot out front they had a male and a smoking hot young female with great vocals.

Still not as much dancing as you would think. Now, i know the band does not have a huge following. I don't think they gig that often.With 9 members i believe the story is, with that many band members with lives outside of music it's hard to schedule gigs.

My point, I don't think it's as simplistic as entertaining and good.

Blue

Edited April 2, 2015 by blue

[Norris]

Standing there banging out rock while staring at your shoelaces is not enough. You need to play stuff that people know (for a covers band) but not stuff that every other band is doing. You need to give the crowd something to look at and engage them. Obviously there are regional variations as to how many venues are available, but if you ENTERTAIN the crowd rather than just play to them, it shouldn't be too hard to pick up gigs (IME of course )

[blue]

[quote name='Norris' timestamp='1428006066' post='2737058']
Standing there banging out rock while staring at your shoelaces is not enough. You need to play stuff that people know (for a covers band) but not stuff that every other band is doing. You need to give the crowd something to look at and engage them. Obviously there are regional variations as to how many venues are available, but if you ENTERTAIN the crowd rather than just play to them, it shouldn't be too hard to pick up gigs (IME of course )
[/quote]

In theory yes, it should be easy, but it's not and I will think about it because I don't have a good answer right now.

Something to look at you say? My case in point, a hot 25 year old female that not only sings great and dance but had a butt that was between a 9.5 and a 10 on the old 1-10 scale.

I don't know what it's like in the UK culturally when it comes to dancing, but over here most guys can't and won't dance, so it's mainly the ladies dancing with the ladies.

Blue

Edited April 2, 2015 by blue

[Marvin]

A band needs to connect with an audience, and that is as important as anything else.

[blue]

[quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1428006842' post='2737071']
A band needs to connect with an audience, and that is as important as anything else.
[/quote]

True, I agree.

But there is still a problem and in lies somewhere within the title of this thread. [i]"Is The Live Scene dying"[/i] My answer was "yes" it is. And because it is dying, that translates to disinterested crowds. What I'm getting at is, it's extremely difficult for even the best bands to connect with an audience that is not interested.

I remember back in the 60s where I would weasel my way into a club that I was to young to be in to see a certain new band that had a buzz all around town about them. I remember everyone there was super hip/super cool and I did not belong there. Ok, that is what we use to call a [i]"scene"[/i]. A band that create a scene, Very tough to do that now.

Blue

[Norris]

I'll admit that back when I started gigging in the mid 80s there were a lot more places to play. That declined over the next 20 years or so. Right now though despite a lot of people staying in at night,the scene has stabilised. We may have to travel a little further, but the gigs are out there