Is the live scene dying?

[JTUK]

I'm not really going to count them .... but in our local what's on type mag/fanzine, I'd guess there would be about 60-70 plus gigs per weeks all within about 45 min drive..and from recollection, that is probably quite a few more than in the heyday of say, 20 years ago.
I know quite a few people today who try and make a living out of relatively low-key gigs.

So, I wouldn't say the scene is dying

[peteb]

[quote name='AlpherMako5' timestamp='1456086963' post='2985307']
Bradford used to be ace for gigging. Now it's rubbish. You could gig twice a week and not play the same place twice in one year. I'm going back a while mind you....
[/quote]
Remember the Ring O’Bells, that big pub on the roundabout at Eccleshill?? Fifteen years ago they used to put rock bands on every Thursday night. It was a decent crowd every week (often rammed out) and it was like the start of the weekend for a lot of us. If I remember correctly we used to play there 4 or 5 times a year (as did you). The brewery saw how successful it was and decided to invest in the pub and ordered a complete refurb and then reopened featuring MOR acts from a booking agency three times a week. Eighteen months later the pub had closed (obviously the crowd watching rock bands every Thursday had no interest in 60s tributes on the weekend) and now it has been demolished and the site is a mini-supermarket…!

The live scene isn’t dying by any means but it is not as healthy as it was 15 years ago. There are still gigs and an audience for a decent band but punters have less money and tend to pick and choose more when they venture out. Pubs generally are doing worse and loads have closed down, whether they feature live music or not. And of course, breweries have made so many bizarre business decisions to ruin successful pubs (like the example above) that it beggars belief…

[blue]

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1456266484' post='2987340']

Remember the Ring O’Bells, that big pub on the roundabout at Eccleshill?? Fifteen years ago they used to put rock bands on every Thursday night. It was a decent crowd every week (often rammed out) and it was like the start of the weekend for a lot of us. If I remember correctly we used to play there 4 or 5 times a year (as did you). The brewery saw how successful it was and decided to invest in the pub and ordered a complete refurb and then reopened featuring MOR acts from a booking agency three times a week. Eighteen months later the pub had closed (obviously the crowd watching rock bands every Thursday had no interest in 60s tributes on the weekend) and now it has been demolished and the site is a mini-supermarket…!

The live scene isn’t dying by any means but it is not as healthy as it was 15 years ago. There are still gigs and an audience for a decent band but punters have less money and tend to pick and choose more when they venture out. Pubs generally are doing worse and loads have closed down, whether they feature live music or not. And of course, breweries have made so many bizarre business decisions to ruin successful pubs (like the example above) that it beggars belief…
[/quote]

Agreed, however;

Depends on your location to a degree. In the States those that live in small market areas gigs are tough to find.

In the bigger market area there's work but you have to work for it, making the right calls, getting your band rebooked as soon as possible have plans in place to get booked for as many paying fairs and festivals as you can.


But It's not like it use to be. I remember a time back in the mid 60s a band could work 5 nights a week. And you didn't have to be good.

Blue

Edited February 23, 2016 by blue

[blue]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1427908022' post='2735783']
Not hired in ..but bands are expected to run good P.A and lights and the better bands invest in a decent vox P.A
and lights anyway...but you have to treat pub gigs as loss leaders...or I do.
[/quote]

A decent PA and nice lighting can do wonders for a band.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='RockfordStone' timestamp='1456161048' post='2986090']

once i had "i'm not playing there cos i heard some drunk guy knocked someone's guitar over"...
[/quote]


If your playing bars,that's a risk you take at every gig.

Blue

[RockfordStone]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1456272385' post='2987379']
If your playing bars,that's a risk you take at every gig.

Blue
[/quote]
exactly, regardless of where you play there is a chance gear will get damaged, stolen or the gig will be just sh*t. if you are so worried about preventing any of those you just won't gig. that's what i have found with a number of my past bands.

i've played some real dives, and am happy to continue doing so to play gigs, but some musicians now won't do that

[blue]

[quote name='RockfordStone' timestamp='1456310800' post='2987591']

exactly, regardless of where you play there is a chance gear will get damaged, stolen or the gig will be just sh*t. if you are so worried about preventing any of those you just won't gig. that's what i have found with a number of my past bands.

i've played some real dives, and am happy to continue doing so to play gigs, but some musicians now won't do that
[/quote]

In the States the 4 hour bar gig can be draining. It's not for everyone. I'm still happy playing them as well.

Blue

[sunburstjazz1967]

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1456156934' post='2986027']


Ahh, I know the sort, always calling up the venue ahead of time, insisting that they hire out a bunch of DB wedges
[/quote]

Lol

[Bassjon]

2 great venues have shut down in Nottingham this week.

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Bassjon' timestamp='1456605684' post='2990753']
2 great venues have shut down in Nottingham this week.
[/quote]

What's the other one? I only know of one, and IMO it could hardly be called great...

[cheddatom]

I played two pubs this weekend. Both small affairs but both paying good money for 2 x 45min sets of original music. Both will have us back. The live scene is not dying IME

[skampino]

There's loads of live music venues in Hampshire. Fareham. Gosport & Portsmouth probably have the most with more cropping up for covers bands. Always packed in the venues we play at and the audience is a mixture of ages. I suppose it depends on what you play and whether the venue is recognised for live music as to the capacity watching a band.

[quote name='JamesBass' timestamp='1456228909' post='2986776']
It's not dying, it's just changed. Original bands don't seem to work as hard - majority of the time, or they'll work hard to a point where they gig every week locally but not venture further afield. The cover bands that are young usually end up changing in to original bands over time, thus not playing the pubs and venues they used to as they look for the original band route. Which leaves you with the weekend hobbyist band - usually older gentlemen and ladies, playing a set that harks back to their youth and the clientele's, whom are of a similar age to the band.

Certainly around Portsmouth there are the venues and bands to have a thriving scene, but there's not the organisation and communication to go with it. The pub scene is pretty busy, in fact I'd say it's grown, but it's not young bands that play the pubs as most of the time they're playing original material that just doesn't suit the pub scene.

I think it's also down to disposable income. I'm 22 and work 2 jobs, one is as a musician and teacher, and the other is in a supermarket to provide me with the foundations to pay bills etc. In Portsmouth rent is on the lower side of things, you're talking about £700PM for a 2 bed flat/small house with bills, now I can't afford to run a car, a business - as my music and teaching is self-employed, and rent a house on what I earn and then go out to what are expensive pubs - £4 a pint of carlsberg or london pride, that's the average price of most of the pubs I've played at, however, go to a wetherspoons and you get a drink for half that-ish, and that's what a lot of my friends do as most of them have moved out now, or they'll have one big weekend a month spending £150-£200 on a night out, including a meal with their partner/mates and going to the clubs where they can dance or try to pick up women, they value a lively night out rather than sitting in a pub listening to bands play the same old same old.

Live music is in a real catch 22 place right now. Pubs are shutting, and grass roots original music doesn't pay and the venues are also shutting, those venues that do live on are usually the ones that know that their clientele want a certain type of music and if there are already 10 bands that play that pub over the year and pack it out, why would untried and young band 11 with a totally different set get a chance to see if they could pack it too, it's too much of a risk for the landlords these days sadly.
[/quote]

[ubit]

I have found, certainly in our area, that live music has gone in cycles. Way back when I was too young for pubs live bands were the flavour. We used to hear stories about these bands and dreamed of doing the same. By the time we had improved enough to try it, we had to make do with church hall dances etc, as pubs were all about discos. Our band went their separate ways and myself and the guitarist , after a hiatus, started out with a duo. We really took off and pubs were crying out for live bands. Now, pubs are back to discos or piped music, with the odd live band. I'm sure live music will come back but I'm not sure if we will be young enough to carry it off by then. Gotta hope

[blue]

[quote name='cheddatom' timestamp='1456835962' post='2992664']
I played two pubs this weekend. Both small affairs but both paying good money for 2 x 45min sets of original music. Both will have us back. The live scene is not dying IME
[/quote]

Based on 2 gigs?

Blue

[Dad3353]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1457480364' post='2999045']
Based on 2 gigs?

Blue
[/quote]

No, based on [i]two [/i]gigs his last [i]weekend[/i], not last [i]year[/i], both with return bookings.

Edited March 9, 2016 by Dad3353

[blue]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1457482321' post='2999052']


No, based on [i]two [/i]gigs his last [i]weekend[/i], not last [i]year[/i], both with return bookings.
[/quote]

Gotcha, ok, cool.

Blue

[cheddatom]

another 3 last week, Thursday, Friday, Saturday. Thursday was the busiest! But they were all well attended. Again 45min original sets and they'll have us back. The "scene" is alive and kicking!

[IBWT]

What I've seen so far in the music scene in Belfast is mainly:[list]
[*]Not very good (to be polite) originals bands with low attendance
[*]Talented one or two-piece acoustic sets all playing the the same pop charts in the same style
[*]Open mics which are basically the same as the acoustic sets but more amateurish and for free
[/list]
Apparently the local culture prefers acoustic sets to disco, which is good, but it also makes musicians kind of lazy in my opinion, because they prefer to play the same songs in the same style over and over and get a regular gig instead of taking the risk of creating something new and different.

The scene back in Spain is similar to what you guys describe in this thread, I think the main culprits are:[list]
[*]Too many low quality bands with low attendance, making the audience feel like all live music is crap
[*]Pubs/Managers not doing a good selection and just hiring anyone, thus enforcing that feeling in the audience
[*]Good bands having to play cheaper or for free for promotion, so people tend to think music should be completely free (it is scientifically proven that humans value more what they feel is harder to achieve and the other way around)
[*]Audience having unrealistic expectations on what an amateur live band looks and sounds like (some seem to expect stadium-quality sound and performance)
[/list]

Edited March 9, 2016 by IBWT

[blue]

[quote name='IBWT' timestamp='1457520982' post='2999244']


[*]Audience having unrealistic expectations on what an amateur live band looks and sounds like (some seem to expect stadium-quality sound and performance)
[/list]
[/quote]

I have found that the young 20 something's don't really understand what a live rock band is.

They might want to talk to their grand parents or google it and take history lesson.

Blue

[Dad3353]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1457550480' post='2999626']
I have found that the young 20 something's don't really understand what a live rock band is.

They might want to talk to their grand parents or google it and take history lesson.

Blue
[/quote]

In the same way that most have forgotten what a 'dance marathon' involved, or what a roller-disco was. Earth keeps on turning; times change. How clued up are [i]you[/i] about player pianos..? A big part of the popular music scene, now less frequently seen, but still... Aren't we all supposed to keep abreast of all these movements as and when they disappear..? I certainly don't, and don't see why the 'youf' of today would be expected to. Dinosaurs are dinosaurs, fit mostly only for museums (and good riddance, in many cases...).

[Froggy]

I'm with Dad on this one, guitar based bands are still popular, and still regularly feature in the charts. Other forms of music can be arranged for bands too, it isn't just djs and karaoke. If you want to attract younger audiences you have to play what they want to hear.
Of course there are also still younger people that like classic rock, but if you're going to restrict yourself to that you're going to find your audience is a bit older.

Nothing wrong with either approach, it's just an observation. I'm lucky that although I live in a small town in the southwest it's got a pretty good live scene with a pretty good mix of genres.

I really think you need to be prepared to find your audience. If people in your town aren't wanting to hear you, get in the car and find a town they do want to hear you in! I know we have lives and jobs and responsibilities, but you can't always expect people to come to you.

All that said however, I have no experience of actually gigging, just my own experience as a punter. I've only just put my first band together and we're working on the set list, but rest assured when we start gigging we'll be travelling all over the south West if we need to.

Edited March 9, 2016 by Froggy

[blue]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1457551533' post='2999638']


In the same way that most have forgotten what a 'dance marathon' involved, or what a roller-disco was. Earth keeps on turning; times change. How clued up are [i]you[/i] about player pianos..? A big part of the popular music scene, now less frequently seen, but still... Aren't we all supposed to keep abreast of all these movements as and when they disappear..? I certainly don't, and don't see why the 'youf' of today would be expected to. Dinosaurs are dinosaurs, fit mostly only for museums (and good riddance, in many cases...).
[/quote]

Good point, I try to stay on top of new trends. Artists and new bass players.

However, just like when the youngsters try to "play" me, and start hammering me about the new flavor of the month, I have no problem responding ;

"I'm sure he's great but he's not relevant to me."

I'm not done with the bass legends from my generation yet. I'll get to theirs later.


Blue

Edited March 9, 2016 by blue

[ubit]

I think this current situation will be the death knell of more live venues. I can't see live music in bars coming back anytime soon 😢

[chris_b]

I don't know any pro pub/club musicians who are expecting to get back to "normal" this year and many of them are expecting next years "normal" to be very bleak.

[Bobthedog]

My local larger venue the MK Stables is apparently down £500k in revenues and in trouble. They are also fighting a challenge in the courts from local developers to shut them down. Sadly, whilst they are currently fighting and fund raising, it may be easier for them to close down. That would be a very sad loss.