Transparent amp wanted - no I don't mean see through.

[kjb]

I'm considering going with a seperate pre/power amp, probably an Avalon UL5 with a powersoft power amp.

However my prefered option is to just buy as transparent sounding head as possible, my options here are an Epifani UL502, or an Acoustic image either a Clarus or a focus.

I use an Epifani UL310 series 2 cab.

The idea is to just amplify my bass, I have a very versatile pre fitted to my bass, and I think that it's very easy to completely ruin your sound (without realising it), by over enthusiastic tone knob tweaking.

Anyway, has anyone any experience of the above gear.

I only play jazz and funk, so I don't need masses of power.

[thumbo]

Have you looked into Aguilar amps? I've not played any Aguilar gear myself but I've heard that it's transparent but not to the point of sounding clinical. Just a suggestion.

[stingrayfan]

[quote name='kjb' post='27600' date='Jul 5 2007, 07:55 PM']my prefered option is to just buy as transparent sounding head as possible[/quote]
Everyone always says MarkBass stuff scores highly in that respect. There's a rig for sale on here at the moment I think.

[obbm]

Epi UL502 is very clean. I hardly need to touch the EQ. Usually about +1 division on all the controls. Works well with the UL310, as you would expect.

[wateroftyne]

I have an AI Focus II.

It's absolutely transparent... If you're after 'uncoloured', it's right up your alley. And, of course, loud'n'light.

I use an outboard Pre (EBS Microbass) to rock'n'roll things up a bit 'cos I like that.

[kjb]

Hi

Thanks for all of your replies.

Yeah, one of the things that appeals to me with both heads, over the seperate pre/power amp is the lightness, they both have a class D power amp stage.

I'm hopefully going to pop into the Gallery on Saturday to try both, I've emailed Alex to check on the stock situation.

[MoJ]

You mean you dont want one of these?

[attachment=1069:beastie_IMG_1370.jpg]



Andy

[alexclaber]

I think your best bet is the AI Focus. MarkBass heads definitely have some preshape built-in and Epifani heads are SO expensive! I know a bassist in London who plays a Wal fretless through one with a UL112, and before the UL112 arrived he borrowed one of my Acmes - I got to try out both and was very impressed.

Personally I remain sceptical about the Focus having the power it claims but I'm sure it has more than enough power to push a UL310 to its limits.

Alex

[stingrayfan]

[quote name='MoJ' post='27735' date='Jul 6 2007, 07:56 AM']You mean you dont want one of these?

[attachment=1069:beastie_IMG_1370.jpg][/quote]
He won't be fooled by that. He'll be able to see right through it...

Boom tisch. I thank yeouw...

[Paul_C]

[quote name='wateroftyne' post='27648' date='Jul 5 2007, 10:30 PM']It's absolutely transparent... If you're after 'uncoloured', it's right up your alley.[/quote]


I'm regularly puzzled by this sort of remark, so don't think this is aimed at you in particular, but how do you know it's not colouring the sound of the bass ?

If the amp was plugged into a different cab, or more of them, wouldn't that sound different ?

If it was all moved from a room with a carpeted floor to one with laminate flooring wouldn't it sound different ?

Or if it was isolated from the floor?

Or moved into the corner of the room ?

If you played the first set up at "not annoying the neighbours" levels and then turned it up significantly, wouldn't that sound different ?

I'm sure there are amps which on a flat setting "sound" like they might not be adding to or subtracting from the original signal, but the process of amplification ( even plugging straight into a power amp with no tone controls ) must always change things, surely ?

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Paul_C' post='27747' date='Jul 6 2007, 08:22 AM']I'm regularly puzzled by this sort of remark, so don't think this is aimed at you in particular, but how do you know it's not colouring the sound of the bass ?[/quote]

Because if I A/B it between direct into the mixing board and via the DI of the head, it sounds the same. And that sound is also there when I play at low volumes through a full-range cab. Plus, that's what it's designed to do...!

It's not a sound I care for, to be honest. My bass doesn't have a fancy on-board pre. However, plug a decent pre/tube emulator into it... Shazam!

[alexclaber]

[quote name='Paul_C' post='27747' date='Jul 6 2007, 08:22 AM']I'm regularly puzzled by this sort of remark, so don't think this is aimed at you in particular, but how do you know it's not colouring the sound of the bass ?[/quote]

I find the best test for this is to play CDs through it into some studio monitors or hi-fi speakers you know well.

Alex

[alexclaber]

Also there's plenty of freeware out there that can give you frequency response, distortion and other plots through pink noise testing and analysis.

Alex

[d-basser]

man i want a see through amp now

[BassBod]

I'd also add Euphonic Audio - its got a lot of tone tweaking options, but also a defeat button. Paired with their cabs (not entirelt neutral, but close) I don't think you'll find much cleaner.....look out for second hand stuff otherwise its very pricey.

I'd love to hear some of those Acme cabs - one day!

BB

[The Funk]

[quote name='thumbo' post='27621' date='Jul 5 2007, 08:53 PM']Have you looked into Aguilar amps? I've not played any Aguilar gear myself but I've heard that it's transparent but not to the point of sounding clinical. Just a suggestion.[/quote]

I've got an Aguilar valve preamp (DB680). It's clean and thick. It's 2U and therefore the same size as some heads already, without another 2U for a power amp.

Sounds great to me though. Clean but not sterile.

[chris_b]

[quote name='kjb' post='27600' date='Jul 5 2007, 07:55 PM']I'm considering going with a seperate pre/power amp, probably an Avalon UL5 with a powersoft power amp.

However my prefered option is to just buy as transparent sounding head as possible, my options here are an Epifani UL502, or an Acoustic image either a Clarus or a focus.

I use an Epifani UL310 series 2 cab.

The idea is to just amplify my bass, I have a very versatile pre fitted to my bass, and I think that it's very easy to completely ruin your sound (without realising it), by over enthusiastic tone knob tweaking.[/quote]
As I discovered, if you do find a really transparent head and cab, you'd better have a very good sounding bass. Because, in theory, that is the only sound you're going to hear. I was trying an Epifani set up and it sounded terrible. It wasn't until later that I realised they had given me a crap bass to try it with.

[The Funk]

I always ask for the closest thing they have in the shop to my set-up minus the thing I'm trying out. It's not always feasible but it does help.

[chris_b]

....also, I think this transparent amp business is a bit of an "emperors new clothes"! What's so good about transparent? I'm sure my amp and cabs add all sorts of "gunk" to my sound, but I think it sounds great like that.

Edited July 6, 2007 by chris_b

[chris_b]

...... also, if you want transparent, make sure you get really good (expensive) transparent cables.

[EdwardHimself]

[quote name='MoJ' post='27735' date='Jul 6 2007, 07:56 AM']You mean you dont want one of these?

[attachment=1069:beastie_IMG_1370.jpg]



Andy[/quote]

don't be silly that's not a transparent amp! it's a transparent speaker cab.

[chris_b]

[quote name='chris_b' post='27871' date='Jul 6 2007, 12:27 PM']...... also, if you want transparent, make sure you get really good (expensive) transparent cables.[/quote]
.... or check out OBBM's very good, not so expensive, cables.

[lukeward2004]

+1 - OBBM's cables are crystal clear, transparent as you like and rock solid. And they dont cost a bomb.

From experience, the EBS HD350 and its older brothers are supposed to be very clean and flat - my bass tutor has the HD 350 and it seems very transparent with no noticable tone colouring going on....

[velvetkevorkian]

[quote name='chris_b' post='27869' date='Jul 6 2007, 12:25 PM']....also, I think this transparent amp business is a bit of an "emperors new clothes"! What's so good about transparent? I'm sure my amp and cabs add all sorts of "gunk" to my sound, [b]but I think it sounds great like that.[/b][/quote]
[b]You[/b] think it sounds great, but not everyone goes for the same sound. This is why we don't all use the same amp. Its not really that hard to get your head round...

[The Funk]

Your bass sound is all about the interaction of your bass, your amp and your cab.

If you've put a lot of work into the sound your bass produces and that's more or less the sound you're after, of course you're going to want to minimize the effect of your amp and your cab on the overall sound.