Passive bass musings

[40hz]

Cut a long story short, I broke a string at practice last night and stupidly wasn't carrying any spares so I used the practice rooms Yamaha RBX (tidy little bass). I was really struck by how clear it sounded in the mix, almost like the bass seemed to 'breathe' and 'speak' clearer than my active Modulus. I've also noticed this previously with my Fender and various other passive instruments versus the active ones I've owned. Actives seem to almost be less subtle. Anyone else experienced the same thing?

Edited April 11, 2015 by 40hz

[HowieBass]

There's probably greater opportunity to create a complex mix of bass/mid/treble with an active instrument which you can't achieve with a passive treble roll-off tone control - perhaps there's a smoother transition across the frequencies with a passive instrument as opposed to the potential to create unbalanced humps/troughs with the active which is what you're hearing?

[Chiliwailer]

I find that my Modulus Flea is clearer with the tones down, makes sense to me as the pre amp is so powerful, but I still get what you mean about passive v active and the difference in natural tone. Howie makes a good point.

I sometimes play similar stuff on my Jazz Bass and Flea, the Jazz as you say, breathes better, which I guess also has a lot to do with the fingerboard and neck tone too, but then I find passive breath nicely anyway. The Flea does other stuff well and is a beautifully unique and equally bizarre bass in my eyes, I guess that's the charm?

Edited April 11, 2015 by Chiliwailer

[40hz]

Absolutely, don't get me wrong, the Flea is a tone monster and the best sounding bass I've ever heard. It's just more 'imposing' than my Fender, but then it would be! . I also thought about cutting a lot on the Aggie pre-amp and try eq'ing from the head, so going to give that a blast next week.

Edit - when my new strings turn up!

Edited April 11, 2015 by 40hz

[discreet]

Having played a passive bass for decades and found it unnecessary to do otherwise, I'm now finding that active tone circuits can be very useful, particularly live, particularly when using an unfamiliar rig - you have options right there in your bass. But extreme settings don't work so well and I've found that very small adjustments are all you need in most circumstances.

If you have the option of using your own tried and tested rig live, then I'd say it's preferable to use a passive bass and EQ from your amp, with the usual provisio that FOH is going to be beyond your control anyway. Anything to make gigging less complicated has to be a bonus...

[Twincam]

Ive had two active basses and the only thing i prefer over passive is the lack of noise and interference, and the generally hotter signal they can provide. Saying that ive had very quiet well shielded passive basses.

For sound and ease of use i think in general i prefer higher output passive pickups.

[Adrenochrome]

No, I've not found that at all. Maybe the different instrument just sounded fresher to your ears?

[Chiliwailer]

One other thing mate, did I once read a post about your neck buzzing and that you wanted a low action? I find low action settings can stop notes breathing too, IMO my Flea prefers a regular action rather than low one.

I was just wondering while having a quick noodle on mine...

[40hz]

Yeah I managed to sort it out and get it low and buzz-less. I might very well try your suggestion Chiliwailer, always good to get some tips from other Flea owners as I still feel i'm figuring it out 5 months on. But also to be fair, I didn't mean the Modulus specifically, just active basses in general (my Ray34 and Marcus Miller were the same in this respect).

[RhysP]

I used active basses exclusively for over 25 years, but there was always something about the sound that I wasn't happy with & as a result I was always farting around with the EQ on the amp & the bass.

Over the course of the last couple of years I sold all my active basses & now just have two passive basses - they just sound "right" to me. Getting them to sit in a mix either live or when recording is a doddle too.

Edited April 11, 2015 by RhysP

[discreet]

[quote name='Chiliwailer' timestamp='1428752118' post='2744268']
I find low action settings can stop notes breathing too, IMO my Flea prefers a regular action rather than low one.
[/quote]

True this, and generally I prefer a medium to high action. Flea digs in like feck, so you'd expect his action to be moderately high. Having said this I'm enjoying the low action on my new Sire V7... better not get used to it, I'd have a problem getting my other basses that low.

[Chiliwailer]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1428760503' post='2744344']


Flea digs in like feck, so you'd expect his action to be moderately high.
[/quote]

Yeah, and the albums and live recordings are still full of fret buzz, I love it!

[discreet]

[quote name='Chiliwailer' timestamp='1428760713' post='2744345']
Yeah, and the albums and live recordings are still full of fret buzz, I love it!
[/quote]

I think people worry too much about all that. Isolated recordings are full of noise - but as the bass was never intended to be heard thus, it doesn't matter. All those little sounds, ghost notes, unmuted string rings and inflections are what makes the music what it is and proves it was played by a real person and not programmed by some git who doesn't know that bass guitars don't go below low 'E'.

[Chiliwailer]

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1428760355' post='2744341']
I used active basses exclusively for over 25 years, but there was always something about the sound that I wasn't happy with & as a result I was always farting around with the EQ on the amp & the bass.

Over the course of the last couple of years I sold all my active basses & now just have two passive basses - they just sound "right" to me. Getting them to sit in a mix either live or when recording is a doddle too.
[/quote]

I get you there. When playing with others passive basses make me play better in that I feel the grooves better and it's easier to lose myself in that natural tone that sits in the mix. I like that different players get inspired by different tones.

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1428761228' post='2744350']


I think people worry too much about all that. Isolated recordings are full of noise - but as the bass was never intended to be heard thus, it doesn't matter. All those little sounds, ghost notes, unmuted string rings and inflections are what makes the music what it is and proves it was played by a real person and not programmed by some git who doesn't know that bass guitars don't go below low 'E'.
[/quote]

Spot on for me too.

Edited April 11, 2015 by Chiliwailer

[LukeFRC]

I find that the input on whatever amp makes a big difference. Some amps don't like active basses as much I've found.

[grahamd]

Active circuits tend to scoop the mids, even when you add them back I find they don't seem to have the natural focussed resonance of a passive instrument.

As an aside Flea favours a low action, go figure!!

http://youtu.be/3ARZGwfhC_U

[Chiliwailer]

[quote name='grahamd' timestamp='1428793171' post='2744672']

As an aside Flea favours a low action, go figure!!
[/quote]

Buzz buzz buzz!

[dudewheresmybass]

I go through phases about the basses I use.
I enjoy my actives, and for the right situation they sound awesome in the mix, but these days I'm finding that I'm using the Passives more and more.
They seem to sit better in most situations for me and give me a more pleasant playing experience.
IMO ime etc.....

[Skybone]

Yup, after many years of thinking that active's were somehow "better" than passive's, I realised that they all started sounding the same, whether expensive or not-so-expensive, old and not-so-old. Tried a few passives out, and got such a wide variety of sounds, I haven't touched an active since (apart from my L2000, but that's always in passive mode anyway!).

[White Cloud]

[quote name='40hz' timestamp='1428736891' post='2744115']
Cut a long story short, I broke a string at practice last night and stupidly wasn't carrying any spares so I used the practice rooms Yamaha RBX (tidy little bass). I was really struck by how clear it sounded in the mix, almost like the bass seemed to 'breathe' and 'speak' clearer than my active Modulus. I've also noticed this previously with my Fender and various other passive instruments versus the active ones I've owned. Actives seem to almost be less subtle. Anyone else experienced the same thing?
[/quote]
I totally get this. It was the reason why I moved my Alembic on and switched to passive basses for a few years.

[tauzero]

The worst sounding bass I own is my one passive bass. Before that, it was my other passive bass. Five strings or more and active is the only way to go.

Someone wake me up when this is over.

[Marvin]

The last two basses I've bought have had active/passive switches so you can play in either. I think it's something that should be on all active basses.

It gives a lot of options. Luckily on these two basses if you set the active tone flat and then switch to passive you don't notice much if any difference in output or tone.

I only really use the on board active eq on a bass if I'm not going through an amp anyway, otherwise I set it flat and use the eq on the amp to make any adjustments I want.

[jonnythenotes]

Sometimes, the almost limitless pallet of sounds an active bass allows you to use works against you, in that you always feel there is a better sound somewhere else in there. It gives you a feeling of not being satisfied, or missing out on that elusive killer tone. With a passive, you are far more limited, and learn to make do, which forces you to create in a much more focused way. I have found after years of various active basses, I was relying on the bass to find me 'that sound', and sometimes I was lucky enough to drop on it...( this with ref to all venues need a different sound, and no setting suits all.) A few weeks ago I blew the cobwebs of a Yamaha BB 2024 after giving up on it as being inferior to my active Mike Lull. After a half hour or so, I began listening to the bass, instead of what was missing compared to the active sound, and I realised I was hearing a much more 'real' and open sound rather than that almost overworked and hyper sensitive sound I was used to from actives. Perhaps my perception has always been (without knowing it) that active basses had to be better because they had 'more' of everything. I have now deliberately painted myself into a corner, and have chosen to limit myself by using my passive again, and the difference is little short of amazing. I feel I am far more responsible for how it sounds, rather than a part owner of it. There is far more to active or passive than just the bass itself... It's far more about what's in your head than in the bass itself.

[40hz]

[quote name='jonnythenotes' timestamp='1428864073' post='2745449']
Sometimes, the almost limitless pallet of sounds an active bass allows you to use works against you, in that you always feel there is a better sound somewhere else in there. It gives you a feeling of not being satisfied, or missing out on that elusive killer tone. With a passive, you are far more limited, and learn to make do, which forces you to create in a much more focused way. I have found after years of various active basses, I was relying on the bass to find me 'that sound', and sometimes I was lucky enough to drop on it...( this with ref to all venues need a different sound, and no setting suits all.) A few weeks ago I blew the cobwebs of a Yamaha BB 2024 after giving up on it as being inferior to my active Mike Lull. After a half hour or so, I began listening to the bass, instead of what was missing compared to the active sound, and I realised I was hearing a much more 'real' and open sound rather than that almost overworked and hyper sensitive sound I was used to from actives. Perhaps my perception has always been (without knowing it) that active basses had to be better because they had 'more' of everything. I have now deliberately painted myself into a corner, and have chosen to limit myself by using my passive again, and the difference is little short of amazing. I feel I am far more responsible for how it sounds, rather than a part owner of it. There is far more to active or passive than just the bass itself... It's far more about what's in your head than in the bass itself.
[/quote]

Interesting stuff, well said mate.

[White Cloud]

[quote name='jonnythenotes' timestamp='1428864073' post='2745449']
Sometimes, the almost limitless pallet of sounds an active bass allows you to use works against you, in that you always feel there is a better sound somewhere else in there. It gives you a feeling of not being satisfied, or missing out on that elusive killer tone. With a passive, you are far more limited, and learn to make do, which forces you to create in a much more focused way. I have found after years of various active basses, I was relying on the bass to find me 'that sound', and sometimes I was lucky enough to drop on it...( this with ref to all venues need a different sound, and no setting suits all.) A few weeks ago I blew the cobwebs of a Yamaha BB 2024 after giving up on it as being inferior to my active Mike Lull. After a half hour or so, I began listening to the bass, instead of what was missing compared to the active sound, and I realised I was hearing a much more 'real' and open sound rather than that almost overworked and hyper sensitive sound I was used to from actives. Perhaps my perception has always been (without knowing it) that active basses had to be better because they had 'more' of everything. I have now deliberately painted myself into a corner, and have chosen to limit myself by using my passive again, and the difference is little short of amazing. I feel I am far more responsible for how it sounds, rather than a part owner of it. There is far more to active or passive than just the bass itself... It's far more about what's in your head than in the bass itself.
[/quote]
This is a really astute post