Barefaced Behemoth? Suggest a big crazy cab for us to add to the range! (And tell us why we should...)

[51m0n]

Mahoosive cab (Big 'Triplet' II perhaps) with a gigantically powerful power amp (at least say 2Kw) and a massively capable tone shaping preamp all in one obscenely fantastic box....

That really ought to be on the cards Alex

[Sven]

Not sure if this qualify as behemoth, but a really trully exceptional 1x15' runing on 4 ohms is something rare. Some still prefer the sound of good old 15' but most of 1x15' these days are 8 ohms only, which isn't enought to get most of bass head (all tube excepted).

A compact lightweight 2x15' could also be a real winner ...

Edited June 25, 2015 by Sven

[bigjohn]

Does anyone that wants a 4Ohm cab have any experience of feeling underpowered with higher impedance cabs?

I can't tell the difference between say 350W @ 8Ohm and 500W @ 4Ohm. In fact I've struggled to tell the difference between 4Ohm and 16Ohm cabs using the same amp.

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='bigjohn' timestamp='1435249356' post='2806999']
Does anyone that wants a 4Ohm cab have any experience of feeling underpowered with higher impedance cabs?

I can't tell the difference between say 350W @ 8Ohm and 500W @ 4Ohm. In fact I've struggled to tell the difference between 4Ohm and 16Ohm cabs using the same amp.
[/quote]

For me it's not the lack of power that's an issue, it's the added headroom that i get when i run a 4ohm cab. The low end gains a new dimention. This is very noticeable when using digital amps.

IMO and IME, obviously

[alexclaber]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1435315028' post='2807549']
For me it's not the lack of power that's an issue, it's the added headroom that i get when i run a 4ohm cab. The low end gains a new dimention. This is very noticeable when using digital amps.

IMO and IME, obviously [/quote]

Which 4 and 8 ohm cabs have you compared?

[Twigman]

I would like an amp that can run down to 2 ohms.......why are there so few available?

[Dan Dare]

Not a behemoth, but a 1x15. I love the tone of 15s for bass. Appreciate all the technical arguments about 12s being as good, but they just don't sound the same for me.

[Dan Dare]

[quote name='Twigman' timestamp='1435319995' post='2807632']
I would like an amp that can run down to 2 ohms.......why are there so few available?
[/quote] Because it's difficult/expensive to build a suitable power supply that will deliver into 2 ohms all night. Few people would pay the cost of such an amp and manufacturers couldn't cut corners/make them cheaply because they'd likely be bankrupted by the failure rate... Anyway, decent power amps are compact/light, powerful and inexpensive these days, so better to use an add on power amp to drive additional cabs.

[alexclaber]

[quote name='Dan Dare' timestamp='1435323109' post='2807695']
Not a behemoth, but a 1x15. I love the tone of 15s for bass. Appreciate all the technical arguments about 12s being as good, but they just don't sound the same for me.
[/quote]

There isn't such a thing as "the tone of 15s". They all sound different! Same with 12"s. In fact there are plenty of 12"s which many would think sound like 15"s and vice versa. The one thing you can definitely say about 12"s vs 15"s is that the latter look bigger. Incidentally we started out making 15"s!

You're quite right about the 2 ohm thing - something we're working on though...

[Handwired]

[quote name='Dan Dare' timestamp='1435323109' post='2807695']
Not a behemoth, but a 1x15. I love the tone of 15s for bass. Appreciate all the technical arguments about 12s being as good, but they just don't sound the same for me.
[/quote]Never worry about the driver size, you either like the cab or you don't.

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='alexclaber' timestamp='1435319755' post='2807628']
Which 4 and 8 ohm cabs have you compared?
[/quote]

More that i can name, and i'm not takling about BF in particular (only played a MidgetT, Super12T and Big Twin, so, not comparable). I've had and tried a lot of cabs in the past and the general ideia i got from them is that at 4ohms i can get more clean headroom from the amp at lower volume. You know as well as i (even better than me) that if you have two identical cabs, one at 8ohm and another at 4ohms the drivers won't be quite identical and the sensitivity of the cabs will also be diferent.
I find that these diferences were more noticeable when using class-D amps where the bass had to be turned up a notch when running at 8ohms to give more "weight" to the low end. I know, the physics say one thing, but my ears hear another I still prefer using a class-D amp with a Neo cab though

[alexclaber]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1435328693' post='2807785']
More that i can name, and i'm not takling about BF in particular (only played a MidgetT, Super12T and Big Twin, so, not comparable). I've had and tried a lot of cabs in the past and the general ideia i got from them is that at 4ohms i can get more clean headroom from the amp at lower volume. You know as well as i (even better than me) that if you have two identical cabs, one at 8ohm and another at 4ohms the drivers won't be quite identical and the sensitivity of the cabs will also be diferent.
I find that these diferences were more noticeable when using class-D amps where the bass had to be turned up a notch when running at 8ohms to give more "weight" to the low end. I know, the physics say one thing, but my ears hear another I still prefer using a class-D amp with a Neo cab though
[/quote]

I'm 99% certain that what you've experienced is subconscious user bias. At lower levels you won't hear any difference if the 4 and 8 versions are essentially identical. It's placebo effect.

[Owen]

[quote name='Twigman' timestamp='1435319995' post='2807632']
I would like an amp that can run down to 2 ohms.......why are there so few available?
[/quote]

Acoustic Image ones do and have no fan either.

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='alexclaber' timestamp='1435329958' post='2807806']
I'm 99% certain that what you've experienced is subconscious user bias. At lower levels you won't hear any difference if the 4 and 8 versions are essentially identical. It's placebo effect.
[/quote]

Sorry but no, it's not placebo. At gig levels you can notice that the 4ohm cab "breathes" more. Mind you that this may come from the lower impedance on the amp and not from the cab itself. I'm not saying that a 4ohm cab is "louder" than a similar 8ohm one, just that there's more headroom at hand using [u]the same amp[/u] with a 4ohm cab

[alexclaber]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1435333716' post='2807852']Sorry but no, it's not placebo. At gig levels you can notice that the 4ohm cab "breathes" more. Mind you that this may come from the lower impedance on the amp and not from the cab itself. I'm not saying that a 4ohm cab is "louder" than a similar 8ohm one, just that there's more headroom at hand using [u]the same amp[/u] with a 4ohm cab [/quote]

But what were these identical 4 and 8 ohm versions of the same cab? Without knowing that then it doesn't stack up. And what was the amp?

I'd bet that on many of the 4 ohm version the sonic difference is because the speaker has surprisingly different T/S parameters to the 8 ohm one...

And you said "more clean headroom at lower volume" in the previous post whilst now you're saying that "at gig levels the 4 ohm cab 'breathes' more". That's a completely different thing!

[Handwired]

[quote name='alexclaber' timestamp='1435329958' post='2807806']
I'm 99% certain that what you've experienced is subconscious user bias. At lower levels you won't hear any difference if the 4 and 8 versions are essentially identical. It's placebo effect.
[/quote]Room positioning will make a difference, for example if one of the is closer to a wall, try swapping them over and have another listen.

[3below]

[quote name='Dan Dare' timestamp='1435323358' post='2807700']
Because it's difficult/expensive to build a suitable power supply that will deliver into 2 ohms all night.
[/quote]

Peavey amps of an older era did just that e.g. Firebass 700. It was rather heavy and lacked power when faced presented with an 8 (6?) Ohm Barefaced Big One. Cost will probably be the main factor and the drive to lightweight kit.

[Prime_BASS]

Did you decide on a 4*12 yet?

[Dan Dare]

I'm ancient enough to remember Peavey claiming their amps would run into 2 ohms. Not sure how long for, though. EBS claim theirs will (I use a HD350, but run it into 4).

[Dan Dare]

Re. 15s and liking the sound of them, perhaps I'm viewing the past through rose tinted specs, but the best sound I've ever ad was 135 watt Bassman valve head through a 2x15 (with replaced drivers - Black Widows). Heavvvvyyy and bulky, but sounded fat, warm and generally brill.

[Telebass]

Keep it simple! Neo 2x18!

[Jus Lukin]

-

Edited February 28, 2022 by Jus Lukin

[bassmachine2112]

isobaric 4x12 there ye go.
Or 4 12" speakers back to back so it looks like a 1x12 from the front and go superbaric.

[Handwired]

Retro Six12, staggered drivers to keep the width at 600mm but 400mm deep so the height doesn't get the better of it.
I'll pay up front!

[cheddatom]

I've run my old peavey combo at 2 ohms with extension cabs, no problem