wishface Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 (edited) What do people think (assuming it hasn't already been discussed) of the recent change in the law, fought for by the esteemed sages at the Musicians Union, wherein it is now illegal to rip a cd for personal use. So, for example, I've recently been getting back into buying CD's, which i consider to be a good thing, as a fan of music. Unfortunately this law means that, if i want to listen to that content on anything but a CD player (which in my case would be my pc), I am breaking the law. To put those albums, brought brand new and legally from a reputable high street shop called HMV, I would have to rip them to download to my tablet and my mp3 player. This is illegal. Who else thinks this, to be blunt, is monumentally and arse-clenchingly stupid? EDIT: I hate predictive text Edited August 3, 2015 by wishface Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjones Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Seems pretty dumb to me that you can't rip the CD to mp3 files, when you can save the same album, of mp3 files you bought from amazon or wherever, to your PC, laptop, ipod, phone or tablet, without breaking the law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 I can imagine the scene as the Police dispatch worker gets the call. Send an ARU, Nobby Fishcake has compromised Beyoncé's earnings by 0.00001p. Ripping has always been illegal. As a criminal justice worker, I cannot recall many prosecutions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 It seems to me to be a pretty unenforceable law, so just ignore it. Most times you buy a cd off amazon they give you a free download of the album. If you buy my cd or vinyl off bandcamp then you also a free download, much like most other people selling CDs on there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ras52 Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 (edited) Eh? Isn't it the other way around? Ripping, like taping before it, had been illegal for yonks, but the government has recently said it is (or will be) OK to rip for personal/family use. This is the case in a lot of other countries, with the exception that there there's some compensation for the creators. The recent campaign by the artists' representative bodies has succeeded in getting something back for the creators (how remains to be seen) to bring us in line with general practice. Addendum, here's a summary from BASCA's website: [color=#006400]The UK Government introduced measures in October 2014 to change the law to enable people to copy copyright material they have lawfully acquired for their own private and personal use, under the ‘Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014’.[/color] [color=#006400]The EU Copyright Directive permits Member States such as the UK to introduce such exceptions into domestic law, but on the condition that rightholders receive fair compensation where more than minimal harm is suffered.[/color] [color=#006400]BASCA, the Musicians’ Union and UK Music applied for Judicial Review in November 2014. The High Court announced on 19th June 2015 that the Government had acted unlawfully. By quashing the regulations the High Court has now decided that the measures introduced in October 2014 are no longer in force.[/color] So it was legal from October 2014 up until a few weeks ago. Now the ball's back in the government's court to come up with a scheme that includes rightholders' compensation. Edited August 3, 2015 by ras52 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 I suppose it all depends on whether one cares to observe this particular 'law' or not. And anyway, does it matter what a swarm of hand wringing commie trade unionists thinks? The greater likelihood is that most citizens will be completely unaware of this change and it will make sod-all difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 So it's illegal to rip a CD so you can copy it to your MP3 player of choice, but it's OK to download said album and have it on as many devices as you wish? What a load of old dangly bits. To think that court and parliamentary time has been 'wasted' on this. Oh well, how else will corporate lawyers scratch a living? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorks5stringer Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 So, it is legal to rip a Minnie Ripperton CD then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wishface Posted August 3, 2015 Author Share Posted August 3, 2015 [quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1438621952' post='2835856'] I can imagine the scene as the Police dispatch worker gets the call. Send an ARU, Nobby Fishcake has compromised Beyoncé's earnings by 0.00001p. Ripping has always been illegal. As a criminal justice worker, I cannot recall many prosecutions. [/quote]Well not quite; you could rip discs you own for personal use (such as downloading to other devices). Now you can't. That's the point I'm arguing and that's the point that makes bugger all sense. In the last two weeks i've broken this law 15 times (allegedly ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wishface Posted August 3, 2015 Author Share Posted August 3, 2015 [quote name='ras52' timestamp='1438622146' post='2835858'] Eh? Isn't it the other way around? Ripping, like taping before it, had been illegal for yonks, but the government has recently said it is (or will be) OK to rip for personal/family use. This is the case in a lot of other countries, with the exception that there there's some compensation for the creators. The recent campaign by the artists' representative bodies has succeeded in getting something back for the creators (how remains to be seen) to bring us in line with general practice. Addendum, here's a summary from BASCA's website: [color=#006400]The UK Government introduced measures in October 2014 to change the law to enable people to copy copyright material they have lawfully acquired for their own private and personal use, under the ‘Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014’.[/color] [color=#006400]The EU Copyright Directive permits Member States such as the UK to introduce such exceptions into domestic law, but on the condition that rightholders receive fair compensation where more than minimal harm is suffered.[/color] [color=#006400]BASCA, the Musicians’ Union and UK Music applied for Judicial Review in November 2014. The High Court announced on 19th June 2015 that the Government had acted unlawfully. By quashing the regulations the High Court has now decided that the measures introduced in October 2014 are no longer in force.[/color] So it was legal from October 2014 up until a few weeks ago. Now the ball's back in the government's court to come up with a scheme that includes rightholders' compensation. [/quote]The rights holders have been compensated. I brought the discs legally. What I do with those discs privately is not their business IMO. The expectation that people pay for an additional digital copy is bonkers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevB Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Half the CD's you can buy via Amazon are sold with a 'free' mp3 download so it seems a bit nonsensical, end result exactly the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wishface Posted August 3, 2015 Author Share Posted August 3, 2015 [quote name='KevB' timestamp='1438630407' post='2835961'] Half the CD's you can buy via Amazon are sold with a 'free' mp3 download so it seems a bit nonsensical, end result exactly the same. [/quote]That's great if you buy from Amazon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leschirons Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 If I stick a CD into my PC, it automatically rips it to my library!! Can I turn that off then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Provided you don't walk up and down the street with a placard and a loudhailer telling everyone what you've done, the chances of anyone being prosecuted are somewhere around the zero area. I suspect this latest bit of legislation is part of a bigger picture that will become apparant as the years go by. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 [quote name='leschirons' timestamp='1438630903' post='2835970'] If I stick a CD into my PC, it automatically rips it to my library!! Can I turn that off then? [/quote] Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norris Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 You made a copy for the law? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectoremg Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 [attachment=197814:Home taping.jpg] Sounds like more greedy record industry bo£$ocks to me. And a desperate record industry at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Rock Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 [quote name='yorks5stringer' timestamp='1438626100' post='2835913'] So, it is legal to rip a Minnie Ripperton CD then? [/quote] Ripping Minnie Ripperton to Minidisc is a hangable offence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wishface Posted August 4, 2015 Author Share Posted August 4, 2015 [quote name='Norris' timestamp='1438633118' post='2836007'] You made a copy for the law? [/quote]No i used sh*tty predictive text Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 [quote name='wishface' timestamp='1438628195' post='2835938'] The rights holders have been compensated. I brought the discs legally. What I do with those discs privately is not their business IMO. The expectation that people pay for an additional digital copy is bonkers. [/quote] You can do what you like with the discs. Put them in your CD player, use them as coasters or substitute clay pigeons. The discs are your property and when you are done with them you can sell them on. What you don't ever own is the music/data encoded on there. For that you only have a licence to use within given parameters that ought to be clearly stated on the CD or the accompanying booklet. In reality though this new law is completely and utterly unworkable. If I was an MU member I'd be demanding to know who had wasted union money on this especially since it doesn't really benefit the kinds of musicians who make up the active body of the union as they are rarely the majority rights holders of recorded music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ras52 Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 [quote name='KevB' timestamp='1438630407' post='2835961'] Half the CD's you can buy via Amazon are sold with a 'free' mp3 download so it seems a bit nonsensical, end result exactly the same. [/quote] I've got autoripped MP3 copies in my Amazon "library" of CDs that I bought as gifts for other people - so Amazon have broken the law on my behalf! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvin Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 It's totally unworkable and sends out completely the wrong message. From what I read the whole issue was that the music industry said they'd not been compensated for loss of revenue from this new law (that permitted ripping). The figure was something like £58m. They'd have never seen that anyway. The result is that the industry had made itself look greedy, vindictive and actively going after people who have actually bought music. I agree with BRX, it's baffling as to why the Musicians Union got involved with this. I think their efforts would be better focused on getting artists a better deal from labels regards streaming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Funk Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 You can write to the label and artist to request authorisation to make a cassette copy or to put it onto your iPod. If every music listener wrote a letter every single time they wanted to do this, the rights holders would change their... err... tune very quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 I'm a Law One, Ooh baby, I'm a Law One. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfretrock Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 Uhh, you can still buy recorded music? I thought home taping killed off the industry in the 80s. I'll have to check these things you call CD and MP3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.