Wanting to go lightweight

[mrtcat]

[quote name='LayDownThaFunk' timestamp='1439050651' post='2839673']

Massive +1.

Pisses over BF and Bergs.
[/quote]
Having built bfm cabs and fearful cabs to a professional standard and also having owned barefaced and berg cabs I can happily confirm that this is not my experience. Yes the fearful cabs are very good but so are all the others and the barefaced and bfms were the winners for me.

Edited August 8, 2015 by mrtcat

[Jazzjames]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' timestamp='1438953917' post='2838957']
Two barefaced super compacts in the ad section. Only 11 kgs each. One is more than enough for any situation though
[/quote]

Really? I mean, if that's the case then fair enough. But I can't see how something so small can do 'any situation'. However, nice that you've found something that works so well for you.

Edited August 9, 2015 by Jazzjames

[Guest bassman7755]

[quote name='Jazzjames' timestamp='1439112842' post='2839999']
Really?
[/quote]

I did some calculations in another thread a while ago comparing a single gen 2 compact with my old peavey 410tx and 115 black widow cabs. In terms of raw volume displacement the compact was only about 15% behind the combined peavey 410+115 stack (which demonstrates the stark difference in performance between commodity/budget and high end drivers). AFAIK the gen 3s have even better displacement. You would need a decently powerful amp to deliver enough power into 8ohm to take full advantage of it, but having said that a mid powered amp say 300-500 watts will still be loud enough for pretty much anything except maybe an outdoor effort with no PA support.

I guess most people who use 2 BF cabs do so for the same reasons I do - to get some output closer to ear level and because it looks cool . I am temped though to move to a single G3 cab on a tilt stand.

In fairness this isn't just a BF thing - most people running multiple high end cabs of whatever flavor have probably over specced their speaker setup by a significant margin. I used to run an epifani 3x10 when I played in a very loud band (drummer used to hit with the thick end of the largest grade sticks) and it always felt like the speaker was on tickover, I'm sure I could have easily got by with the 2x10. I guess our common sense judgement about how much speaker capacity is enough has been ingrained from years of using older less capable gear than we have available today.

Edited August 9, 2015 by bassman7755

[Iain]

[quote name='LayDownThaFunk' timestamp='1439067855' post='2839800']
Don't see Jimmy Berg getting upset when someone doesn't like his cabs.
[/quote]

Odd thing to say given no one on this thread seems upset to me.

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='Jazzjames' timestamp='1439112842' post='2839999']


Really? I mean, if that's the case then fair enough. But I can't see how something so small can do 'any situation'. However, nice that you've found something that works so well for you.
[/quote]

Seriously, at my regular rehearsal space where they provide 8*10s of various brands I take along a single super compact and it absolutely cuts through. If you have a more typical fat and deeper sound two would definitely be better than one but again it depends how loud you need to go.

One is enough for me in a room against a PA, drums and a 4*12 100w Marshall rig.

Done loads of gigs in some of the bigger spaces in Nottingham and I never need more than one and don't need anything in monitors. Most EQ it gets is treble gets knocked down a little and the bass boosted a tad.

[chris_b]

[quote name='Iain' timestamp='1439118601' post='2840100']
Odd thing to say given no one on this thread seems upset to me.
[/quote]

It's what you say when you've been asked to explain a statement you've made. . . . which can't actually be explained, because it isn't true.

[chris_b]

[quote name='Jazzjames' timestamp='1439112842' post='2839999']
Really? I mean, if that's the case then fair enough. [i]But I can't see how something so small can do 'any situation'.[/i]
[/quote]

I think [i]any situation[/i] relates to the guy making the comment. Obviously there are gigs where 2 could be used, but we've had decades of gear which, as good as some of it was, has only been doing half the job. Design a cab properly and it can be [i]that[/i] small and out perform commercial cabs of 3-4 times the size.

It seems Alex gets criticism for the look of his cabs but I've never seen anyone say his cabs can't do what he claims on the web site. There are others in this market, but Alex in particular has moved the boundaries for bass cabs out of sight.

It's understandable, given what we're used to, but some bass players are taking time to catch up.

Edited August 9, 2015 by chris_b

[odysseus]

Another vote for Barefaced Big Twin 2 here. More bass thunder than you'll ever need!

[JTUK]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1439122830' post='2840148']
I think [i]any situation[/i] relates to the guy making the comment. Obviously there are gigs where 2 could be used, but we've had decades of gear which, as good as some of it was, has only been doing half the job. Design a cab properly and it can be [i]that[/i] small and out perform commercial cabs of 3-4 times the size.

[b]It seems Alex gets criticism for the look of his cabs but I've never seen anyone say his cabs can't do what he claims on the web site. There are others in this market, but Alex in particular has moved the boundaries for bass cabs out of sight.[/b]

It's understandable, given what we're used to, but some bass players are taking time to catch up.
[/quote]

Design of a cab goes to build as well... so I can't really see how you can get one so wrong and the other so right, but there you go. In truth, IMO, the recents cabs don't look so bad from a build point of view, but they are just another cab..

I also think the boundry out of sight comment is pretty silly and just because a forum stalwart sell or pimps a lot of cabs here in threads doesn't get to make them any sort of world authority. I think it is ridiculous to claim or even think that. Especially as the industry doesn't seem to agree either.... but that sort of comment or opinion stays behind closed doors, but I've heard it quite a few thimes.

Having said that.,.. if your big selling point is a light weight cab with an industry standard speaker then all you've done is make a light box.. If some people like that end result, then fine.
I get that to some people the weight is THE issue and the industry is lucky that manufactrures recognise that as a market but to imply they are a vanguard is a BIG statement and pretty detrimental to other cab makers out there.

The problem is that on here, you'll get plenty of people pushing them... and that just re-enforces to others who seen/heard/tried them, to think WFT..!!!
What you end up with is opinions ..backed up with little or nothing, a sad desire to be part of a club... or a wealth of experience... but that is about all.

Plenty people buy them but plenty of them for sale on here as well... make of that what you will.

Edited August 9, 2015 by JTUK

[LayDownThaFunk]

[quote name='Iain' timestamp='1439118601' post='2840100']


Odd thing to say given no one on this thread seems upset to me.
[/quote]
Last time BF cabs were criticised, Alex got super defensive and came out with a load of technical clap trap saying they are the best cabs on the market today. He then stopped posting has he was doing more harm than good in regards to company image. Put me off BF cabs that's for sure.

[Merton]

Here we go again ....

[Guest bassman7755]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1439125086' post='2840181']
... and that just re-enforces to others who seen/heard/tried them, to think WFT..!!!
[/quote]

Well group-think is everywhere e.g. the "class D amps lack umph" meme.

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1439136468' post='2840309']
Well group-think is everywhere e.g. the "class D amps lack umph" meme.
[/quote]

And also the 'Commonly available class D amps have as much umph as traditional amps' meme.

[gingerfish]

Cheers for all of the input guys. Sound will very much out weight my view on the looks of the cab. Keeping a healthy back is more of a goal of this move than having the coolest/poshest looking cabs. As I said, I was looking to see if anyone had back to backed TKS or bergs or barefaced. I get the feeling I will have to wait and see what funds I can raise and then see what is on the market or what is in stock with Bass Gear and Bass Direct and such and make some travel plans.

[CamdenRob]

I haven't tried TKS so can't really comment on them although they are very popular and I love the aesthetic options...

But I have played various Berg and Barefaced cabs and it depends what your tone goals are really as to which would suit you. IMO the Barefaced cabs are the lightest and the loudest (for a given amp setting) but I think that volume (sensitivity?) comes at the cost of tone... I like my cabs to be efficient and loud but not if the sound that is being produced isn't what I want. I find it very honky and middy... very loud and powerful but not a very nice sound to my ears, they don't seem to have enough low mids for me.

I haven't tried any of the Gen 3 cabs though so this may have changed in recent models.

Edited August 10, 2015 by CamdenRob

[JTUK]

Police squad and I went upto BassGear and did a mini review of TKS, Aguilar and Berg.

Basically, I felt the TKS shaded it with the amps options we ran at the time and I think I'd summarise
it as I just liiked the ceramic sound a tad better.
Not wanting to open a can of worms..oh well, I will.. I'm not personally convinced by NEO and I've used
more than a few cabs.
The sound is there, the volume is there, but the overall 'feel' seems somewhat processed to me.

How much this is an issue when everything is banging away...is down to you but I went ceramic TKS
as the sound worked and the cab was 10kgs to boot.
That solves my lightweight rig option

[Conan]

Can't we just be happy that there are a number of high quality bass cabs available these days that do the job (and more!) without getting into a pissing contest about which option is "best"?

We've never had it so good

[mikegatward]

[quote name='gingerfish' timestamp='1438939196' post='2838763']
I have been admiring your set up on the TKS thread and they are the ones that have tempted me so far. How do you find the S212 + S112 set up compares to a 2 x S112?


I am thinking due to the staircases to our practice room and the fact I only have access to a small car that two small cabs might make more sense than one 212. Might have to make a trip to bass direct and bass gear and try some stuff out once the new amp arrives.
[/quote]
I'm currently running 2 x S112's and am based in Wakefield if you ever fancied a short drive up the M1 for a listen. Will be taking them to Saturdays gig in Wakefield as well.

[Iain]

[quote name='LayDownThaFunk' timestamp='1439126498' post='2840192']technical clap trap[/quote]

Fair enough, as long as your reasons are sound and reasonable

I can kinda understand being getting wound up when people criticize the output of your hard graft and passion when it's not well founded but, as is oft the case on the interwebs, best not to get into it in the first place.

Currently owning 2 Markbass cabs, 2 Ampeg cabs and 1 BF Gen 3 I haven't got any real criticisms of the BF gear for build quality and, while it doesn't have the show-off orange of the MB cabs, it looks pretty purposeful. Actually, my only criticism would be the handle on the back of the top would make more sense to me being on the top of the back to make putting bigger stuff on top easier...

[Lozz196]

Aside from the weight and portability of the Barefaced cabs (I have two Super12Ts) what I really like about them is how little they colour the sound. Other cabs I`ve had, well they sounded great, but when listening to the DI sound through FOH it bore little resemblence to what I had on stage. Whereas with the BF cabs, well the sound is virtually the same (allowing for different speakers in the FOH). I want the tone I`ve worked to get with my on-stage gear to be the tone that the audience hear, and Barefaced cabs help me to do that.

[shpub]

My previous rig was a Peavey Nitrobass and 3 115 bins. Great sound but heavy to cart even though its modular and the aches and pains I was getting after moving the stuff was enough to say enough is enough. I had even considered building some composite cabs but came across BF. I've just switched to a couple of BF cabs - bought them from the BC classified.

They are really like hifi cabs and it took a bit of knob twiddling to get the sound that I like - I didn't realise how much the old cabs coloured the sound. That cleanliness is something I see as an advantage in that I can set the tone and everything from the amp without having to loose some of that control from the amp to compensate for the colouring. It seems to me that to get the best from them you need a good flexible eq and be prepared to experiment. They are incredibly loud and efficient which means the headroom is staggering even with a small amp.

All in all - I would say they should be at least on everyone's possibility list. As for the fact that they seem to be easily available.... compared to the for sales of TC, MB and others which lightweights that come into my mailbox everyday, they are few and far between.

[M@23]

[quote name='gingerfish' timestamp='1439156605' post='2840494']
I was looking to see if anyone had back to backed TKS or bergs or barefaced. I get the feeling I will have to wait and see what funds I can raise and then see what is on the market or what is in stock with Bass Gear and Bass Direct and such and make some travel plans.
[/quote]

They are all different flavours of great and will each offer something different. Bass Gear trip is a good idea as you can directly compare Aguilar/Berg/tks and whatever else they have in.

[Freddie75]

I've owned and gigged plenty with the genz benz neox 212t, aguilar gs112 x 2 and berg cn212 (all now sold) - and now own a barefaced big twin II. To my ear, and for my tonal goals the bf bt ticks all the boxes and I couldn't be happier. This is definitely a keeper for me and the best cab I've ever played through hands down. Thanks to Alex Claber.

Edited August 13, 2015 by Freddie75

[Japhet]

I'd have a serious look at the Tech Sounsystems 4x10 in the FS section. Huge capability and ridiculously light.

[hairychris]

WRT metal, I play in a band with an Engl Poweball into 4x12, Orange TH30 into 2x12, and a caveman on drums. Tuning is drop-C.

I use a GK MB800 into a Barefaced Compact (Gen 2 1x15). At 8 ohms the amp throws out 500w, and the combination is insanely loud and clean. We don't rehearse quietly and I am running at 10% volume, if that. I can also pick up that rig with one finger.

I've not tried a Gen 3 BF with the 12 inch drivers so can't comment there. Class D seems to work OK for me. It's true that tube amps have a something that the digital amps don't, but I haven't quite put my finger on it, and to be honest it doesn't really worry me in the context of the band as it is primarily guitar-driven.