Tips for getting a decent bass sound

[lateralus462]

Right here's the dilema - I am recording a demo with my band at the moment. Everything is sounding great except for my bass sound - I am super happy with my sound through my rig at rehearsal/gigs etc. especially since I fitted an east u-retro pre-amp to my bass, but the sound when recording direct to my pc (via half decent mixer/soundcard into cubase sx) is a little dissapointing to be honest. I have tried allsorts to try and get a decent sound but it always seems a little lacklustre. Any tips?

[stingrayfan]

Fresh strings and lots of compression.

[ped]

What is it lacking in comparison to your rig sound? How are you recording? You might find that a speaker simulator will bring the sound out a bit better because sometimes bass direct from desk can sound a bit 'electronic' for want of a better word.

Always best to record with everything flat - you can always add eq and so on later, but it is much harder to take it away. As Rayfan said above, a bit of compression usually helps broaden things out but I always like a touch of reverb too and have the bass panned slightly to the left, just off the bass drum.

You should buy my pod XT pro really ;0)

Cheers
ped

[slaphappygarry]

Try adding a touch of distortion (i do mean a touch). This will bring out some additional harmonic detail in the signal and will help it to sit in the mix.

The biggest bass sounds don't always sound good in a mix, and a great bass sound in a mix may sound rubbish solo'd up.

G

[chris_b]

[quote name='lateralus462' post='276859' date='Sep 4 2008, 12:16 PM']Right here's the dilema - I am recording a demo with my band at the moment. Everything is sounding great except for my bass sound - I am super happy with my sound through my rig at rehearsal/gigs etc. especially since I fitted an east u-retro pre-amp to my bass, but the sound when recording direct to my pc (via half decent mixer/soundcard into cubase sx) is a little dissapointing to be honest. I have tried allsorts to try and get a decent sound but it always seems a little lacklustre. Any tips?[/quote]
Digital recording, as opposed to an SSL desk, can sound a little flat and lifeless. Ampeg used to do an SVT software add on for digital recording or I'd try to mike up your rig.

[lateralus462]

I think I'm going to get a DI of some sort - probably the Behringer BDI 21 and see if that helps at all.

[ironside1966]

[quote name='lateralus462' post='276906' date='Sep 4 2008, 12:48 PM']I think I'm going to get a DI of some sort - probably the Behringer BDI 21 and see if that helps at all.[/quote]

Most basses especially passive ones are High impedance, most mixer line, or soundcard inputs are low impedance.
I don’t know what is the impedance of your east u-retro pre-amp but using D I box or the Behringer BDI 21 will solve any impedance problems.
The SVT software id very good also

Maybe you could try to Di straight from the amp if the amp has the appropriate outputs, also try mic’ing up the cab as well. I am sure you know that the amp and the speaker are an impotent part of the sound.

Also judge the sound in the context of the mix and not in isolation.

Good Luck with the recordings

[mr_russ]

I've used ampeg svx quite extensively - It's good but I still get a better tone DI'd and then re-amped through svx if it needs it.

Make sure you use a DI box between your bass and soundcard (not necessarily a sansamp or equivalent - a bog standard DI) - it'll make all the difference.

+1 for a touch of dirt - a little goes a long way, even if you're after a clean tone.

[johnnylager]

[quote name='stingrayfan' post='276862' date='Sep 4 2008, 12:20 PM']Fresh strings and lots of compression.[/quote]
Aye. The knob goes round that far for a reason right?

[Rimskidog]

What is it that you think is missing from the sound you are getting? Once you know what that is work out what you need to do to put it back. Do you mean there is something missing when it is soloed or when you have everything going in the mix?

If you are thinking of buying a DI I'd steer clear of Behringer. The BSS AR133 is awesome bang for buck.

[WalMan]

[quote name='chris_b' post='276894' date='Sep 4 2008, 12:40 PM']Digital recording, as opposed to an SSL desk, can sound a little flat and lifeless. Ampeg used to do an SVT software add on for digital recording or I'd try to mike up your rig.[/quote]
The Ampeg is [url="http://www.ikmultimedia.com/ampegsvxuno/"]HERE[/url] unfortunately you have to buy something else as well to get to the download.

I thought it had been on a cover DVD recently but can't find it at the mo. It's not bad for adding a touch of something else to a DI track

Perhaps try this - [url="http://rekkerd.org/frettedsynth-releases-freeamp3/"]FreeAmp3[/url] - not tried it myself, but its free & looks to have a couple of bass settings so..........

Edited September 6, 2008 by WalMan

[cheddatom]

In cubase there's a great plug-in called "quadradrive" which is an overdrive, but used in the standard "blank" position is basically an excellent multi band compressor - try it out. Everytime I record something in too much of a rush or have made a mistake and can't go back to fix it, I use this plug-in, on guitar, bass, drums, and vocals.

[lateralus462]

[quote name='cheddatom' post='280234' date='Sep 9 2008, 11:41 AM']In cubase there's a great plug-in called "quadradrive" which is an overdrive, but used in the standard "blank" position is basically an excellent multi band compressor - try it out. Everytime I record something in too much of a rush or have made a mistake and can't go back to fix it, I use this plug-in, on guitar, bass, drums, and vocals.[/quote]

I'll give this a go later - I've used this plug-in on drum tracks before and got excellent results, never thought to use it with bass though.

[cheddatom]

Let me know how you get on, i'm interested!

[lateralus462]

[quote name='cheddatom' post='280963' date='Sep 10 2008, 10:59 AM']Let me know how you get on, i'm interested![/quote]

Definitely an improvement - I'm still not 100% happy with the bass sound, but it sits nicely in the mix now.

Thanks for the tip!!!

[cheddatom]

Yeh no problem, I really love that plug-in but sometimes I worry that I don't actually know anything and constantly spout bollocks, which is why I asked how you got on.

[Dr.Dave]

Without doubt the best sound I ever got was a combination of DI , mic 3 ft away and 2nd mic across the room. That was a pro studio though. For smaller set ups I think a speaker sim - or a combination of speaker sim and flat DI would be fine.

My home recordings were done with the bass DI'd into my boss digital multitraker and using one of the internal patches. Absolute tiny smidge of room reverb - sorted.

[lateralus462]

[quote name='cheddatom' post='281100' date='Sep 10 2008, 02:11 PM']Yeh no problem, I really love that plug-in but sometimes I worry that I don't actually know anything and constantly spout bollocks, which is why I asked how you got on.[/quote]

No worries - that plug in is brilliant, so no bollocks there.

I know what you mean though - this is part of the latest demo I'm producing for my band. They seem really happy with the results, but I'm kinda feeling out of my depth with it (strange really cos I studied Music Technology at college so I do kind of know what I'm doing - a 4 song demo shouldn't be that taxing).

I haven't done much recording over the last 5 years or so and I've kind of been chucked back in at the deep end, which is cool but I'm kinda second guessing myself on everything. I guess the important thing is to trust your ears - if it sounds right then it probably is!! (although now I'm thinking maybe I've got something wrong with my ears and it's going to sound sh*t to everone else)

If you can't tell, I'm suffering from an extreme lack of confidence in my abilities at the moment.

Edited September 10, 2008 by lateralus462

[cheddatom]

Don't worry - I get the same feelings every time I do a demo. The best thing to do is just keep on comparing to a proffessional disc to reassure yourself. If you want any help you could post up some examples for opinions, or if you're not that into mixing it, upload the data and i'll have a crack at it.


Dr Dave - i've done similar things. I got a great sound recording a DI, an SM58 on my cabs about 2 feet away, and a condensor about 6 feet away. I think it only works when the room sounds good though.

[lateralus462]

[quote name='cheddatom' post='281191' date='Sep 10 2008, 03:49 PM']Don't worry - I get the same feelings every time I do a demo. The best thing to do is just keep on comparing to a proffessional disc to reassure yourself. If you want any help you could post up some examples for opinions, or if you're not that into mixing it, upload the data and i'll have a crack at it.


Dr Dave - i've done similar things. I got a great sound recording a DI, an SM58 on my cabs about 2 feet away, and a condensor about 6 feet away. I think it only works when the room sounds good though.[/quote]

Thanks Dude - it would be good to get a second opinion on it - I'll upload a rough mix when I get a chance.

[lateralus462]

Right - I've uploaded the track to our myspace [url="http://www.myspace.com/withinourrights"]http://www.myspace.com/withinourrights[/url] - the song's called 'Just a shadow'

Let me know what you think

[dr.funk]

[quote name='WalMan' post='278891' date='Sep 6 2008, 11:51 PM']Perhaps try this - [url="http://rekkerd.org/frettedsynth-releases-freeamp3/"]FreeAmp3[/url] - not tried it myself, but its free & looks to have a couple of bass settings so..........[/quote]

I have used the last two incarnations of freeamp and the 3rd one is definitely the best for bass. Not sure it excels at clean tones but I love some of the distorted sounds you can get out of it, great fun for shredding along or really over the top solos.

It does have an SVT preset but I can't really gauge how accurate it is. Doesn't sound that nice to me on it's own but strikes me as the kind of sound that might work brilliantly in a full band mix.

[kemra]

Just checked out the song on your MySpace and I have to say it is recorder beautifully in my opinion!

I'd even go as far as saying its better than some 'professional' recordings I've heard! Everything seems well defined and sits exactly right in the mix which I think can be a difficult thing to achieve at times.

I don't think you need to doubt yourself Lateralus as you have done yourself and your band very proud I think

[cheddatom]

I PM'd for an mp3 to listen to in the car and.........

The mix is perfect in my opinion. If I was doing it personally, I would do things a little differently, but it wouldn't be any better. I think the mix really is spot on, you wouldn't want the bass to cut through any more than it does, the guitar sound is nice, the vocals sound REALLY good, overall it gels really well.

As far as the music goes - you have a really good singer there. I would have had a full drum kit come in half way through and turned it into a rock-power balled type of thingy - it could make a good single! The chord progressions are really strong, and the bassline fits to it really well. Nice one!

[lateralus462]

[quote name='cheddatom' post='281828' date='Sep 11 2008, 01:34 PM']I PM'd for an mp3 to listen to in the car and.........

The mix is perfect in my opinion. If I was doing it personally, I would do things a little differently, but it wouldn't be any better. I think the mix really is spot on, you wouldn't want the bass to cut through any more than it does, the guitar sound is nice, the vocals sound REALLY good, overall it gels really well.

As far as the music goes - you have a really good singer there. I would have had a full drum kit come in half way through and turned it into a rock-power balled type of thingy - it could make a good single! The chord progressions are really strong, and the bassline fits to it really well. Nice one![/quote]

Cheers mate glad you like it - it's good to hear other peoples opinions on this, just for a sanity check.

Live we do exactly that - Drums come in halfway through just on the high hat and bass drum (second verse) and the drummer does some stuff on the Toms/snare during the chorus which works nicely. To be honest the only reason it's not like that on this version is the drummer was on holiday while I was recording this. I may take the chance to add some drums to it when we do the next couple of tracks, which are with the full band and a lot heavier. (I'm sure I'll be back on here asking for advice with the next ones as well!!!)

Thanks for listening