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RickenFakers

Happy Jack

By Happy Jack,
in Bass Guitars

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SJA Collaborator

SJA

Posted
Posted

that's it- it's got me gassing for a blueburst Rick or copy now- particularly that Greco rick copy a Talkbasser posted pics of.

I'd prefer the pickguardian plate to have the raised bit in line with the 2 small screws to make a thumb resting point.

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Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

Posted
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Here's a couple:

A Rockinbetter - don't see the appeal of these at all:
[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=250173811907"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...em=250173811907[/url]

And tbh, I don't know if I buy the Tokai "connection" - it doesn't say Tokai anywhere on the bass, and besides, they tend to build accurate copies. Which this isn't.

And a bolt neck vintage no-name:
[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=300179674002"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...em=300179674002[/url]

I think it's actually a Hondo - the body looks ply, and it has one of those blobby, Korean-looking neckplates. Wonder what it says under the paper "logo" on the trc? £200 is way too much for a Hondo.

J.

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Musky Proficient

Musky

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[quote name='SJA' post='100418' date='Dec 6 2007, 06:19 PM']BTW, Bassassin, is Lemmy's maple board Rick (with the star inlays) a real Rickenbacker?

did they actually do maple board 4001/4003's?

I know they did a maple 4004 cheyenne/laredo or whatever it was.[/quote]

I don't think anyone actually knows with any certainty what it is - including Lemmy.

The story goes that he bought it off a shady character who offered it to him at a gig. Rickenbacker didn't offer 4001's with maple necks as standard, so it could be a custom, modified or a copy - though I believe Jon had doubts about any copies with those specs either.

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Musky Proficient

Musky

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[quote name='SJA' post='100418' date='Dec 6 2007, 06:19 PM']BTW, Bassassin, is Lemmy's maple board Rick (with the star inlays) a real Rickenbacker?

did they actually do maple board 4001/4003's?

I know they did a maple 4004 cheyenne/laredo or whatever it was.[/quote]

I don't think anyone actually knows with any certainty what it is - including Lemmy.

The story goes that he bought it off a shady character who offered it to him at a gig. Rickenbacker didn't offer 4001's with maple necks as standard, so it could be a custom, modified or a copy - though I believe Jon had doubts about any copies with those specs either.

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Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

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[quote name='SJA' post='100418' date='Dec 6 2007, 06:19 PM']BTW, Bassassin, is Lemmy's maple board Rick (with the star inlays) a real Rickenbacker?

did they actually do maple board 4001/4003's?

I know they did a maple 4004 cheyenne/laredo or whatever it was.[/quote]

This came up a few months ago - here's the old thread:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1379"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1379[/url]

Looking at that pic again, the board's much paler than the rest of the bass & makes me wonder if it hasn't been replaced.

J.

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Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

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Here's a Cimar, in Austria:

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260191062812"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...em=260191062812[/url]

Now, Matey is obviously exploiting the Cimar/Ibanez relationship (both brands owned by Hoshino Gakki, fact fans) to try & pretend it's an Ibanez - which it ain't. This one's a Cimar 1949, not an Ibanez 2388b.

At this point, Hoshino were obviously sourcing Cimar-brand instruments from a factory other than Fujigen Gakki, and this particular one is actually about a gazillion times more accurate than its Ibanez counterpart - apart from the naff tuners, this one's very convincing. Nice orangey fretboard, narrow skunk-stripe, translucent scratchplate, it even has the binding gap behind the bridge. Wonder how many truss rods it's got?

J.

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  • 3 weeks later...
Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

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Good grief! A 70s JapCrap Rick copy:

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=120203908461"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...em=120203908461[/url]

Very nice nick & also very interesting - it has twin truss rods, like most copies don't. and it's somehow even odder to see this on a bolt-neck. I think it's a Matsumoku, the hardware & age (owner claims to have had it from new) would point to that, and some other Arbiters are confirmed Mats.


J.

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Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

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[quote name='Happy Jack' post='111364' date='Dec 31 2007, 10:57 AM']....I'd prefer a thru-neck[/quote]

Here you go then:

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=170181713050"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...em=170181713050[/url]

Although with that BIN, I hope it just gathers dust. This is maybe a Shaftesbury, Maya, Cimar or the like - but it's pretty battered looking & far from original.

Having seen a few neck-throughs with unadjustably high actions, I'd be a bit wary about buying one off the bay, I think. Unless it was stupidly cheap. :)


J.

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Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

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Hurry up & have a laugh at this before it disappears up its own absurdity:

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/LATE-60s-RICKENBACKER-BASS-MAKE-AN-OFFER_W0QQitemZ230208819469"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/LATE-60s-RICKENBACKE...emZ230208819469[/url]

It's a Hondo.


J.

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Musky Proficient

Musky

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A genuine Ibanez up for sale - [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ibanez-Model-2389bmr-Bass-Guitar-Rare-MIJ-Retro_W0QQitemZ140194948589"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ibanez-Model-2389bmr...emZ140194948589[/url]

Not sure I like the sound of the neck repairs though.

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Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

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[quote name='Musky' post='112149' date='Jan 2 2008, 10:39 AM']A genuine Ibanez up for sale - [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ibanez-Model-2389bmr-Bass-Guitar-Rare-MIJ-Retro_W0QQitemZ140194948589"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ibanez-Model-2389bmr...emZ140194948589[/url]

Not sure I like the sound of the neck repairs though.[/quote]
That's probably why it's not £100 dearer - these basses (it's a 2388bDX if it doesn't have a serial number ) can fetch over £500, just on the strength of the logo. Speaking of which - the original trc's not present, he's very careful not to show the headstock. Also bear in mind that this was a standard factory design by Fujigen Gakki - it might have never been an Ibanez.

Anyway, if I was looking to buy (at that price? Not a hope, there'll be one at the local car boot for £35 eventually) I wouldn't be concerned about the splits at the body - this is very common on real Ricks, so it's hardly surprising when it happens on JapCrap. It's presumably a messy bodge of a repair, though, which is likely why he mentions it. The neck cracks sound a bit more worrying - it's either been battered or it's had the truss rod hugely overtightened. I don't like the fact he'd sooner show an old catalogue image than any pictures of the damage.

Despite what he says, I'd be as concerned about the likelihood of a ridiculously high & unlowerable action, which is surprisingly common on 70s neckthrough/set neck JapCrap in the first place, and seems to be standard on these. I have seen a few of this model, and I played one a couple of years back which was practically unplayable above the 7th fret - the strings were being stretched out of pitch simply to fret a note. The neck was straight, and the saddle slots had been filed brutally to try & get it down, but it was still about 1cm at the 12th fret. The only way I can see to rectify this would be to rout a hole for the bridge to sit in. I'd always be wary of a through-neck example, unless I could get to see it before I bought it. Or it was insanely & absurdly cheap. :)

J.

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deksawyer Community Regular

deksawyer

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[quote name='Bassassin' post='115724' date='Jan 7 2008, 07:52 PM']Shame - but needs must, I guess. :)

Any idea who bought it? there are some serious/completist Ibanez collectors from Germany who post on the ICW forum - a southpaw 2389B would be right up their street! :huh:

J.[/quote]

It was Arni from leftybass.com. I got £350 for it plus shipping which was probably a bit less than I could have got, but anyway...........

D.

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markytbass Enthusiast

markytbass

Posted
Posted

I havn't read all 13 pages of this thread so sorry if this has already been mentioned, but has anyone seen the Indie Ric copy. There is one in a local music shop, I think it was priced over £500!. Also what are the Tokai copies like?. I have not long bought a Stingray so can't really afford a proper Ric (unless I chop the ray in or sell it).

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TDM Enthusiast

TDM

Posted
Posted (edited)

I've played a Rockinbetter (sp?) one. It sounded pretty good actually. But it didn't really look right. Especially the bridge and pickup cover. Isn't the rockinbetter made by Tokai? Or so the guy at the shop claimed.

Edited by thedonutman
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markytbass Enthusiast

markytbass

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When I spoke to a guy at Middlesbrough Music Centre he told me that the Rockinbetter were made by Tokai. Also Purple Turle sell the Rockinbetter and the title says Tokai.

I agree about the bridge and P/U cover. The Indie doesn't have a cover and as far as I can remember it had a P/J bass bridge.

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Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

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I played the Indie at Music Live '06 - it was, for the money, complete rubbish. It felt cheap & tacky, if it had been £120, no problem but £500 was a complete pisstake. I also met & chatted to "Mr Indie Guitars" about it & he was really quite cynical, basically saying it's half the price of a real one, so people will buy it anyway despite it being cheap & nasty. He also had no idea about RIC's design trademarks & their aggressive protection thereof. The fact it no longer seems to be part of the Indie range would suggest he's found out.

The Rockinbetter does seem to be connected to Tokai, but doesn't seem to be in their catalogues at all. It looks a little more authentic than the Indie, it has the correct headstock & I think is neck-through. There's also a copy made by Shine, which sometimes pops up on Euro Ebay branded as Johnson. Apart from having a not very Rickish headstock, it's probably the most accurate, having a big Rick type tailpiece/bridge, convincing looking bridge pup cover & surround, and is fitted with Seymour Duncan's Rick upgrade pickups.

None of them look the part as well as a 70s JapCrap effort, and are all likely to be dearer too.

J

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  • 2 weeks later...
Musky Proficient

Musky

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Least we forget this thread:

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Rickenbacker-Bass-4001-vintage_W0QQitemZ300193359818"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Rickenbacker-Bass-40...emZ300193359818[/url]

This seller claims to "believe this to be a 4001", but posts up a picture making it very difficult to figure out exactly what it is. The tuners are definitely not Rick though, and look like the sort of generic ones that a lot of Mats used to sport.

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Bassassin Grand Master

Bassassin

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It is hard to be 100% sure from such a (deliberately?) unclear photo - but I'd say copy. First of all, the pinky/yellow Fireglo is very un-Rickish, genuine basses from this era tend to have darkened quite a lot, and wouldn't have been so garish to start with. Also the colour of the fretboard wood isn't much like the orangey rosewood Ricks have.

Moving on, the curve of the scratchplate follows the contour of the body curve - look at a genuine Rick & you'll see the two edges don't run parallel like this. I think you're right about the tuners, although I'm not sure here - remember Ricks pre-75 (ish) had Grovers, with smaller & squarer keys. Also, the truss rod cover doesn't look like it even says "Rickenbacker" on it, does it?

Anyway - I've sent him a request for more pics - I've asked to see the headstock, tuners, jackplate, truss adjusters etc. If he doesn't send them - it's a fake & he knows it!

J.

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Happy Jack Grand Master

Happy Jack

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Total feedback of 8, with no activity at all since May'05, and he pops up selling an expensive bass with a single, poor-quality photograph. Oh yes, and his Pay-Pal (sorry, that should be "Pay-Pall") has been hacked. So he gets your dosh long before you see his bass, unless you happen to live close to Norfolk, though he doesn't actually mention [i]where[/i] in Norfolk, of course.

If I were the gambling kind (which thank the Lord I'm not, sir), I know where I'd be placing my chips on this one.

:)

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