Raising small cabs off the ground?

[geoham]

My TC Electronic RS112 finally arrived this week! It's a great sounding little cab. Far clearer than my BC210 cab, and possibly just as loud!
I already got rid of one BC210 to fund this. Given Thomann's crazy price, I may even get rid of my other one and do it again. A BH550 in to two of those should handle pretty much any gigs I'll do. Though I reckon one will be fine for gigs with decent PA support, quiet weddings, acoustic shows etc.

The one concern I have with gigging with one is that it's really close to the ground. Any suggestions for raising it up that are better than a beer crate or chair? I know plenty of you play gigs with 1x12 cabs - do you raise them or just deal with them being on the floor?

Edited September 23, 2015 by geoham

[LayDownThaFunk]

Flight case.

[Guest bassman7755]

I'd look something like this, it actually works much better as a means of putting more sound at ear level than raising a cab off the floor and has the advantage of not messing with the floor coupling so much which is useful especially for smaller cabs.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Stagg-Foldable-Monitor-Floor-Stand/dp/B000YL952E

[Chienmortbb]

Yes if you put it on a chair you will ruin the mutual coupling effect that the floor gives and loose a lot of the bottom end. THe stagg stand works but oumight need some velcro on the head.

[mrtcat]

I used to use something similar to a gramma pad but instead of flat foam on the bottom it had a wedge. Worked brilliantly and cost about £4 to make.

[geoham]

[quote name='Chienmortbb' timestamp='1443034535' post='2871740']
Yes if you put it on a chair you will ruin the mutual coupling effect that the floor gives and loose a lot of the bottom end. THe stagg stand works but oumight need some velcro on the head.
[/quote]
Didn't think of velcro to keep the head on! The RS112 is a bit of a strange shape though (quite long from front to back), so this one may not work, though could be alternatives out there.

[chris_b]

The best thing I found for my 112 cab was to sit it on top of another 112 cab. The whole lot sat on a Gramma pad.

[geoham]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1443043878' post='2871854']
The best thing I found for my 112 cab was to sit it on top of another 112 cab. The whole lot sat on a Gramma pad.
[/quote]
This isn't helping my GAS for a second RS112... Only £180 on Thomann. I managed to get £165 when I sold a BC210... A possible no brainer to sell the other?

[Telebass]

I've put a set of lockable wheels on my Markbass Traveler 151P, courtesy of the bargain bin at Ikea. Job done!

[Muzz]

[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1443032568' post='2871722']
I'd look something like this, it actually works much better as a means of putting more sound at ear level than raising a cab off the floor and has the advantage of not messing with the floor coupling so much which is useful especially for smaller cabs.

[url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Stagg-Foldable-Monitor-Floor-Stand/dp/B000YL952E"]http://www.amazon.co...d/dp/B000YL952E[/url]
[/quote]

I've got one of these - great for when I had my 1515L. Now I use it to point the guitard's cab at his head if he's too loud...

Edit: actually, it's all the wrong shape for an RS112...the principle's good, though...

Edited September 24, 2015 by Muzz

[largo]

I raise my 210 cab off the floor by putting a 210 cab under it. Works a treat 😀

[Painy]

Big bunch of helium balloons tied to one of the handles?

Might not work so well with say a Trace 410 though.

[RandomBass]

[quote name='largo' timestamp='1443122289' post='2872487']
I raise my 210 cab off the floor by putting a 210 cab under it. Works a treat 😀
[/quote]
That'll never catch on. Lol

[TrevorR]

[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1443032568' post='2871722']
I'd look something like this, it actually works much better as a means of putting more sound at ear level than raising a cab off the floor and has the advantage of not messing with the floor coupling so much which is useful especially for smaller cabs.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Stagg-Foldable-Monitor-Floor-Stand/dp/B000YL952E
[/quote]

I've got a Quik Lok version... Very robust.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='Chienmortbb' timestamp='1443034535' post='2871740']
Yes if you put it on a chair you will ruin the mutual coupling effect that the floor gives and loose a lot of the bottom end.
[/quote]Only if raised by at least 2.8 feet. Still, I prefer a combination of tilting and lifting to aim the cab at your head. Tilting alone with a small cab can aim the mids above the audience. BTW, 'mutual coupling' is the technical term for when two cabs are placed together. Boundary reinforcement and space loading refer to when the cab is placed less than 1/4 wavelength from the floor and/or walls.

[Musashimonkey]

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1443271935' post='2873536']
Only if raised by at least 2.8 feet... ...Boundary reinforcement and space loading refer to when the cab is placed less than 1/4 wavelength from the floor and/or walls.
[/quote]

My understanding is the wavelength will vary depending on notes played etc, but what's a good rule of thumb for how close to be to a wall for boundary reinforcement? (I presume by your comment 2.8ft is the max from the floor..?)

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='Musashimonkey' timestamp='1443295666' post='2873708']
My understanding is the wavelength will vary depending on notes played etc, but what's a good rule of thumb for how close to be to a wall for boundary reinforcement?
[/quote]The general rule is to keep the cab as tight to the wall as possible. When the distance from the wall to the front of the cab is 1/4 wavelength you get a cancellation dip at that frequency, as the original and reflected waves meet 180 degrees out of phase. If the cab is, for instance, 16 inches deep that puts the 1/4 wavelength frequency at about 210Hz. Pulling it out further lowers the 1/4 wavelength frequency. There is a circumstance where you might want to pull it further out, that being a boomy stage. If you match the 1/4 wavelength frequency with the resonant frequency that causes the boom you can use the one to cancel the other. Boom generally takes place around 100Hz, where 1/4 wavelength is 2.8 feet, so that's a good distance to try.

[paulmcnamara]

Grammar Pad is good and I have cut a Wilko's cheap car mat to size between amp & cab.........

[geoham]

Lot of interesting information here, thanks gentlemen!
Presumably the 2.8 feet is measured from the back of the cab? I ask because the the RS112 has strange dimensions - it's longer than you'd expect, almost 20 inches from front to back.

[ambient]

Just angle it upwards.

There were some EBS cabs a few years ago that had handles that doubled as a means of tilting them.

I use the power supply for my PJB Double4 to angle it upwards.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='geoham' timestamp='1443388155' post='2874367']
Presumably the 2.8 feet is measured from the back of the cab?
[/quote]From the front.

[yorks5stringer]

I use one of these with my MB combo:

[attachment=201685:4259_1.jpg]

[tauzero]

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1443300735' post='2873751']
The general rule is to keep the cab as tight to the wall as possible. When the distance from the wall to the front of the cab is 1/4 wavelength you get a cancellation dip at that frequency, as the original and reflected waves meet 180 degrees out of phase.
[/quote]

Does a rear port make any difference to that? A little thinking (which is possibly less than the minimum required) suggests that it would actually exacerbate the problem as the out-of-phase sound from the rear port would be additive with the sound from the front.

[51m0n]

I put my whole rig on a hopup (big square one from Srewfix) when I was ysing the Berg, got the cab up higher which helped hear the notes a lot. The advantage of that was it would happily hold 150kg so the rig was never in danger of buckling it

Now I'm using a Big Twin iii I just leave it on the floor - the dispersion is ace and its a pretty tall cab....

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='tauzero' timestamp='1443445768' post='2874712']
Does a rear port make any difference to that?[/quote]You shouldn't place a rear port tight to the wall, but three inches or so of air space is sufficient. [quote] A little thinking (which is possibly less than the minimum required) suggests that it would actually exacerbate the problem as the out-of-phase sound from the rear port would be additive with the sound from the front.
[/quote]The sound from a port is not out of phase, at least not within the cabs intended pass band.