TimR Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) [quote name='ahpook' timestamp='1444821785' post='2886335'] I can't ever recall seeing an originals band (who I knew the line-up of, so I would know) using a dep. [/quote] I've depped for two. Not a particularly easy thing to do! I did three rehearsals for the first one, and they kept changing arrangements for a couple of songs each week. . Edited October 14, 2015 by TimR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahpook Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 [quote name='TimR' timestamp='1444825402' post='2886395'] I've depped for two. Not a particularly easy thing to do! I did three rehearsals for the first one, and they kept changing arrangements for a couple of songs each week. . [/quote] I'm curious how they ran it - did they give you some recordings to learn from ? Chord structures ? Actual sheet music ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 I had a session with the guitarist before we went to a studio. He effectively taught me the bass parts alongside the recordings and I took notes. With the other band I had a few recordings and they weren't bothered what lines I came up with. They knew the score and I was helping them out. The more dep work you do, the quicker you become at either learning the tune during the first verse and chorus or creating a scratch pad of well known songs. There's a reason a lot of successful bands on the circuit play the standards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahpook Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 [quote name='TimR' timestamp='1444831061' post='2886478'] I had a session with the guitarist before we went to a studio. He effectively taught me the bass parts alongside the recordings and I took notes. With the other band I had a few recordings and they weren't bothered what lines I came up with. They knew the score and I was helping them out. The more dep work you do, the quicker you become at either learning the tune during the first verse and chorus or creating a scratch pad of well known songs. There's a reason a lot of successful bands on the circuit play the standards. [/quote] OK, thanks for the info This thread again underlines for me how much everybody has a different take on the whole gigging experience, it's very educational to read of how it works for other people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 My band are currently working toward what we regard as the ideal scenario. We are an original band, but we are putting together a covers set as well (we usually have a few covers in the originals set too) which will hopefully allow us to play a whole range of different gigs. No worries about clashing diaries then! If you find a band with the right personnel, I think you can afford to be flexible about things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 We've had three dep guitarists and two drummers. We supplied them with studio recordings of the songs which meant that we had to temporarily drop some of the newer material and resurrect a couple of oldies as that was what we had available. The guitarists also had tabs for most of the songs that were done by a previous full time member who had produced them to originally learn the set and which he kindly donated to us when he had to leave the band. Interestingly the guitarists were all excellent and did it for free because they liked the music and wanted to help us out and do the gigs. Consequently one of them is now a full-time Terrortone. The drummers both wanted paying and were on the whole less good. And as I said previously one of them managed to mess up the single in two different ways on the two occasions he played it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahpook Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) [quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1444843057' post='2886641'] We've had three dep guitarists and two drummers. We supplied them with studio recordings of the songs which meant that we had to temporarily drop some of the newer material and resurrect a couple of oldies as that was what we had available. The guitarists also had tabs for most of the songs that were done by a previous full time member who had produced them to originally learn the set and which he kindly donated to us when he had to leave the band. Interestingly the guitarists were all excellent and did it for free because they liked the music and wanted to help us out and do the gigs. Consequently one of them is now a full-time Terrortone. The drummers both wanted paying and were on the whole less good. And as I said previously one of them managed to mess up the single in two different ways on the two occasions he played it. [/quote] Educational place this, thanks. Edited October 14, 2015 by ahpook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted October 14, 2015 Author Share Posted October 14, 2015 What about bands that have a "Star", a unique front that people are specifically coming to see? Personally, my position for now is, you can't dep a "Star" Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) [quote name='blue' timestamp='1444856238' post='2886815'] What about bands that have a "Star", a unique front that people are specifically coming to see? Personally, my position for now is, you can't dep a "Star" Blue [/quote] You can't dep anyone in an originals band. Or rather, you can, but there has to be a solid and pressing reason to do so. The two bands I depped for 1) didn't have a bass player and were looking for a replacement for the player that left. 2) bass player was off long term sick. I'm sure there could be other specific cases but they'd have to be pretty special reasons. I think if you're one of those bands looking to promote the band as an entity, there's not any room to be doing gigs that all the members haven't committed to because it can quickly breed resentment. Edited October 14, 2015 by TimR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 No one is indispensable. Not even Peter Gabriel, Roger Waters or Eric Clapton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 [quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1444862737' post='2886900'] No one is indispensable. Not even Peter Gabriel, Roger Waters or Eric Clapton. [/quote] I'm fairly sure they didn't get deps in for them to cover gigs they couldn't do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 In the 60s it was still a common practice for even the biggest bands. When The Beatles first toured Australia, Ringo was sick. The Beatles toured with a dep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 [quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1444888940' post='2886944'] In the 60s it was still a common practice for even the biggest bands. When The Beatles first toured Australia, Ringo was sick. The Beatles toured with a dep. [/quote] So did Thin Lizzy - well, not Ringo of course... but maybe it's a drummer/Australia thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 [quote name='TimR' timestamp='1444818801' post='2886292'] I think originals bands are a special case. Even if the band are not being paid, they need to make it worthwhile for the dep to work for them. That will include not only some kind of arrangement over the additional practices but probably purchasing stage wear for them. Most deps (I include myself) will be happy to wear whatever is specified for the 'performance'. However haircuts are whatever they are so you'd be better building a relationship with a set of first call deps who know what is being expected of them. [/quote] We wouldn't expect any dep we use to get all leathered up Terrortone style but when some of them can even follow a simple dress suggestion of "wear something black, no band T-shirts, no prominent brand logos, no trainers" it does make you wonder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBass Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1444797798' post='2886067'] 5 a year might be a lot for some bands. Blue [/quote] That 5 isn't all for one band, I play in up to 5/6 projects, 5 a year is for all projects, so an average of 1 clash that cannot be gotten around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 [quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1444905447' post='2887121'] We wouldn't expect any dep we use to get all leathered up Terrortone style but when some of them can even follow a simple dress suggestion of "wear something black, no band T-shirts, no prominent brand logos, no trainers" it does make you wonder. [/quote] I played in a function band for years and even our regular guitarist couldn't remember what to wear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHW Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 I played in a ceilidh band for about 10 years and on numerous occasions we pulled in deps, sometimes with members swapping instruments to play something else while the dep, played their parts (interesting as several times the "original" member liked something the dep did, off the cuff, and stole it, adding into their own parts) I also depped with other ceilidh bands on numerous occasions, one who played to music, so all I needed to do was read along with chord charts and keep up, and the other who I had to just follow. It all worked fine for the most part. I currently manage being in 2 bands- one does about 20 gigs a year (classic rock covers) where I play bass. The other is an acoustic duo playing guitar, working on some originals with mostly covers. This is a newer project and has done 6 gigs in the last year. However- we have already had a clash, and I went with the one booked in first. I know that if I reach a certain point, one band will have to go. The decision will be tough, but I already know what it will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 [quote name='JamesBass' timestamp='1444906080' post='2887129'] That 5 isn't all for one band, I play in up to 5/6 projects, 5 a year is for all projects, so an average of 1 clash that cannot be gotten around. [/quote] That's not 'busy' by any stretch of the imagination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 We operate an all black dress code. Which seemed to baffle our 2nd guitarist for the whole of our 2 years together. He moved to black shirt and jeans pretty quickly, but we never managed to get him out of his brown shoes!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 [quote name='CHW' timestamp='1444906655' post='2887141'] I currently manage being in 2 bands- one does about 20 gigs a year (classic rock covers) where I play bass. The other is an acoustic duo playing guitar, working on some originals with mostly covers. This is a newer project and has done 6 gigs in the last year. However- we have already had a clash, and I went with the one booked in first. I know that if I reach a certain point, one band will have to go. The decision will be tough, but I already know what it will be. [/quote] This what happened to me. The surprising thing was it was the originals band that was getting more gigs and although the gigs themselves were less well paid, by the time I had taken into account the amount of extra time I spent on a covers gig helping to set up and break down the PA and lights plus the individual cost of doing the gig (transport plus maintenance and upgrading of the PA etc.), I was actually coming away with more money per gig in the originals band. Sometimes I really don't think the economics of the average covers band make sense when compared with a well-organised originals band, but that's probably a topic for another thread... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 [quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1444908528' post='2887177'] We operate an all black dress code. Which seemed to baffle our 2nd guitarist for the whole of our 2 years together. He moved to black shirt and jeans pretty quickly, but we never managed to get him out of his brown shoes!!! [/quote] I bet he used white 4-gang extension leads as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HengistPod Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 (edited) High-profile deps include (off the top of my head): Bernie Torme, who filled Randy Rhoads' stage space following the latter's untimely death. Joe Satriani, who stood in when Ritchie Blackmore exited Deep Purple prior to a Japanese tour. Paul Chapman, in and out of UFO depping for Michael Schenker in the 70s, various bass players standing in for Pete Way when the latter couldn't get into America. Metallica's guitar roadie playing James Hetfield's parts following a pyro accident. Midge Ure standing in on guitar for Gary Moore on a Thin Lizzy US tour. Edited October 15, 2015 by HengistPod Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low End Bee Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 [quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1444888940' post='2886944'] In the 60s it was still a common practice for even the biggest bands. When The Beatles first toured Australia, Ringo was sick. The Beatles toured with a dep. [/quote] And when Macca snuffed it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted October 16, 2015 Author Share Posted October 16, 2015 [quote name='Low End Bee' timestamp='1444917352' post='2887324'] And when Macca snuffed it... [/quote] That was Jimi Nicol. I remember that, personally if I had been Brian, I would have canceled the dates until Ringo returned. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peteb Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1444962461' post='2887708'] That was Jimi Nicol. I remember that, personally if I had been Brian, I would have canceled the dates until Ringo returned. Blue [/quote] But he didn't! I'm sure that this would have had something to do with money and legal commitments to Aussie promoters, but also because they knew that a dep drummer (who was better than the original) could cover the gig well enough for them to fulfil their obligations without any major difficulties... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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