Mykesbass Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 [quote name='the boy' timestamp='1445512877' post='2892010'] I thought people like it loud!!!!! [/quote] But why? (not why you thought they did, but why they do like it loud)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted October 22, 2015 Author Share Posted October 22, 2015 [quote name='Mykesbass' timestamp='1445536822' post='2892284'] But why? (not why you thought they did, but why they do like it loud)? [/quote] I find it baffling . Why would you want to play at such a volume, that you need hearing protection, which then makes it quieter anyway . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 [quote name='ambient' timestamp='1445537053' post='2892287'] I find it baffling . Why would you want to play at such a volume, that you need hearing protection, which then makes it quieter anyway . [/quote] So that the audience can't talk. Keep up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mykesbass Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 [quote name='TimR' timestamp='1445537357' post='2892291'] So that the audience can't talk. Keep up! [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted October 22, 2015 Author Share Posted October 22, 2015 [quote name='TimR' timestamp='1445537357' post='2892291'] So that the audience can't talk. Keep up! [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) At what point in this video is this drummer playing too loud..? [media]http://youtu.be/CFHNVYAHlnM[/media] Don't go blaming the drums on this volume war stuff. Maybe the drummer, but not the instrument. They don't have to be so loud as to need earplugs. All that's required is a decent drummer, that's all, whatever the style. If your bloke is whacking away, he's not a drummer, he's a Canadian lumberjack. It's not necessary. Firstly get a decent drummer that plays at decent levels, then turn down to the drum's level. Edited October 22, 2015 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 The mic's we put on drums (typically bass drum and an overhead...) are not to make the drums louder. They're to integrate the drums into the PA so that the audience don't hear a disembodied voice coming from the PA and a disconnected drum set from the back of the stage. The level is very low indeed; just enough for it to be audible and balanced with the rest of the stage audio field. Certainly not likely to interfere with the vocals, or any other instruments; quite the opposite. I'd use the term 'sound reinforcement' rather than 'amplification'. We seldom use subs indoors. Our repertoire is pop/rock covers, such as Radiohead, RATM, Smashing Pumpkins, deUS, Noir Désir and more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lojo Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 We sometimes. Mic the bass drum, not to make the whole kit louder but just to give presence to the bass drum , if we could turn down snare etc anymore we would Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I don't think there is a certain volume you have to play at, but in my experience , you need to be louder than the noise made by the audience or you end up being background music. It's good that people at the back can still hear the band clearly, but you don't want folk down the front to be uncomfortable. The sound of drum and bass at a good volume is good to hear but you have to compromise to some extent. I find that after a while, our ears become used to the noise and start filtering out certain frequencies and you struggle to hear. It's easy to fall in to the trap of turning up to combat this, when in fact, the sound out front has not changed at all.the real secret is to have a low stage volume and let the pa do the work. As for mic'ing up drums in small venues. We have to do this in our local, because the volume of the punters is immense and acoustic drums get lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulWarning Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 (edited) micing up the bass drum seems to be a modern thing, it's a lot more prominent in the mix than it used to be, a drum kit is designed to be totally acoustic, oh yeah, and it invades my frequency space if it's eq'd to high Edited October 23, 2015 by PaulWarning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='PaulWarning' timestamp='1445586105' post='2892518'] micing up the bass drum seems to be a modern thing, it's a lot more prominent in the mix than it used to be, a drum kit is designed to be totally acoustic, oh yeah, and it invades my frequency space if it's eq'd to high [/quote] The singing voice is 'designed' to be totally acoustic, too. The importance isn't who's mic'ed what, but how to get the best mix out to the audience. The bass is part of that, of course, but only a part. The band has to come across to the audience in the most appropriate way for the venue. Sometimes that means integrating the drums into the PA to a greater or lesser degree. I don't see the bearing on the 'too loud' syndrome in the Original Post. If the drums are being played, acoustically, too loud, the drummer needs to learn his skills, imo. If the drums are too loud [i]and [/i]are also being mic'ed, then there's a bigger problem in the whole concept of playing modern live music. There are ways to play well acoustically without needing hearing protection; there are ways of getting that out to the audience. If there are those incapable of such, it's not the fault of the instrument, nor the genre. It's the idiots making an unwanted racket, that's all. This goes for drums, but also guitars, keys, basses, euphoniums and trumpet. I'll draw a veil over bagpipes; they don't count as 'musical', most of the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDelores Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 ... Drummers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanAxe Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 Although one of the functions of my rig (guitar or bass) is to be loud [i]enough[/i], a too-loud band spoils it for me both as a player and as an audience member. My rule of thumb is: If I need to use one or more earplugs, it's too loud. I should explain I have some damage to my right ear, which causes it to be over-sensitive, so that loud sounds (especially in the upper mids) create a crackling effect. Depending on my position in relation to the other instruments, and their volumes, I may end up using one earplug or two. When I had my own band (i.e. I was the boss!) we never played so loud that I needed earplugs, just loud enough to get the music across with a bit of excitement. Having a sensible drummer helped of course, and keeping my (skinny-string) guitar volume reasonable didn't force the bass player into volume wars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='AlexDelores' timestamp='1445588188' post='2892545'] ... Incompetent Drummers [/quote] Fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanAxe Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1445587406' post='2892532'] I'll draw a veil over bagpipes [/quote] Can you make sure it's a soundproof veil please! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirky Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 Usually drummers, but not in Dinosaur Jr! A couple of people have mentioned Low - they decided to play quieter to [i]stop[/i] people from talking, and it worked. The Low Anthem are similar - they can play a large room at whisper volume and keep the whole audience engaged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDelores Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1445588760' post='2892553'] Fixed. [/quote] Nailed it on the head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='AlexDelores' timestamp='1445615858' post='2892883'] [i]Quietly[/i] nailed it on the head [/quote] Fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I have a suspicion it's partly down to both guitarists and bassists no knowing how to make their sound fit into a live mix, there are enough players who's live amp settings are exactly the same as their in isolation, practice settings, because that's "their sound". This is often a mid-scooped, bass biased sound, which in a live mix sounds muddy and incoherent. Standing next to their amp, they can hear the sound they're used to, but can't hear themselves, so the only option is to turn up louder and use brute force to be heard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDelores Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1445616143' post='2892884'] Fixed. [/quote] 😂😂👏 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDelores Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1445616143' post='2892884'] Fixed. [/quote] 😂😂👏 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted October 23, 2015 Author Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='Graham' timestamp='1445617050' post='2892887'] I have a suspicion it's partly down to both guitarists and bassists no knowing how to make their sound fit into a live mix, there are enough players who's live amp settings are exactly the same as their in isolation, practice settings, because that's "their sound". This is often a mid-scooped, bass biased sound, which in a live mix sounds muddy and incoherent. Standing next to their amp, they can hear the sound they're used to, but can't hear themselves, so the only option is to turn up louder and use brute force to be heard. [/quote] This would be their dialed in 'Marcus Miller' tone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 [quote name='ambient' timestamp='1445626444' post='2893007'] This would be their dialed in 'Marcus Miller' tone. [/quote] Quite. Which is fine when the guitarist is playing a strat through a Vox, somewhat different when they've got a Les Paul and a Marshall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 Because it's. Rock & Roll. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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