dlloyd Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 [quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1446680232' post='2901500'] Erm, yeah. He wants to know what to play on the D chord. I told him where to put his fingers. This stuff isn't difficult. [/quote] I dunno, my son came home with a recorder and looked confused when I tried to teach him the lydian chromatic concept... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jaywalker Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 I actually know a composer who did something similar as an "experiment" with beginning improvisers.... Anyway, your analogy doesn't hold water. The OP wanted to know what scale to play on the D7. Mix b9b13 is the most basic choice in that situation. It's a V - I in a minor key. Not rocket science or complex. Basic stuff. Or perhaps it wouldnt seem so complex if it wasn't swamped by all the misleading and just plain erroneous stuff put forward by YouTube "teachers" who neither play nor understand the stuff themselves and/or want to supply shortcuts for the legions of bedroom players and rock band dudes who refuse to learn any theory etc as its "not creative" or "not the right way to learn music". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deerhunter1331 Posted November 8, 2015 Author Share Posted November 8, 2015 I thank all of you who decided to help me out on this matter, and clear this bit of theory out. I'm also looking for a book which teaches me some harmony and allows me to implement it into ny playing. I was looking into Gary Willis' fretboard harmony, and it sounds like a really good, albeit challenging book. Does anyone else have any other recommendations? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlloyd Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 [quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1446708070' post='2901561'] I actually know a composer who did something similar as an "experiment" with beginning improvisers.... Anyway, your analogy doesn't hold water. The OP wanted to know what scale to play on the D7. Mix b9b13 is the most basic choice in that situation. It's a V - I in a minor key. Not rocket science or complex. Basic stuff. Or perhaps it wouldnt seem so complex if it wasn't swamped by all the misleading and just plain erroneous stuff put forward by YouTube "teachers" who neither play nor understand the stuff themselves and/or want to supply shortcuts for the legions of bedroom players and rock band dudes who refuse to learn any theory etc as its "not creative" or "not the right way to learn music". [/quote] There always has been legions of bedroom players who shy away from theory. There always will be too. I've certainly come across people who *say* that music theory is anti-creative. I reckon they're embarrassed by it... it's difficult to understand if you haven't had a helping hand with it from the start. It's relatively simple to become proficient at guitar or bass in terms of playing pop, rock or blues music without going anywhere near the dots. Then when they want to go beyond the minor pentatonic they're baffled by the terminology, so they take comfort in the knowledge that blues musicians do it all by feel (without realising that many of the legends are actually quite conversant in music theory). Should we pity or sneer at bedroom players who deliberately avoid theory? Or at the people who try to dumb down theory to give the bedroom players some way of understanding it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlloyd Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 [quote name='Deerhunter1331' timestamp='1446996815' post='2903975'] I thank all of you who decided to help me out on this matter, and clear this bit of theory out. I'm also looking for a book which teaches me some harmony and allows me to implement it into ny playing. I was looking into Gary Willis' fretboard harmony, and it sounds like a really good, albeit challenging book. Does anyone else have any other recommendations? [/quote] The Ed Friedland jazz books are excellent if jazz is where you want to go. There are books out there that are raved about, like Mark Levine's Jazz theory book, but they are a lot more than you need right now (given that you've just learned the natural minor). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deerhunter1331 Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 [quote name='dlloyd' timestamp='1447024341' post='2904292'] The Ed Friedland jazz books are excellent if jazz is where you want to go. There are books out there that are raved about, like Mark Levine's Jazz theory book, but they are a lot more than you need right now (given that you've just learned the natural minor). [/quote] https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0793542049/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_SkoqwbYCZG5AT Is this the book that you mean? It has good reviews, so it seems promising. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlloyd Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 [quote name='Deerhunter1331' timestamp='1447093039' post='2904807'] [url="https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0793542049/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_SkoqwbYCZG5AT"]https://www.amazon.c...d_SkoqwbYCZG5AT[/url] Is this the book that you mean? It has good reviews, so it seems promising. [/quote] That's a great book for starting to play walking lines, but this one gives a more general introduction: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jazz-Bass-Ed-Friedland/dp/0793565170 John Goldsby's book is also excellent http://www.amazon.co.uk/John-Goldsby-Technique-Tradition-Musicians/dp/0879307161 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinyd Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 +1 on John Goldsby's book - apart from the theory stuff, it's also a great read as it has loads of stuff about the great players. For more general jazz theory, I really like the [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jazz-Theory-Book-Mark-Levine-ebook/dp/B004KA9UX4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1447237231&sr=8-1&keywords=jazz+theory+book+levine"]Jazz Theory Book by Mark Levine[/url] and [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jazzology-Encyclopedia-Jazz-Theory-Musicians/dp/0634086782/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1447237267&sr=8-1&keywords=jazzology"]Jazzology by Eddie Rawlins and Nor Eddine Bahha[/url]. They're both very readable - Jazzology is a lot more like a school textbook (in a good way) and concise, whereas the Levine book is huge and sprawling but a real treasure trove of interesting stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lovelock Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 (edited) The JayWalker has given the realness here... Edited November 11, 2015 by Simon Lovelock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bassman7755 Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 (edited) [quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1446677696' post='2901484'] The most important thing to grasp when playing scales over chords is that you NEVER think of them as modes ie playing the same scale with different starting notes. [/quote] Thats probably the single most important bit of theory I ever learned (or "unlearned") so its worth stressing. Another way of stating this is that any scale should be viewed as a set of key functions e.g. the defining characteristic of the mixolydian mode is the b7 relative to the root vs the natural 7th of the major scale, not the fact that those notes happen to belong to some other major scale. The way I personally remember all the modal scale variations is like this ... Divide them in to "major" and "minor" categories and then remember the variations, (adding melodic and harmonic minor for bonus points): Major Major with a b7 - mixolydian Major with a #4 - lydian Minor (natural) Minor with a natural 6 - dorian Minor with a b2 - phygrian Minor with a b2 and b5 - locrian [i]Minor with a natural 7 - harmonic minor[/i] [i]Minor with natural 6th and 7th - melodic minor[/i] It provides progressive way to learn starting with plain major and minor then learning the variations. It also helps when trying to understand what your hearing because your listening for the defining alterations. Edited November 28, 2015 by bassman7755 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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