Why can't I sing?

[DaveFry]

Next time you're nice and relaxed in the bath sing a slow gliss up and down till you find the pitch that your bathroom resonates at .
Then sing a few short notes at that pitch and listen to the ring of the reverb .
Next guess a fifth up . You'll know when it is in tune when it rings . Same for the octave .
Finally sing " Scarborough Fair " tuned to the room .
This is an easy way to train ear/voice connection .


There is a Rock Vocals video on YT by Tim Bogert .

[Si600]

I'm not great at singing, but not terrible either IMHO. However, if I try and do BV's I forget how to play!

[elephantgrey]

I have a different problem than most seam to here, I seam to do fine with pitch/tone (have been caught singing along to things and asked why I'm not a singer), but I pronounce R as a voiced W. This leaves me hateing singing in front of people.

[colgraff]

@Elephant.

Do others notice or comment on it when you mispronounce R? A good many singers alter their pronunciation of some letters and sounds to avoid excessive fricatives, plosives, etc.

[elephantgrey]

[quote name='colgraff' timestamp='1446827930' post='2902748']
@Elephant.

Do others notice or comment on it when you mispronounce R? A good many singers alter their pronunciation of some letters and sounds to avoid excessive fricatives, plosives, etc.
[/quote]

A few have. Most responses I get to it though is people misunderstanding what I'm saying (room=woomb, rare=where, etc).

Edited November 6, 2015 by elephantgrey

[colgraff]

Interesting. Does this happen in speech or just singing? Also can you go the other way and soften your r further and tie the last letter of the previous word onto it?

Example: Instead of "Losing my religion" sing "losing my_yeligion."
Might not help, but nothing ventured

[RhysP]

[quote name='elephantgrey' timestamp='1446828504' post='2902760']
A few have. Most responses I get to it though is people misunderstanding what I'm saying (room=woomb, rare=where, etc).
[/quote]

Whatever you do don't attempt Up Town Top Ranking.....

[Phil Starr]

Like the OP I've always been a non singer. Humiliated by teachers at school which didn't help but although I could hear it in my head what came out of my mouth was never what I expected or what I heard. I remember several times people playing a note on a piano and asking me to sing it back, I couldn't get close.

A few years back I discovered when setting up the PA I could hold a note and sing along if the monitors were turned up. In other words I could sing in tune when what I normally hear was blotted out by the PA. I genuinely can't hear my own voice. Since then I've been asked to do the odd backing vocal and had a go, Things like the doo-be-doos in Chelsea Dagger. No-one has thrown anything yet.

The good news is it is getting better. You really can learn to sing, painfully slowly and with the usual two steps forward one step back but you even have muscle memory, once you've nailed something it stays as long as you keep practising it. It's something that seems to come so naturally to most people that you feel like constantly giving up and I'm sure it still isn't a nice sound but just filling out a chorus helps the band and three of us singing ups the audience response.

I have no idea what is going on, why I can't sing without a monitor when everyone else seems to have that trick and I'm so self conscious (a rare and salutary feeling for me) when I sing, but if you want it enough keep trying.

[colgraff]

I use earplugs when singing because it blots out some of the noise but boosts my own voice in my head.

[Lozz196]

[size=4]Well on our website part of the description of me is "and no nonsense delivery of vocals". I think this means I just shout loudly. And I do - we set all mics up the same and I just stand about a foot back from mine. Helps being a punk band, so that terrace style works well.[/size]

[size=4]But really, it`s all about doing what you can for me - I`m not the best singer in the world by any means, and don`t have a particularly good tone to my voice, so backing vox are my limit. But as long as you don`t try stuff you know you`ll mess up, and are confident in the delivery and know your limitations, well holler away and enjoy it.[/size]

[size=4]I was told at school I wasn`t good enough to be in the choir - now I`m playing and singing on the same bill as bands I liked when I was at school. So 40 odd years of practice seems to have helped.[/size]

[elephantgrey]

[quote name='colgraff' timestamp='1446831011' post='2902784']
Interesting. Does this happen in speech or just singing? Also can you go the other way and soften your r further and tie the last letter of the previous word onto it?

Example: Instead of "Losing my religion" sing "losing my_yeligion."
Might not help, but nothing ventured
[/quote]

Yeah it happens when I speak as well. When I hear myself speak in my head I sound like I say R, but its clearly just a voiced W from recordings.

That's a good idea, I'll have to have a play and see how it sounds.

[Dad3353]

[quote name='elephantgrey' timestamp='1446914902' post='2903488']
Yeah it happens when I speak as well. When I hear myself speak in my head I sound like I say R, but its clearly just a voiced W from recordings.

That's a good idea, I'll have to have a play and see how it sounds.
[/quote]

My sisters had elocution lessons in early teens, to 'lose' their Hounslow (pronounced 'Arnsleh'...) accent; it worked a treat. For your pronunciation, a few sessions, a couple of suitable exercises and you'll be fixed, no bother. Actors train to pick up accents and quirks of speech; is there an elocution or stage school near you..? It depends on how much it bugs you, I suppose, but it sounds easy enough to sort out, if seen by a professional. They do this kind of thing all the time. Just sayin'.

[BigBassBob]

I think it's a case of practice, confidence and having someone who can sing with you to help you along.

I only used to sing to myself and occasionally at open mic nights but recently I've been singing harmonies in my new-ish prog rock band.

I used to think I was terrible but it was a case of having the confidence to project my voice and accept that you might hit a bum note but you'll hit lots of good notes afterwards and those bum notes become fewer and further between.

If I don't sing moderately regularly I lose my ability somewhat. Quitting the fags has helped miles though (with lung capacity and range).

[elephantgrey]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1446915851' post='2903498']


My sisters had elocution lessons in early teens, to 'lose' their Hounslow (pronounced 'Arnsleh'...) accent; it worked a treat. For your pronunciation, a few sessions, a couple of suitable exercises and you'll be fixed, no bother. Actors train to pick up accents and quirks of speech; is there an elocution or stage school near you..? It depends on how much it bugs you, I suppose, but it sounds easy enough to sort out, if seen by a professional. They do this kind of thing all the time. Just sayin'.
[/quote]

I think this is actually something that I'm going look up. I'm Belfast based so I'm sure that there will be options about.

[Dad3353]

[quote name='elephantgrey' timestamp='1446917094' post='2903513']
I think this is actually something that I'm going look up. I'm Belfast based so I'm sure that there will be options about.
[/quote]

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Edited November 7, 2015 by Dad3353

[JTUK]

Most people can pitch but it doesn't mean they have the quality of voice to do any more than
than BV's.
I'm not a fan of voice that are either toneless or bland.... but accett it may come withy the territory.
I can add depth to BV's and sing a 5th but I don't pretend I can sing a 2nd to the vocal..and if the vocals want that
then I tell what I can do and they'll likely say 'don't bother'...

[lurksalot]

Singing in tune and having a good singing tone are my problem. I can record a dozen takes and while it might eventually be pretty much in tune , tonally, it justs sucks.
I can't do much about that , and sometimes it really racks me off.

[Bassman Sam]

In my last band, I did backing vocals on some numbers. At one particular gig, someone took a video and when I saw the playback, I was shocked at how bad I sounded. The guitarist then admitted that, for the past 20 gigs, he had my vocals in the fold back only. Nothing was going FOH. That gig, he forget to tell the sound guy to turn me down. I have never sung since.

[lurksalot]

To be fair , nothing exposes your ability as much as when you record it and play it back , vocals especially , though it can really help to hone playing skills as well .

[sbrag]

I joined a band this year which needed more bvs than I've done before. I've done a few in the past but have a tendency to sing a bit flat but have forced myself to really listen to myself and while it's painful at times my pitching has got much better.

[fretmeister]

[quote name='colgraff' timestamp='1446835411' post='2902823']
I use earplugs when singing because it blots out some of the noise but boosts my own voice in my head.
[/quote]

Me too. It's a poor man's vocal monitor!

I used the cheap foam ones for so long - the ones that make it sound like I'm underwater - and when I got some flat attenuation plugs I hated them! I missed the dullness of the foam ones!!

On the plus side - the foam ones are really cheap!

[ivansc]

It is all down to learning how and when to breathe.

If you dont get enough air in and out of your face, there is no way you can sing in tune or with any kind of tone at all.

I had a pulmonary embolism which caused both my lungs to collapse and it took me a few months to regain anything like my original power.
Doctor said I had lost about 30% of my lung capacity permanently & I would just have to do a lot of breathing exercises.
It worked and I got most of my voice back, but in the process lost my falsetto range and gained bit on the top end "normal voice" range.

So the answer is, get a vocal coach who can teach you how and when to breathe or google up some instructional stuff on youtube.
Anyone can end up with at the least a passable voice. Oh - but for those of you who were told in school " you will never be able to sing" ignore them!!!!
I have only ever come across one person who didnt make it and she was so shy there was no way he was ever going to open her mouth wide enough and yell loud enough for it to sound tuneful.

[Nicko]

[quote name='ivansc' timestamp='1447089052' post='2904743']
It is all down to learning how and when to breathe.

If you dont get enough air in and out of your face, there is no way you can sing in tune or with any kind of tone at all.

I had a pulmonary embolism which caused both my lungs to collapse and it took me a few months to regain anything like my original power.
Doctor said I had lost about 30% of my lung capacity permanently & I would just have to do a lot of breathing exercises.
It worked and I got most of my voice back, but in the process lost my falsetto range and gained bit on the top end "normal voice" range.

So the answer is, get a vocal coach who can teach you how and when to breathe or google up some instructional stuff on youtube.
Anyone can end up with at the least a passable voice. Oh - but for those of you who were told in school " you will never be able to sing" ignore them!!!!
I have only ever come across one person who didnt make it and she was so shy there was no way he was ever going to open her mouth wide enough and yell loud enough for it to sound tuneful.
[/quote]

My inability to sing has nothing to do with my breathing. Even if I want to sing a short two note phrase I can't hit the notes. I'm better if I stylise the voice - singing through my nose a bit a la Dylan helps wit the tuning but not with whether anyone would want to listen to it. I did consider attending the "anyone can sing" lessons at my local college just to see if they'd change the title of the course to "almost anyone can sing". I'm sure with some lessons I might get somewhere passable but TBH playing and singing at the same time puts my timing off anyway.

[ivansc]

[quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1447160583' post='2905347']
My inability to sing has nothing to do with my breathing. Even if I want to sing a short two note phrase I can't hit the notes. I'm better if I stylise the voice - singing through my nose a bit a la Dylan helps wit the tuning but not with whether anyone would want to listen to it. I did consider attending the "anyone can sing" lessons at my local college just to see if they'd change the title of the course to "almost anyone can sing". I'm sure with some lessons I might get somewhere passable but TBH playing and singing at the same time puts my timing off anyway.
[/quote]

Sorry but it almost certainly DOES have a lot to do with your breathing. Insufficient or too much air passing over the vocal cords means you have far less control over what they do than when you airspeed indicator is on "perfect". And of course if singing and playing at the same time is an issue, start out by JUST singing (even if it is in the bathroom) rather than trying to run before you can walk. Might be an idea to see how those "anyone can sing classes are, but try and approach it with at the least a neutral attitude.

Mind you all of this presupposes that you really WANT to learn to sing. If it is just a case of "I feel like I ought to", you probably wont improve.

Edited November 11, 2015 by ivansc

[JTUK]

The first thing for me when I listen to vocals ..?? is the voice tonally pleasing and expressive.
That really sorts the men from the boys, and women etc.

Being able to hold a tune is not a good singer IMO.
In a crowded bar, you want the voice to GRAB everyone..and make them turn round and notice.

From recollection, there are only a mere handful who can do that around here... the rest are a bit meh..!!
That, coupled with a non discript P.A ...and we had a hired in P.A run Vox dry to a load of pub acts the other day
and you aren't even left witha fighting chance..!!!!

Vocals=focal point of the band, pretty much.