Wonky2 Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 Hey folks I'm in the mArket for a new combo , having a size down..... I've checked out a tc elec rs 450 combo today, it was good, but I didn't like running it quite so high to get the kind of volume I'd like and maybe would need the 750, also bottom end allthough big, felt shallow ? Maybe my poor use of control on the eq but still,......... but played a few other cabs/ combos and prefer the tone of the markbass stuff..... Pains me, as I'm not a fan of the looks and prefer a vintage look, but who cares, it's what it sounds like really. Size, weight , volume, warmth/ depth is important.... I tried the markbass 151 cab and a 300, then a Big Bang head, sounds great. I'm narrowing my lead down to the cmd121p or the cmd121h ..... I've got to get the tape measure out and see just how much bigger the h is than the p, any one seen them side by side and can comment if it's vastly bigger ? I wondered what he hatch in the top of the h was, and quickly realise it gave access to rear plugins.... Which then made me wonder how in the heck your supposed to have visual access to the rear panel on the 121p which is top mounted as opposed to front slot ? Any comments ? If any can offer any advice on just how much better the h model may be for the extra cost and of course compirmise in size..... I'm guessing it will give more bottom end girth due to size ? Also, I see a give away on the h models is that any of them with a yellow horn is Italian made ? Is that a correct guess or wrong ? I guess all the 121p 's now will be non Italian models.... Is there a great deal with quality with that in mind or not? Any advice is welcom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonky2 Posted December 5, 2015 Author Share Posted December 5, 2015 Lots of head scratching....... Took some measurements of both and sized it up against my Mesa walkabout..... Never realised quite how small the 121p is ??? Having only played the 151 traveller cab in the bass lounge Manchester (thanks drew ) that's my only reference point sound wise.... I wanted to down size, just enough to get any combo/ cab in my boot and also reduce weight significantly.... Well, in closer inspection, with a tape measure in hand, the cmd151 is probably just that but small and a lot lighter so I could go that way too? I've had 15" speakers for a long time, but I like the tight sound of tens and twelves.... I guess the 15 and 12 will sound massively different but I'm told that the 12 is good enough to deliver 15 like depth ? Would really appreciate some opinions ?.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Having had the CMD102p, I'd say give that a try out too. One handed lift, not too big & mighty loud with a good low end. Speaker diamiter has sod all to do with how it produces frequencies. The 10s in the MarkBass produce a load more lows than my Marshall 2x15 stack ever did. Good speaker & cab design these days means the 70s thinking of 15" for lows & 10" for punch is well & truly redundant. The more air your speakers can move, the more you're gonna move those lows. The "p" indicates that the cab/combo has a piezo. My combo was made in Italy & never had a yellow piezo. The best way to check if it was made in Italy is to look at the back right of the head, if it was made in Italy it'll say "Made in Italy". I'd try a few of them out & get the one you like the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisanthony1211 Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 I currently have a a CMD 121p which I stack on top of a NY 12 extension cabinet which is the same size, the 121p is insanely small and lightweight for what it can do, and is probably my preferred combo given weight power size. You can tell quite a difference when the cab is added in the bottom end, and of course you then get the full 500 watts! I've also had the CMD 102p which is also great, loud, still pretty light, and an uncomfortable one handed lift. I have had a walkabout 12 before I which I really loved, I keep thinking of swapping to a walkabout again, but never quite take the plunge. To my ears the walkabout sounds better, but not much better, and the Mark bass stuff is just so usable, light and small...... I've never used the 121h before, but do sometimes consider swapping my extension cab for a 121h?... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonky2 Posted December 6, 2015 Author Share Posted December 6, 2015 Thanks for the comments... I'm aware it would have place of manufacture on the back , difficult to see when ordered blind from shop as out of stock or net The ref to the yellow horn is the horn in the 121h not the piezo tweeter in the P model? I see that the newer ones (the horns in the h) are black and wondered if that indicated the change to non Italian manufacture? I think after much deliberation I'd like the 12 but fear I would yearn for the 12 ext cab , I want a single unit solution (rehearsals and small gigs or di for larger) I just wish I could find somewhere local ish I could try them all ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Telebass Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 I've used the 121H for 9 years now. Although it is that bit bigger, it's worth having. The horn is better than the tweeter, if that's relevant, and the bigger cab gives a bit more beef to the liw end. Still a one-hander at 39lb. I stand it on a 151p Traveler when I need the full 500W. Great rig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisanthony1211 Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 There is the Mark bass Alan Caron lite 121h which is a one combo solution, it pumps out all its 500watts and is the same size as the 121h... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc S Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 I'm another CMD 102 P user here, and I have to agree with the comments about the Markbass 10" speakers being so good. I used to use my 102 combo in conjunction with a Markbass 15" cab, for larger gigs It sounded great, but I found sometimes the bottom end seemed a little bit less defined I now use the 102 on its' own, or with a Phil Jones 4x5 pirhana cab as extension Those tiny Phil Jones 5" speakers seem to give me a more defined, deeper low end than the 15" ever did. Also heard some cracking double bass a few months ago, from a PJ Suitcase, or briefcase (forget which it was) and they are 8" speakers. Maybe take a look at the PJ range of cabs too. Not heard the Alain Caron 121, I'd be interested to hear one of these. Personally, I like the tones I can get from my 102, and I sometimes wish that Markbass did a 1x10 combo as well as the 121 Good luck in your search Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonky2 Posted December 7, 2015 Author Share Posted December 7, 2015 Ive seen e Alan c model, didn't realise it's usp was it kick out the full fat 500w ? That's appealing as I really don't want to go down an ext cab route just to unlock he next level.... I assume the Allan c model has a 4 ohm speaker then ? Any users, any comments on the Alan c model, what are its other points ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 I have owned various heads in the past few years, I still own two, simultaneously with a CMD121P combo. Guess which one gets gigged the most? Yup, the tiny combo. It just sounds good whatever I throw at it, it's very portable, and it's got a lot of punch for such a small amp. As a stage monitor (DI'd to the house PA) it's brilliant. I often use a small stand, a Stagg GAS4.2, which lifts it a bit from the ground and aims the speaker at me, so it's easier to hear. Other times it may be on top of a cab if there's one provided. Sometimes I add the extra cab sometimes I don't... it always sounds good onstage. The stages I normally play at are not huge, but it covers a range from your typical music bar stages to 300-people venues usually. Now, to use it by itself... it can be a bit limited unless the band is not very loud. Having said that, I've used it several times in small bars and once even outdoors (small street performance during Edinburgh festival) and it worked pretty well. My band has three electric guitars, trumpet, sax and drummer as well as vocalists. I do not own a NY cab, but I've used the little combo together with various other cabs: - with a Barefaced Compact... it sounds pretty big. In a large bar without PA support it was plenty. - with a small TKS 1126 cab... plenty of volume and a very compact rig. A reggae band played through it too and they sounded very good. - with an even smaller Schroeder mini10R cab. The ultimate small rig. Again, bar gigs were not a problem whatsoever. The CMD121P is the best musical purchase I've made in years. I love it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 CMD121P is a great little combo. Had mine paired with the NY121 - just made it doubly great. A mate of mine has the 121H with matching cab and his sound is pretty good, so I think it`s dependent on weight/portability, and if the extra low-end of the 121H is required. If intending on only using the combo with no ext cab I`d probably go down this route - you can always back off of lows on the amp if required. Not that the 121P is lacking in them mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonky2 Posted December 7, 2015 Author Share Posted December 7, 2015 Good feedback guys, thanks.... My aim is to get to a single unit solution.... Ext cabs route is great but I would probably only use it once in a blue moon so not sure I can justify the spend on the 121p combo AND the 121ny cab (circa £900 together) ..... One amp solution the 121h alan c model may bring is appealing .... Can any one confirm the differences between the alan c and the standard 121h ? Is it just that the alan c runs at full 500w with I presume a 4ohm speaker in the combo ? If that is the case, I'm guessing that means the Alan cannot take an additional ext cab should the need arise ? 500w may be well and good but sometimes an additional speaker moves the air you need ? Still, as I say... I want a one unit solution so not concerned bout ext cabs.... Just that the Ålan c can cope well with full bore 500w ? I did prefer the top load amp head as the thing is so small I will obviously be looking down on in to adjust knobs ( arthritis don't lend itself well to crawling round on your knees) .... My feelings are that if I go down the 121p route I may yearn for the ext cab.... Lugging an extra cab (yes I know they are tiny and way 1/2 a gram) is ok if it's for the odd bigger gig but I don't want to be having to fetch it to rehearsals etc..... Saying that, the band is fairly quiet.... Ahhh ... I used to be indecisive but now I just can't tell ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisanthony1211 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 The Alan C can't be paired with an extension cab, it has two separate internal amps, one which pumps 100watts into the horn, and as said previously a second which pumps 500w into its single 12inch speaker, I've been considering one of these myself as a one cab solution but can one 12ich combo really be as loud as the two 12inch speakers I already have with my CMD121p and NY121. even at the same wattage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='chrisanthony1211' timestamp='1449560118' post='2924556'] The Alan C can't be paired with an extension cab, it has two separate internal amps, one which pumps 100watts into the horn, and as said previously a second which pumps 500w into its single 12inch speaker, I've been considering one of these myself as a one cab solution but can one 12ich combo really be as loud as the two 12inch speakers I already have with my CMD121p and NY121. even at the same wattage? [/quote] Simple answer... No. You'll get an extra 3db tops. Watts alone don't equate to volume. 2 12" drivers are pushing way more air than a single 12" can. Air moving is what you hear. The B&C drivers that Markbass used to use have a huge excursion compared to many other drivers, allowing them to be unbelievably loud for such small combos. I'm not sure what the newer Markbass drivers are like, but I'd imagine they'll be just as good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='Wonky2' timestamp='1449528259' post='2924463'] Good feedback guys, thanks.... My aim is to get to a single unit solution.... Ext cabs route is great but I would probably only use it once in a blue moon so not sure I can justify the spend on the 121p combo AND the 121ny cab (circa £900 together) ..... One amp solution the 121h alan c model may bring is appealing .... Can any one confirm the differences between the alan c and the standard 121h ? Is it just that the alan c runs at full 500w with I presume a 4ohm speaker in the combo ? If that is the case, I'm guessing that means the Alan cannot take an additional ext cab should the need arise ? 500w may be well and good but sometimes an additional speaker moves the air you need ? Still, as I say... I want a one unit solution so not concerned bout ext cabs.... Just that the Ålan c can cope well with full bore 500w ? I did prefer the top load amp head as the thing is so small I will obviously be looking down on in to adjust knobs ( arthritis don't lend itself well to crawling round on your knees) .... My feelings are that if I go down the 121p route I may yearn for the ext cab.... Lugging an extra cab (yes I know they are tiny and way 1/2 a gram) is ok if it's for the odd bigger gig but I don't want to be having to fetch it to rehearsals etc..... Saying that, the band is fairly quiet.... Ahhh ... I used to be indecisive but now I just can't tell ! [/quote] £900 together? Lucky! I bought my CMD121P in 2013 before the price drop... £750 just the combo! Still, not complaining. I love it. I was tempted by the 151 version, but the extra depth in the sound was not enough for me to offset the extra bulk & weight. For rehearsals the little combo does it more than fine in my band. I only use an extension cab occasionally. But most gigs I do have PA support unless it's a small bar gig. I've also bought a foldable trolley a while ago. It takes very little room in my boot (just an A3 hatchback, so not huge), and it makes taking away the combo plus any extension speaker really easy. I mean, it's easy without a trolley, but with one it's just the ultimate lazy solution... with a great sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc S Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='Wonky2' timestamp='1449528259' post='2924463'] Good feedback guys, thanks.... My aim is to get to a single unit solution.... Ext cabs route is great but I would probably only use it once in a blue moon so not sure I can justify the spend on the 121p combo AND the 121ny cab (circa £900 together) ........ Ahhh ... I used to be indecisive but now I just can't tell ! [/quote] I know what you're saying, but I think a 2 cab scenario is more flexible With manufacturers like Markbass and Phil Jones, the design is brilliant, and adaptable I've used my CMD 102 for a lot of smaller - medium gigs and it's been great However, playing with different bands, and in very different venues, the ability to use an additional cab has been vital As others have said, additional speakers, moving more air is sometimes necessary But also I found the ability to have a cab each side of the stage can help balance the sound more it has even helped other band members to hear me more clearly I'd be wary now of buying a combo that didn't give me this option Remember, it might suit your current band, but you may be in a different band this time next year - you never know Of course, it's your choice - but I'm just underlining the positive benefits of 2 cabs Though this might also be expensive - you can spread the cost / outlay You can get the combo now, and maybe pick up the ext cab at a later date - keeping your eye on the 2nd hand market Cheers again Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='Marc S' timestamp='1449577308' post='2924764'] I'd be wary now of buying a combo that didn't give me this option Remember, it might suit your current band, but you may be in a different band this time next year - you never know Of course, it's your choice - but I'm just underlining the positive benefits of 2 cabs Though this might also be expensive - you can spread the cost / outlay You can get the combo now, and maybe pick up the ext cab at a later date - keeping your eye on the 2nd hand market Cheers again Marc [/quote] Very good points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonky2 Posted December 8, 2015 Author Share Posted December 8, 2015 Well, I've read all the comments (appreciated) and all the reviews etc..... After a long hard head scratching session I've come up with what I think is a good compromise on size, weight , air pushing capability and future potential to add another cab ( which I won't, but option is nice to have).... I've gone the opposite way... Separate cab / head.... I've gone for the little mark 3 head and the 102 traveller (2x10 lightweight cab). I've gone for the 8ohm cab as all though the 4ohm will give me the full whack out of the head, I'm told repeatedly that watts don't equate to volume and a few reports say the sound difference is minimal, so I figured to best option is to leave myself open to being able to use other cabs if ever I needed to get damn loud..... I'm assured this set up performs well but have been reassured further that if I'm not happy they will take it back...... "They" being promenade music. ..... Spoke with Gary who certainly knows his stuff as a working bass player and also gave me all the time / advice I needed to get to my final decision... Free delivery, best internet/ shop prices and a "deal" done too on free speak on lead and the markbass head bag at trade price.... Great customer service.... Expecting delivery Thursday , will report back on first impressions... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Looks like a very good choice to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.