So how old are we....

[Staggering on]

The well known Vancouver Canada swing big band leader Dal Richards died shortly before midnight on Dec.31 2015,a few days short of his 98th birthday.He became ill in November 2015 and decided to cancel his NYE gig since he felt it would not be up to his standard.If he had played that gig it would have been his 80th CONSECUTIVE NYE gig!I heard him interviewed in 2012 after a record release and he was still playing sax and singing with his band on about 150 gigs a year.At that time he said he wasn't going to retire until something happened to make him quit,the music was what kept him going.Moral of the story-hang in there.

[12stringbassist]

I just started a poll on this. Perhaps it could be done every January?

[bassbiscuits]

I'm 41, but I act about 12 and feel about 65 some days...

[Twincam]

[quote name='Paul S' timestamp='1454069513' post='2966021']


[size=4][font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Yes, you said those things but the overall tone of your post seemed, to me, to criticize - "[color=#282828]a man should really be able to haul heavy gear without injury " seems fairly unambiguous. If that isn't what you meant then I apologise for wading in.[/color][/font][/size]

I didn't actually say my back injury was from lifting weights. It wasn't - it happened doing something totally innocuous. Although I grant you it could read like it was from lifting weights. My point is that at the time of my life when I first injured my back - I was a little older than you in my early 40s - I used to be very strong: had a strong back/legs from squats/deadlifts/rows etc, was completely used to lifting heavy things but all was to no avail when my back went - just leaning over to measure with a tape measure.
[/quote]

I honestly was not in anyway supposed to be critical of people who can't or choose not too even. Injuries of course happen and at any time. Maybe I should of made my post more clear.
What I had in mind is there's no reason if your fit that anyone male or female shouldn't be able to lift heavier gear if they Wanted, not that I'm saying people should go killing themselves and that I would hope to be one of those well into old age. I was really thinking old age and longevity.

I don't judge others if they do like light gear.

My belief, choice is that It does annoy me people go on about light gear will save your back, or I'm getting too old to lift it etc, it might, it might not and if you do keep fit you have less chance of getting hurt. As you said you can get injuries doing anything. Lightweight gear is great and I'm not knocking that either it's very convenient, but this fear of heavier stuff like say an all valve head and you do hear it said, is a bit weak willed to me, again don't kill yourself, but if you are under 75 then why not keep yourself fit and durable it will keep you going much longer than not.
I take great inspiration from older 75 onwards who are fit, still lifting weights and are active in life. And I hope that I will be just that myself one far off day.

I dunno maybe I am actual being criticle but certainly not in a way your suggesting.

[bassace]

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1454082753' post='2966313']


I honestly was not in anyway supposed to be critical of people who can't or choose not too even. Injuries of course happen and at any time. Maybe I should of made my post more clear.
What I had in mind is there's no reason if your fit that anyone male or female shouldn't be able to lift heavier gear if they Wanted, not that I'm saying people should go killing themselves and that I would hope to be one of those well into old age. I was really thinking old age and longevity.

I don't judge others if they do like light gear.

My belief, choice is that It does annoy me people go on about light gear will save your back, or I'm getting too old to lift it etc, it might, it might not and if you do keep fit you have less chance of getting hurt. As you said you can get injuries doing anything. Lightweight gear is great and I'm not knocking that either it's very convenient, but this fear of heavier stuff like say an all valve head and you do hear it said, is a bit weak willed to me, again don't kill yourself, but if you are under 75 then why not keep yourself fit and durable it will keep you going much longer than not.
I take great inspiration from older 75 onwards who are fit, still lifting weights and are active in life. And I hope that I will be just that myself one far off day.

I dunno maybe I am actual being criticle but certainly not in a way your suggesting.
[/quote]

Steady on! I don't do weights, but most of my gear is lightweight these days.

[Twincam]

Adding that guitar or instruments that you hold for long periods is totally different in fact I would say go as light as possible on that one. Or at least not "heavy" as that's asking for trouble.

[Twincam]

[quote name='bassace' timestamp='1454083960' post='2966327']


Steady on! I don't do weights, but most of my gear is lightweight these days.
[/quote]

That's not a bad thing. I'm just saying if someone liked a heavier all valve head then hopefully they would still be able to lift it and not be in fear of using it.

[RhysP]

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1454082753' post='2966313']
I honestly was not in anyway supposed to be critical of people who can't or choose not too even. Injuries of course happen and at any time. Maybe I should of made my post more clear.
What I had in mind is there's no reason if your fit that anyone male or female shouldn't be able to lift heavier gear if they Wanted, not that I'm saying people should go killing themselves and that I would hope to be one of those well into old age. I was really thinking old age and longevity.

I don't judge others if they do like light gear.

My belief, choice is that It does annoy me people go on about light gear will save your back, or I'm getting too old to lift it etc, it might, it might not and if you do keep fit you have less chance of getting hurt. As you said you can get injuries doing anything. Lightweight gear is great and I'm not knocking that either it's very convenient, but this fear of heavier stuff like say an all valve head and you do hear it said, is a bit weak willed to me, again don't kill yourself, but if you are under 75 then why not keep yourself fit and durable it will keep you going much longer than not.
I take great inspiration from older 75 onwards who are fit, still lifting weights and are active in life. And I hope that I will be just that myself one far off day.

I dunno maybe I am actual being criticle but certainly not in a way your suggesting.
[/quote]

You don't gig, do you?

[Twincam]

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1454089530' post='2966397']


You don't gig, do you?
[/quote]

Nope I do jam sessions and am often moving my trace Elliot stuff about in and out of a vw polo. And I've helped a fair few bands set up. It's moving things normally heads and cab, guitar, pa equipment maybe combos etc etc.
Not too mention some physical jobs day in day out which are much harder than setting up some equipment. And there being plenty of guys in there 60s still doing fairly labour intensive jobs. Who could if they wanted to easily lift gear in and out of cars.

I also see plenty of bands with guys mostly a lot older than me still using the older gear. They like the older equipment they use it. And I say good for them if that is there choice.

If you ask me there seems to be too much fear in lifting gear that really to a fit non injured person should be nothing.

So what's your point?

Edited January 29, 2016 by Twincam

[RhysP]

I wondered if you were in the habit of moving gear about on a regular basis, that's all, no need to get all defensive.
If you are then I'm even more surprised that you'd have such a poor attitude to people who prefer lightweight gear.

[Twincam]

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1454091038' post='2966413']
I wondered if you were in the habit of moving gear about on a regular basis, that's all, no need to get all defensive.
If you are then I'm even more surprised that you'd have such a poor attitude to people who prefer lightweight gear.
[/quote]

Well to be honest after our conversation on the other thread I thought I was about to get it in the neck from you so I did go on the defensive there.

To clarify once again I have no issue with light gear or people who use it in any form. My issue is with and I'm not sure how to say this is with the stick that the heavier gear gets. And it does grate with me a little bit when gear is rejected, yes there's often a good reason for that but many times there is not people are starting to just assume it's too heavy some are not but I can see it happening in the future where people will already assume it is so.

Also I have a thing about getting older so maybe my defensiveness about growing old myself comes through in a debate. I do want people to take care but on the flip side not be worried or something along those lines.

[4StringPete]

48, 31 years a bass player. I could have chosen worse paths in life....

[odysseus]

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1454059832' post='2965811']
Just realised I'm 33 this year. Starting to get gray hairs too.

I really believe in staying fit, weights and cardio. And so it does slightly annoy me all this talk of lighter gear although I can understand why. I'm using older TE gear and it's a pain in the arse. But a man should really be able to haul heavy gear without injury and I hope I will still be able to do just that long into old age.
[/quote]

I'm 46 and have much the same outlook on fitness as you do. I use light gear because I've got to haul it up and down 4 flights of stairs to my flat. For me it's one less risk to my lifestyle - it's not the weight so much as the shape and awkwardness. I'm one miserable git if I can't weight train, bike or surf, so light gear is win-win for me

[RhysP]

From my perspective there is a very valid reason that some older gear gets a lot of stick, and that reason is because it's not that great, certainly not worth all the aggro of shifting it about. It's not about fear, it's about convenience.
When I was gigging regularly in the late 80s/early 90s I had a big Trace Elliott rig. It was a pain in the arse to move about but at the time it was among the best amplification available.
On the last gig I did, two years ago, the bass combo I had was as loud as my old Trace rig, sounded 1000 times better & was a lot more reliable. I was also able to take that combo & my bass to the gig on the bus. I would have killed for the chance to do that 25 years ago.
When my back went in 2008 the consultant orthopedic surgeon I was seeing told me the damage to my back was cumulative, it had built up over time. Maybe if I'd had lightweight gear 25 years ago I wouldn't have just had to retire at the age of 51 because I'm now classed as disabled.

Edited January 29, 2016 by RhysP

[Twincam]

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1454093778' post='2966444']
From my perspective there is a very valid reason that some older gear gets a lot of stick, and that reason is because it's not that great, certainly not worth all the aggro of shifting it about. It's not about fear, it's about convenience.
When I was gigging regularly in the late 80s/early 90s I had a big Trace Elliott rig. It was a pain in the arse to move about but at the time it was among the best amplification available.
On the last gig I did, two years ago, the bass combo I had was as loud as my old Trace rig, sounded 1000 times better & was a lot more reliable. I was also able to take that combo & my bass to the gig on the bus. I would have killed for the chance to do that 25 years ago.
[/quote]

Fully understood and I agree. There is some good older stuff about and good heavy modern stuff about though. And I will use light weight gear myself for the very reasons you said . I do hope in the future vintage stuff is still used if convenient.

[bonnp]

i have just turned 52 but although age stresses me, its just a number, and now i follow Lemmys philosophy "[color=#141823][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]“I don't see why there should be a point where everyone decides you're too old. I'm not too old, and until I decide I'm too old I'll never be too f***ing old"[/font][/color]

[bassintheface]

Responding to the slightly off topic 'gear weight' thing - I'm 34, keep fit and active by doing competitive Muay Thai 3 times per week - training, sparring, inter clubs, fighting, plus weights and a circuit once per week. I have two young kids who keep me on my toes and I feel in the best shape of my life.
I gig generally 5-6 times per month on average, taking a full PA (inc active subs, valve guitar amps etc) and all the usual bits and pieces and there's absolutely no way
I'd change my set up from my 'lightweight' Aguilar Tonehammer 500 and SL112 cabs. No way!
The guitarists have even seen the light and bought Fender Blues Juniors!! The Devilles and Twins stay in the studio!
Regardless of how fit and strong you may be, lugging gear at the end of a gig where you've been stood up, wearing a bass for say 2.5 / 3 hrs means you'll be physically shagged (and probably mentally drained from concentrating and the effects of loud music).
Everything feels 3 times heavier when you're packing away and the risks from lugging the 'good old gear' (which I've had BTW) like Trace gear, Marshall heads, Ampeg SVT heads and 8x10 cabs etc just aren't worth the hassle and risks anymore! I don't want to feel like I've been hit by a bus the next day.
I've got a prolapsed disc in my lower back from a few years back (long story), but unless I've got roadies lifting, setting up and packing away them I'm happy being a 'wimp'!!

[blue]

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1454059832' post='2965811']
Just realised I'm 33 this year. Starting to get gray hairs too.

I really believe in staying fit, weights and cardio. And so it does slightly annoy me all this talk of lighter gear although I can understand why. I'm using older TE gear and it's a pain in the arse. But a man should really be able to haul heavy gear without injury and I hope I will still be able to do just that long into old age.

I do worry that not as many younger people are taking up playing instruments in general.

Oh that's reminds me a few years ago my friend Carl got turned down for a band as he was too old, he was 28! Haha. Turning away from guitar he now does music production and dj's etc.
[/quote]


I've hauled SVTs and a huge GK rig. About 6 months I started gigging with my GK combo. Amp in one hand, bass in the other and pedal board on my left shoulder.It's a 1 trip load in.

I'll be 63 next month, the days of hauling big rigs are over for me. Plus were primarily a bar band and big rigs are not really needed.

Blue

Edited January 30, 2016 by blue

[odysseus]

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1454093778' post='2966444']
When I was gigging regularly in the late 80s/early 90s I had a big Trace Elliott rig. It was a pain in the arse to move about but at the time it was among the best amplification available.
On the last gig I did, two years ago, the bass combo I had was as loud as my old Trace rig, sounded 1000 times better & was a lot more reliable. I was also able to take that combo & my bass to the gig on the bus.[/quote]

I hear that. I had an Ampeg stack back in the day and it was some of the best gear available to me then, but these days my Genz-Benz/Barefaced set-up blows it out of the water on all levels.