andytoad Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 Hello all, Would any of you be able to shed some light on where I stand with a van I have brought? Purchased 4 weeks ago private seller via eBay, cost almost £3k. Paid via PayPal on a credit card. Today the gearbox blew up on the M2. I had previously called the seller as there we other issues with the van that were not apparent during the sale. Naturally, sold as seen and he has washed his hands of the deal. Do I have a leg to stand on to get any (or all) my money back and return the van? Or is it just tough luck? Is small claims worth it? Anyone had a similar experience? What did you do? It's not covered under the PayPal guarantee and it does not look as if I am covered on the credit card either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colgraff Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 Private sales are tricky. I'm no expert, but I think that you have no recourse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taunton-hobbit Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 Nope - private sale = it is what it is (sorry, but you might as well know now) - I've been here, and it stinks....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 I'd have thought a month was too long to elapse. Did you get it checked by a mechanic before buying it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger2611 Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 You are on shaky ground, unless you can prove there was an issue with the vehicle that the seller knew about and deliberately disguised so as to dispose of the vehicle then you are on a loser, with something like a gearbox it would be virtually impossible to even guess on an impending failure let alone do something that would disguise the fact it was about to fail. Have you looked into the cost of replacing the box or getting it repaired? If the rest of the vehicle is ok then throwing a few hundred pounds extra at it may be worthwhile if it leaves you with a decent vehicle once sorted, you have to remember with a van they are work horses, usually reasonably maintained but seldom loved You say you paid nearly £3000 for it, was it cheap at that price or was it the going rate for this vehicle in the advertised condition? I hope you get it sorted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytoad Posted March 12, 2016 Author Share Posted March 12, 2016 [quote name='ambient' timestamp='1457814841' post='3002084'] I'd have thought a month was too long to elapse. Did you get it checked by a mechanic before buying it ? [/quote] Nope, I did my research on the van, background checks etc, but I guess I have been unlucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytoad Posted March 12, 2016 Author Share Posted March 12, 2016 [quote name='Roger2611' timestamp='1457816070' post='3002093'] You are on shaky ground, unless you can prove there was an issue with the vehicle that the seller knew about and deliberately disguised so as to dispose of the vehicle then you are on a loser, with something like a gearbox it would be virtually impossible to even guess on an impending failure let alone do something that would disguise the fact it was about to fail. Have you looked into the cost of replacing the box or getting it repaired? If the rest of the vehicle is ok then throwing a few hundred pounds extra at it may be worthwhile if it leaves you with a decent vehicle once sorted, you have to remember with a van they are work horses, usually reasonably maintained but seldom loved You say you paid nearly £3000 for it, was it cheap at that price or was it the going rate for this vehicle in the advertised condition? I hope you get it sorted [/quote] It's a 2005, I paid the right price and then some as i wanted to get a reliable one. It's had a whack in the side and repaired that I did not know about, hence the first phone call. Of course, he says he told me, his word against mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunburstjazz1967 Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 How do you know it's had a whack in the side now that you didn't before? It would be hard to hide an impending gearbox fault for a month imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subbeh Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 If there were issues he knew about but failed to disclose or his advert contained lies then the small claims court will side with you. Proving this is obviously tricky and unfortunately the biggest risk in private buying. A post on the speed, plod and the law section of the piston heads forum will help if you feel he has been dishonest and wish to pursue it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyTravis Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 How much is a gearbox from a breakers yard and how much will it potentially cost to pursue the case if you do have a leg to stand on? is there a chance the guy didn't know there was anything up with the van, has cracked his pants that there's something wrong with something he's sold and is now denying all knowledge...a metaphorical ostrich manoeuvre? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4stringslow Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 To be fair, how much abuse could you have given that gearbox in 4 weeks? Not saying you did, just pointing out that no one knows. Also, how many of us have suffered a sudden breakdown of one sort or another through no fault of our own? Now imagine if we'd sold that vehicle one month before the breakdown and someone else had to pick up the mess? The whole thing sucks of course, but don't get all bitter and twisted over it - sh1t happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbyrne Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 You could always try a 'not as advertised' issue within Ebay. and take advice from your card company. Good luck. G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunburstjazz1967 Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 [quote name='geoffbyrne' timestamp='1457827123' post='3002207'] You could always try a 'not as advertised' issue within Ebay. and take advice from your card company. Good luck. G. [/quote] So the buyer has viewed it and been given a fair chance to check it over and presumably not been refused the chance to have an AA check or similar done?, "did research and background checks", driven it for a month and then goes back to ebay over it to try and get his cash back? I know it sucks for the op but this is why I'd never sell a car private and rather just take the hit from a dealer on px! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytoad Posted March 13, 2016 Author Share Posted March 13, 2016 [quote name='sunburstjazz1967' timestamp='1457820237' post='3002151'] How do you know it's had a whack in the side now that you didn't before? It would be hard to hide an impending gearbox fault for a month imo. [/quote] I removed the wooden labelling inside the van to install seats. The supporting pillar has be badly damaged and repaired. It has had a new outer skin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytoad Posted March 13, 2016 Author Share Posted March 13, 2016 [quote name='AndyTravis' timestamp='1457823306' post='3002181'] How much is a gearbox from a breakers yard and how much will it potentially cost to pursue the case if you do have a leg to stand on? is there a chance the guy didn't know there was anything up with the van, has cracked his pants that there's something wrong with something he's sold and is now denying all knowledge...a metaphorical ostrich manoeuvre? [/quote] I'm thinking it may be more trouble to persue and better off spending the £600 to get a recon fitted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytoad Posted March 13, 2016 Author Share Posted March 13, 2016 [quote name='andytoad' timestamp='1457830092' post='3002223'] I'm thinking it may be more trouble to persue and better off spending the £600 to get a recon fitted. [/quote] He is claiming he did not know, he has not owned it for long either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytoad Posted March 13, 2016 Author Share Posted March 13, 2016 [quote name='4stringslow' timestamp='1457826304' post='3002205'] To be fair, how much abuse could you have given that gearbox in 4 weeks? Not saying you did, just pointing out that no one knows. Also, how many of us have suffered a sudden breakdown of one sort or another through no fault of our own? Now imagine if we'd sold that vehicle one month before the breakdown and someone else had to pick up the mess? The whole thing sucks of course, but don't get all bitter and twisted over it - sh1t happens [/quote] Yes I agree, trouble is it's a lot of money to me, so pretty annoyed, if I'd paid for a knackered one at half the price I'd have no complaint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytoad Posted March 13, 2016 Author Share Posted March 13, 2016 [quote name='sunburstjazz1967' timestamp='1457829179' post='3002219'] So the buyer has viewed it and been given a fair chance to check it over and presumably not been refused the chance to have an AA check or similar done?, "did research and background checks", driven it for a month and then goes back to ebay over it to try and get his cash back? I know it sucks for the op but this is why I'd never sell a car private and rather just take the hit from a dealer on px! [/quote] Mostly true, except I was happy to accept the other faults - it's a used van, I accept I did not see the damaged panel and a number of other things. an exploding gearbox 4 weeks in? That's pushing it a little too far, hence seeking an opinion on the lovely BC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyTravis Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 [quote name='andytoad' timestamp='1457830092' post='3002223'] I'm thinking it may be more trouble to persue and better off spending the £600 to get a recon fitted. [/quote] Yeah, not in any way patronising - write it off to experience. I've just bought a used car from a friend of a friend...I know it was a mistake in some respects. But I wanted the car and it was cheaper than I would've paid a dealer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 ten years old, how many miles? From the sellers POV, dependant on the cause of the fault, I don't know how you would have expected him to know the gear box would only last a month. I'm guessing you had a mechanic have a wee shifty over it after you had bought it for basic safety things, and them didnt pick up on a possible problem in the gear box. To me it sounds like bad luck on your part more than something you can take back or get recompense on. If you had bought it secondhand from a dealer or from auction then after a month you wouldn't be able to take it back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 A month ago I nearly sold my van to a bandmate, but he decided it was too big. Three days later we had a sharp cold snap and the temperature dropped to minus three overnight. Next morning the brakes failed completely and without warning. Turned out the alloy brake lines were all corroded, but they worked fine until the cold made them brittle, then they all snapped the first time I braked. I dread to think how it would have looked if I had sold that van to a good friend, especially if he wasn't driving slowly when the brakes failed. With old vans (mine is 2005) this sort of sh*t goes with the territory, and unlucky coincidences do happen. Sell it for spares and walk away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameltoe Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) Like above, I think this would be a hard thing to conceal for a month and the seller probably had no knowledge. How many times have you had a vehicle break down with a major fault? How many times were you aware this was going to happen 4 weeks in advance? I bought a car a few years back, and within 2 weeks the cambelt snapped costing me over £1000 to repair the top end of the engine. Absolutely no way the seller could have known this would happen. If you're confident he did know, you'd have to prove it had been concealed somehow for the sale. Hoping it gets sorted. Edited March 13, 2016 by cameltoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquipment Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) Unfortunate Would be best to drop a new gearbox into it and get the mech to have a good once over to see if any other nasties are in there whilst the guts are all out of it Edited March 13, 2016 by tonyquipment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunburstjazz1967 Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 I think in reality you know this is just a bum deal and the frustration is what is making you think of retaliation? A temporary bodge by the seller would be the only thing possible for any comeback and I can't think of anything you could do to hide the fault for 4 weeks? The panel was only found when you removed the ply linings and presumably looked ok from the outside and did not come up as a cat C or cat D when you checked it out with the hpi check? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowlandtrees Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Had old vans all my life(current van from year 2000). I would repair it and punt it/px it to a dealer. If the gearbox is gone then other parts may/may not follow. Some vans are partial to particular problems eg had 3 diffs in one of my transits. You could be lucky and be OK but they are always a lottery. The AA btw do an excellent insurance cover that will pay up to £500 (I think) towards failing parts like this. It has to be part of a breakdown. My starter motor went the first year of the cover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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