A question of relief

[Twincam]

Trapped wind? No not today.

Its taken me a long time to find my ideal action height. While doing a lot of setups ive noticed different basses react different to the relief settings and so does string type used.

For those of use that measure these things in curious to know how much relief others like?
Anyone like a straight neck, zero relief or say minimally relief under say .005
Does anyone prefer a good bend in the neck by choice?
I'm not talking action height just the bend in the neck.

[Ghost_Bass]

Straight as a ruller for me...












[size=2]...but i use Yamahas, not those F things that often need some bending/schims/dressing so they dont get fretbuzz... [/size]

[Twincam]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1458061778' post='3004322']
Straight as a ruller for me...












[size=2]...but i use Yamahas, not those F things that often need some bending/schims/dressing so they dont get fretbuzz... [/size]
[/quote]

Haha!
To be honest ive had mixed results with fenders regarding setup in general. All of them can take a decent setup but very few can go really low without a lot of work!

From a playing point of view my preference isn't that low and I think fenders sound and play better with a average setup, rather than super low.
In terms of relief fenders should have a bit of a bend.

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1458063250' post='3004347']
Haha!
To be honest ive had mixed results with fenders regarding setup in general. All of them can take a decent setup but very few can go really low without a lot of work!

From a playing point of view my preference isn't that low and I think fenders sound and play better with a average setup, rather than super low.
In terms of relief fenders should have a bit of a bend.
[/quote]

Exactly, i agree 100%.

I'm a light player so i can have the strings very, very low without buzz. I also love the Yamaha tone so it's a win/win for me

[essexbasscat]

I've been doing more than a few set ups lately (see sandpaper for fret polishing) and this topic has been on my mind.

To begin with, I'm singing more often than not, so I set my instruments in a manner that will allow for a slightly less than precise playing style, as my attention is often divided between two tasks. Please assume that frets have been levelled and dressed when reading all comments below. Also, I lower the frets from around fret 12 to create a slight ramp

In general, I attempt to keep the neck as straight as possible. I find this easier to achieve with six string guitars, as the string movement is less compared to a bass string. In practice, I find something like 1/4 turn of the truss rod is needed for clean playing without fret buzz. Also, allowing 24hrs after truss rod adjustment does make a difference.

I've read that others allow a bit more clearance for the A string (as the break angle over the nut is different on Fenders compared to the other strings) and the G string (I assume this is because it travels more compared to the others when struck). I've found this to be the case with both strings.

I'd be interested to read any tips that others could give on the topic of setting instruments for low action, relief, factors to be taken into consideration etc

[Marvin]

I like 'em as straight as possible. The Sire is dead straight and there's very little relief in thr Squier VM precision I've just got. Both set up to how I like, lowish.

Oddly the one bass that always had to have a lot of relief in the neck was a Yamaha I had. It was a severe disappointment given their reputation. It didn't matter how hard I tried the overall set up was never one I liked, way too much relief and still buzzed.

[Twincam]

The only thing that is hard I find with having a very straight neck is when you get noise from the strings between the fretted note (around the 12th - 15th) and the nut. It doesn't come through the amp but it drives me crazy.

[ped]

Straight as an arrow. Most people play my bass and say it's unplayable because the action is so low and there's almost zero relief. I play VERY lightly though and like a bit of clank when I 'dig in'. If I alter my plucking a bit I can get almost the same as my slap sound. Combined with 40-100 strings it's very 'supple' and requires zero effort. When I gigged more I raised it a tiny bit (action, not relief) because with the adrenaline on stage I needed a bit more room, but now I play almost always at home or for recording where I can be exact.

Relief is critical for me because my bass has no truss rod so I can't adjust it, it's rock solid (graphite). The newer versions of my bass have a slightly greater amount of relief built in (but still not much) which I didn't feel as comfortable with - again, no truss rod, so I sold it on.

Here's a pic of my G string to give you some idea - although again this I suppose shows the action rather than relief but it's about this height all the way along (got a zero fret) https://flic.kr/p/dsv2Tp

[Twincam]

[quote name='essexbasscat' timestamp='1458066946' post='3004399']
I've been doing more than a few set ups lately (see sandpaper for fret polishing) and this topic has been on my mind.

To begin with, I'm singing more often than not, so I set my instruments in a manner that will allow for a slightly less than precise playing style, as my attention is often divided between two tasks. Please assume that frets have been levelled and dressed when reading all comments below. Also, I lower the frets from around fret 12 to create a slight ramp

In general, I attempt to keep the neck as straight as possible. I find this easier to achieve with six string guitars, as the string movement is less compared to a bass string. In practice, I find something like 1/4 turn of the truss rod is needed for clean playing without fret buzz. Also, allowing 24hrs after truss rod adjustment does make a difference.

I've read that others allow a bit more clearance for the A string (as the break angle over the nut is different on Fenders compared to the other strings) and the G string (I assume this is because it travels more compared to the others when struck). I've found this to be the case with both strings.

I'd be interested to read any tips that others could give on the topic of setting instruments for low action, relief, factors to be taken into consideration etc
[/quote]

Well as you have mentioned level frets is the biggest factor. Next is nut height when fretted at the third there must be a paper thin clearance between the first fret and the string, if it's laying on the fret that is wrong and of course if it's too high then that is self explanatory.
Next I would say the neck itself need to be in good condition no ski jumps! The fret board must be straight or have a marginal drop off. You can compensate for this by rolling off the frets when levelling but go to far and what happens is you fret a high note and the string then hits the frets between the nut, as said in my above post these noises are not picked up but they should not be there.
Then there is correct neck angle which can vary from bass to bass and may need experimentation with shims.
And a good adjustable bridge that is the correct height to begin with (not requiring shims in the neck pocket) is handy.
The relief is part of the action height in the bigger picture too obvious a straight neck the strings will sit closer to the frets.
String gauge and tension are factors too heavy gauge high tension strings move less and can give much less fret buzz, flats are good for this too.
And of course how hard you hit the strings Jeff Berlin and others advocate very light playing and will get away with very low action.

[Twincam]

[quote name='ped' timestamp='1458069623' post='3004429']
Straight as an arrow. Most people play my bass and say it's unplayable because the action is so low and there's almost zero relief. I play VERY lightly though and like a bit of clank when I 'dig in'. If I alter my plucking a bit I can get almost the same as my slap sound. Combined with 40-100 strings it's very 'supple' and requires zero effort. When I gigged more I raised it a tiny bit (action, not relief) because with the adrenaline on stage I needed a bit more room, but now I play almost always at home or for recording where I can be exact.

Relief is critical for me because my bass has no truss rod so I can't adjust it, it's rock solid (graphite). The newer versions of my bass have a slightly greater amount of relief built in (but still not much) which I didn't feel as comfortable with - again, no truss rod, so I sold it on.

Here's a pic of my G string to give you some idea - although again this I suppose shows the action rather than relief but it's about this height all the way along (got a zero fret) https://flic.kr/p/dsv2Tp
[/quote]

From that pic I can tell your bass is well set up and has a good neck!

[ped]

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1458070132' post='3004437']
From that pic I can tell your bass is well set up and has a good neck!
[/quote]

Funny you should say that because the tech who was doing some electrical bits on my bass the other week said 'Do you want me to set it up for you because the action is too low and there's a lot of buzz'

I said 'DON'T TOUCH IT!' because it's been perfected over the years (had it 10 year now) and when I picked it up I played it for him and showed how what works for one person may not work for another. There's no 'best' way to do it and everyone has different requirements but personally I think if you start with a straight neck then you can dial in whatever you need from there.

[Dan Dare]

I like some relief. I like to get my fingertips under the strings and dig in, so suffer from buzzes with a low action/straight neck. I hate fret buzz - even if it doesn't come through the amp, it deadens the string vibration.

Edited March 15, 2016 by Dan Dare