Barefaced Big Twin. Do i take the plunge?

[JTUK]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1461492576' post='3035032']
That's the right way to do it.

I never sell anything until I've gigged the next piece and proved it's a step up in tone and fits exactly with all the other parts. Barefaced cabs will sound very different. [b]There's a learning curve, where you have to readjust your ears, when you start hearing your playing in more detail and definition than you've been used to.[/b]

I used Mesa Boogie EV 115 and 210 cabs for 10 years and I'm now using 2 Barefaced Super Compacts. In between I owned Epifani and Bergantino. If neo cabs didn't sound good I wouldn't be using them. If the SC's didn't sound better, a positive upgrade, I'd have sold them and kept the Bergs.
[/quote]

This is not exclusive...unless you have previously been used to just not listening to your playing.
From a technical point of view, I can understand this might be the case with certain players depending
how they play but nuance is a big thing for a lot of players so they will know exactly what they sound like.
Their whole practice regime will have been geared to that.

[discreet]

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1461488177' post='3034951']
The history of Barefaced has a lot to do with it ... essentially the company could almost be seen as a spin-off from Basschat, with Alex Claber proving his point / putting his money where his mouth was by actually designing, building and marketing his own cabs. For no reason that I've ever understood, that's left a legacy of ... best choose my words carefully here ... friction between Alex and a number of others with ... erm ... strong views on the subject.
[/quote][quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1461499157' post='3035128']
All before my time then.
[/quote]

Before my time too, though that would certainly explain a lot!

[gafbass02]

[quote name='sunburstjazz1967' timestamp='1461483463' post='3034894']



Yes but they are always told that they are wrong, ignored or declared liers looking at other threads, lol.
[/quote]

Add me to that list.
I've owned three, used them a lot in different ways, and didn't like them, and every time I mentioned it, someone would get snippy in some way, (except Alex, who has always been very courteous)

There's some information on my findings here:
http://basschat.co.uk/topic/165022-new-amp-momark-plus-amp-historyreviewpics-lots-of-pics/

But as ever, it's each to their own, and I'd certainly be game to try them again in future, just perhaps with more realistic expectations. I find them a 'tool for the job' which is the job of being very light and loud enough to stage monitor, rather than something tonally pleasing (to me) at any volume. I find them Convenient but that's about it.
Again. Everyone's tone goals and opinions are different, and that's ok.
I just don't like it when people insinuate my opinions are somehow based in ignorance or inexperience. Both of which are laughably wide of the mark.

Edited April 24, 2016 by gafbass02

[Bobthedog]

Guys, as i said in my post, there is no "plunge". Although I have yet to test it, the site states and others have pointed out elsewhere, there is a 30 day trial period, which appears to allow gig play as well. Try it, if you do not like it, return it. Other than some inconvenience t send it back, I do not see there being an issue.

[warwickhunt]

[quote name='Bobthedog' timestamp='1461518476' post='3035332']
Guys, as i said in my post, there is no "plunge". Although I have yet to test it, the site states and others have pointed out elsewhere, there is a 30 day trial period, which appears to allow gig play as well. Try it, if you do not like it, return it. Other than some inconvenience t send it back, I do not see there being an issue.
[/quote]

That's a definite plus point. Just for clarity though it does require you to pay up front and wait for build/delivery and if you don't like it you do need to pay £30-£40 to send it back. To some a small price to pay and to be fair it could get costly if Alex had to take it on the chin for the cost of every return but it isn't a trial without any cost. A small point is that you do need to actually speak to Alex about your needs otherwise the 30 day trial is negated.

[taunton-hobbit]

I can't see a problem with any of the previous points -^
1) No business is going to chuck xhundred quids worth of stuff out to an unknown customer without payment, not in the real world.
2) £30/40 to send it back is very fair - try hiring good kit for thirty days for that..........
3) Alex is quite right to require customers to discuss their needs (I used email) - otherwise he could be on the end of a load of 'retail regret' returns.

I found Barefaced to be honest, straightforward and keen to 'get it right'.
OK, I bought something I like very much, so there is some bias here -
-I realise that the sound/design/handles aren't to everyones taste, but Alex must be doing 'something' right !

Edited April 24, 2016 by taunton-hobbit

[Dood]

Do you take the plunge?

Why yes of course you do! After many many years I have finally stopped saying, "maybe it's the cab that doesn't sound right." The Big Twin II is a superb bass cabinet. For me, I've always wanted a cabinet that would truthfully reproduce what I put in to it. Believe me, there are plenty of cabinets I've played CD's through and they just sound naff. (This is a good, simple way to find out what a cabinet does to your signal) The BTII would make a superb PA cabinet and for that reason (as well as many others) I no longer worry if the thing at the end of my signal chain is causing the problems.

I didn't always feel this way about BF cabinets mind. I wasn't a fan of the first (and certainly non-tweetered) cabinets. Even the midrange unit of the early versions left me for wanting.

Gen3, the BTII could still be considered an 'early offering' from Barefaced too. I mean, look at it this way... If only people knew how many iterations designers go through over the life of a product. The fact that Barefaced is only up to it's third generation of products is testament to the dedication going in to the products in that the Big Twin is that good, so quickly.

The only other cabinets I would add to my gear right now would actually be a pair of BB2's.

[51m0n]

My Big Twin 2 has replaced my Bergantino ae410 as my main gigging rig.

To the point where I'm thinking of selling my Berg....

Edited April 26, 2016 by 51m0n

[stevie]

[quote name='warwickhunt' timestamp='1461519826' post='3035350']
That's a definite plus point. Just for clarity though it does require you to pay up front and wait for build/delivery and if you don't like it you do need to pay £30-£40 to send it back. To some a small price to pay and to be fair it could get costly if Alex had to take it on the chin for the cost of every return but it isn't a trial without any cost. A small point is that you do need to actually speak to Alex about your needs otherwise the 30 day trial is negated.
[/quote]

Mail order customers have 14 days (according to the EU Distance Selling Regulations) in which to cancel an order without having to state a reason. I think they have another 14 days to return the goods (but don't quote me). The customer has to pay the cost of return carriage if it's in the seller's terms and conditions, but the seller *cannot charge a restocking fee or administration charge*.

While all mail order companies are legally bound to offer 14-day returns, 30-day returns policies are not exactly uncommon. Gear for Music (who will even cover the cost of return carriage if you notify them within 7 days), Thomann, Maplin, Argos, etc. Bax even have a 60-day trial period.

[Conan]

[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1461663040' post='3036481']
While all mail order companies are legally bound to offer 14-day returns, 30-day returns policies are not exactly uncommon. Gear for Music (who will even cover the cost of return carriage if you notify them within 7 days), Thomann, Maplin, Argos, etc. Bax even have a 60-day trial period.
[/quote]

Yes, but they are all large retailers with huge stocks of products from many manufacturers. It's not quite the same as a [b][i]manufacturer[/i][/b] offering a trial period. Not something I can see Aguilar, GK, Fender, Marshall [i]et al[/i] providing,

Edited April 26, 2016 by Conan

[stevie]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1461669379' post='3036551']
Yes, but they are all large retailers with huge stocks of products from many manufacturers. It's not quite the same as a [b][i]manufacturer[/i][/b] offering a trial period. Not something I can see Aguilar, GK, Fender, Marshall [i]et al[/i] providing,
[/quote]

Why should Aguilar, GK, Fender and Marshall offer a trial period? They are not in the mail order business. They sell via a network of retail outlets who provide the services of a specialist retailer, including online mail order. So if you want to try any of those brands you either visit the dealer or order online. What isn't quite the same is that nobody charges £30 or £40 for return delivery.

Edited April 26, 2016 by stevie

[spyder]

Mail order customers have 14 days (according to the EU Distance Selling Regulations) in which to cancel an order without having to state a reason. I think they have another 14 days to return the goods (but don't quote me). The customer has to pay the cost of return carriage if it's in the seller's terms and conditions, but the seller *cannot charge a restocking fee or administration charge*.

I work in the retail business and this is quite correct.

[Guest bassman7755]

I guess the difference is that Alex encourages people to try the cab out properly, gig it if necessary during the trial period. The consumer contracts legislation does not give a "trial period" - it is a transaction cooling off period that only allows you to "asses the goods as if you were in a shop", obviously it would hard to tell if someone took a cab to a practice or gig if they were really careful with it but its nice gesture that such a proper trial is officially sanctioned.

Edited April 26, 2016 by bassman7755

[Conan]

As usual, a Barefaced-based thread degenerates into a hair-splitting exercise!

Buy the bloody cab - what could possibly go wrong?

[Merton]

Does buying a stock bass from, say ACG, Status, Shuker et al, cover the same ground as buying from Barefaced...?

You see where I'm going with this...?

[Conan]

[quote name='Merton' timestamp='1461681810' post='3036701']

You see where I'm going with this...?
[/quote]

Er... no

[Merton]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1461683089' post='3036717']


Er... no
[/quote]

just wondered if that counted as "mail order" like Barefaced apparently does

Playing devils advocate

[Conan]

Oh I see!

[Beer of the Bass]

It seems like standard practice for online musical equipment retailers to cover the cost of return carriage only where the item has a fault or has been mis-sold. I haven't checked the policy of each and every retailer, but Andertons work this way, as do Thomann. I don't think Barefaced are asking for anything unusual in this.

[taunton-hobbit]

I'm with Conan - this is hair splitting try it/don't try it - I can't get excited about the detail - some people dislike the Company (why, I'm not quite sure, and care even less) - and a lot of people feel the other way - it's life (& bass cabinets)..........

[Ant_On_Bass]

Barefaced definitely seems to generate debate. I think it's very likely i will get myself one and see for myself :-D

[Lw.]

[quote name='Ant_On_Bass' timestamp='1461689617' post='3036827']
...I think it's very likely i will get myself one and see for myself :-D
[/quote]

Probably the best option, the internet opinions on the interpretation of distance selling laws were getting a bit dry.

[Dood]

[quote name='Merton' timestamp='1461681810' post='3036701'] Does buying a stock bass from, say ACG, Status, Shuker et al, cover the same ground as buying from Barefaced...? You see where I'm going with this...? [/quote]

I know that Shuker has T&Cs at the time of order including a cancellation policy, which if i recall correctly is fairly generous considering the nature of such an order. There is a difference in 'off the shelf stock' and 'custom order' though as you should expect

[Dood]

P.s.

Buy the cab!

[Raggy]

[quote name='dood' timestamp='1461690283' post='3036844']
P.s.

Buy the cab!
[/quote]

This.