Barefaced Big Twin. Do i take the plunge?

[stevie]

[IMG]http://i64.tinypic.com/30wp25z.jpg[/IMG]

[DiMarco]

[list=1]
[*]The BT2 is light, has casters, grips on sides and top, sounds awesome and goes loud as f***.
[*]I have been playing live since 1991, owned a large amount of different cabs (Trace Elliot, SWR, Eden to name but a few) and never heard any cab that sounds better across the stage then my current; a Bigtwin II Gen3. Everyone now hears what I am doing even when I am not being overly loud. THAT is the difference.
[/list]
Other options if you consider a Bigtwin:[list]
[*]Begantino 2x12 (they have several)
[*]VanderKley 212MNT
[/list]
P.S. I think the BF haters on here either clearly have a hidden agenda and will most likely be somehow allied with another cab company or shop OR should simply be considered internet trolls. Nothing they have come up with has been based on real life experience with any current Barefaced cabs, it is all copied hearsay nonsense and should be regarded as such.

[warwickhunt]

[quote name='DiMarco' timestamp='1461700048' post='3036960']P.S. I think the BF haters on here either clearly have a hidden agenda and will most likely be somehow allied with another cab company or shop OR should simply be considered internet trolls. Nothing they have come up with has been based on real life experience with any current Barefaced cabs, it is all copied hearsay nonsense and should be regarded as such.
[/quote]

Define 'BF hater'!

I've not liked any of the products that I've tried (and yes I have tried a few) but I don't hate BF... the ones I've tried aren't to my taste, end of. Likewise I'm not allied to a brand (owned many inc' Tech Soundsystem, Aguilar, Bergantino, EBS and most recently TC RS) or shop and I'm certainly not an internet troll! However, it seems crazy that when someone asks for 'an opinion' that those people who don't speak favourably of the brand might be considered to have a hidden agenda. Though to state that my (or other's views) must not be based on real life experience and is in fact hearsay is frankly ridiculous... and should by your definition be regarded as nonsense.

Sorry Dimarco but you have a very high opinion of yourself and/or a low one of others and your statement has a touch of; he who shouts loudest and last must be right.

[Marvin]

I'd get in touch with Alex, he may suggest an alternative BF cab. Then order it, try it out and see, or rather listen, and make your mind up.

Gear and tone are very personal and individual things. BF make a great product, the only way you'll find out if you like it is if you try one.

[JTUK]

[quote name='DiMarco' timestamp='1461700048' post='3036960'][list=1]
[*]The BT2 is light, has casters, grips on sides and top, sounds awesome and goes loud as f***.
[*]I have been playing live since 1991, owned a large amount of different cabs (Trace Elliot, SWR, Eden to name but a few) and never heard any cab that sounds better across the stage then my current; a Bigtwin II Gen3. Everyone now hears what I am doing even when I am not being overly loud. THAT is the difference.
[/list]
Other options if you consider a Bigtwin:[list]
[*]Begantino 2x12 (they have several)
[*]VanderKley 212MNT
[/list]
P.S. I think the BF haters on here either clearly have a hidden agenda and will most likely be somehow allied with another cab company or shop OR should simply be considered internet trolls. Nothing they have come up with has been based on real life experience with any current Barefaced cabs, it is all copied hearsay nonsense and should be regarded as such.
[/quote]

If you looked at other threads you'd also know that some have tried and god forbid, didn't like them.
But they don't have to start a new thread about it every 5 minutes. Your last sentence is laughable so I'd suggest it is you who are trolling.

[Merton]

Why does every damn BF thread end up in a bloody argument? It's pathetic.

Some people love the cabs
Some people love the idea of the cabs
Some people don't mind the cabs, but they can take them or leave them
Some people don't like the cabs based on 1st hand experience (i.e. they have gigged one themselves)
Some people don't like them based on hearing other people gig them
Some people don't like the cabs based on an impression of earlier generation cabs and haven't yet tried the newer ones
Some people don't like the cabs based on a number of design/construction/finishing aspects but may or may not have ever actually seen, played or even heard one

All of the above are perfectly valid, as they all allow us to form an opinion in one way or another. I for one can totally understand the looks thing - there are loads of cabs I wouldn't buy because of the looks but (for me) BF isn't in that category.

Let's leave it be for once shall we?

Edited April 26, 2016 by Merton

[taunton-hobbit]

I have Gen1 Dubsters.....they do what I want/need..............

[FinnDave]

Just buy the bloody thing!

[mcnach]

[quote name='warwickhunt' timestamp='1461489236' post='3034977']
I've not liked any that I have tried, they 'lack' a quality that I don't hear in them and that included the ceramic loaded cab that did the rounds BUT that is just my personal taste.

I have no axe to grind with Alex or his company and there are a LOT of folk who do love the BF sound, I do however think that in the early days there was lots written about the fact that Alex was revolutionising cab design and building them from the ground up (my words) rather than copying badly thought out dated designs that had no basis in acoustic design. I recall many threads before BF was even thought of where I would hear Alex, Bill et al rip into poor cab design and give us valuable insight into how it 'should' be done; hence Alex went off to plan BF and many of us waited to see what would transpire. Several years down the line we have a BF 4x10 that looks exactly like every other 410 and yet that very design was criticised and lambasted by Alex et al for being the antithesis of all that was bad with bass cabinet design. Alex has every right to cater to what others want/expect but for me personally other than maintaining the use of the lightest materials and superb bracing to make a cab uber light (is the 410 light?), BF has drifted from where I imagined it would go. Just my own personal view of the BF story.
[/quote]

but it's not like every other 410, is it?

[quote]All four drivers in the Four10 work in unison to produce big bass and punchy mids but to improve dispersion only one column of two has treble output - just like a PA line array.[/quote][...]

[odysseus]

Is it possible to get along to BF mission control and try one out? Newton Abbot to Brighton isn't that big a shlep for the investment you're about to make.

In other news... get one. I did. Frickin awesome!!

[JamesBass]

If you're that interested in one make the trip down there, Alex and crew are most welcoming! They literally bend over backwards to let you try what you want! Invariably you'll get a chance to chat to the man himself, and he's a true gent! I was down there last week and I felt very welcome and very looked after! I lucked out as they had a Big Baby II in the final stages of build that was un-designated so I've managed to get that one, it'll be ready for collection this week!

[stevie]

[quote name='warwickhunt' timestamp='1461701137' post='3036969']
Define 'BF hater'!
[/quote]

It's interesting how this term gets used in a passive/aggressive way on every BF thread. It doesn't get used anywhere else on Basschat as far as I can tell. So you can draw your own conclusions on that. You'll find it on page one of this thread, in post 13. It seems to be a way of stopping any balanced discussion before it can even start. The following answers warwickhunt's question quite nicely (http://www.theporchvaldosta.com/blog/5-reasons-that-people-who-call-others-haters-are-the-real-haters-and-why-social-media-shaming-is-of-the-devil).

[b]So here are 5 Reasons that people who call others ‘haters’ are also doing the hating.[/b][list]
[*]When a Passive-Aggressive Hater calls another a ‘hater’ they are implying that the ‘hater’ is narrow-minded, inflexible, ignorant, uninformed, and well, a ‘hater’!

This is nothing short of immature name-calling. What is the hoped for outcome in making such declarations? Most likely to discredit or shame the other person so that the PAH will feel as if they have ‘won’ an argument that the other person wasn’t even aware was taking place.
[*]When a Passive-Aggressive Hater calls another a ‘hater’ they are saying that the ‘hater’ is unable to have an opinion that varies from their (perceived) more superior opinion. This is the epitome of self-righteousness. [i]How dare someone else think differently than me? I'm practically an expert on this topic. Don’t they know how many blogs and articles I have 'liked' and shared?[/i]
[*]When a PAH calls another a ‘hater’ they are unapologetically declaring that the ‘hater’ would change their tune if they were only as enlightened as the PAH, or as privileged, or as experienced, or as motivated, or if they possessed the God-like qualities that the PAH does.

This goes hand-in-hand with self-righteousness. But there is more to this…
(Read with the best hoity-toity voice you can muster)
[i]Oh, if only those ‘haters’ would have read the book I have read, or the online posts…tsk…tsk…they would understand. Poor creatures. I will help by posting pictures and passive-aggressive hashtags. Then they will all see the error of their way, declare my opinion to be superior, and join me on my quest for perfection.[/i]
[*]PAH’s that call others ‘haters’ are revealing a huge insecurity in their life and in the decisions that they make. This is little more than projecting a self-hate.

Why else would someone want to publicly declare someone a ‘hater’ just because they don’t agree with, support, or ride the same band-wagon that the PAH does? This public shaming that the PAH is trying to accomplish is only shining a big ugly spotlight on their deep-seated insecurities and buried-deep-down questioning of their latest decision (fad or otherwise).
[*]PAH’s use social media to say like a kid on the playground with a giant ice cream cone, “nanny-nanny-boo-boo” to anyone they have declared to be a ‘hater’ by posting [i]unsolicited[/i] [i]progress[/i] reports of how [i]awesome and popular[/i] their life/opinion is.

[i]I’ll show them! Those ‘haters’ will regret ever questioning my choices, motives, and decisions. I will post every aspect of my mundane life and others will be so jealous![/i]
[/list]

[CamdenRob]

[quote name='DiMarco' timestamp='1461700048' post='3036960']
P.S. I think the BF haters on here either clearly have a hidden agenda and will most likely be somehow allied with another cab company or shop OR should simply be considered internet trolls. Nothing they have come up with has been based on real life experience with any current Barefaced cabs, it is all copied hearsay nonsense and should be regarded as such.
[/quote]

...

[Conan]

Oh FFS!!

To the OP - Please just buy the cab. Any cab... just put us out of this state of misery!!!

[Musicman20]

stevie - Good post. Makes a lot of sense.

We should all be allowed to post our honest thoughts on a forum, as long as it does not offend. No one should feel they cannot state they like/dislike something, and it is absolutely fine to change your mind.

I have eaten my own words with Boss pedals. Once looked upon with a little bit of a frown, I've realised that actually 85%+ of the pedals they manufacture are absolutely brilliant, especially when tested in a variety of settings (this applies mainly to guitar for me). I have told many a guitarist that my views on Boss have changed now I've used them without much outside influence.

[mcnach]

[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1461743038' post='3037203']
It's interesting how this term gets used in a passive/aggressive way on every BF thread. It doesn't get used anywhere else on Basschat as far as I can tell.
[/quote]

It's a bit weird, but I think it's just a reaction to the -often real- attraction that some people seem to have for threads with the BF name on them just to criticise or make fun.

There are multiple threads about, say Precision basses, and you don't seem to have a number of people (often the same ones thread after thread) regularly joining in just to say "Precisions, meh".
I do not understand that, but I noticed it. I don't care but... I can see where the reaction comes from, and sometimes it's triggered a bit too quickly too soon...

[mcnach]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1461748788' post='3037262']
stevie - Good post. Makes a lot of sense.

We should all be allowed to post our honest thoughts on a forum, as long as it does not offend. No one should feel they cannot state they like/dislike something, and it is absolutely fine to change your mind.

I have eaten my own words with Boss pedals. Once looked upon with a little bit of a frown, I've realised that actually 85%+ of the pedals they manufacture are absolutely brilliant, especially when tested in a variety of settings (this applies mainly to guitar for me). I have told many a guitarist that my views on Boss have changed now I've used them without much outside influence.
[/quote]

+1

[Conan]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1461759379' post='3037367']
I think it's just a reaction to the -often real- attraction that some people seem to have for threads with the BF name on them just to criticise or make fun.
[/quote]

Yes - or people who think that it is their prerogative to post in order to restore some sort of "balance" to the argument. As if too much praise for a product cannot be allowed?! So they are actually sticking their oar in for our benefit!

I like Barefaced cabs (or at least, the ones that I have tried and/or owned). I make no secret of that fact. However, I don't think they are perfect. The fact that the range keeps expanding and revising shows that even Alex Claber shares the view that perfection has not yet been achieved. Unlike some people on here though, he listens to feedback and responds to it.

I was always dubious about Bergantino products. Probably because I don't like it when people shout from the rooftops that "such and such a product" is the best. Anyway, I bought a pair of HS210s and used them for a while. They were good. Very good even... but in the end I sold them because I found them too heavy and bulky for my needs. Also, although the tone was lovely, I found the dispersion average.

I went back to a Barefaced Compact (and a TKS H115) because they are my favourite cabs as they (for me) offer the best compromises in volume, tone, size and mass. I love them both equally, but for different reasons. Other people will reach other conclusions for their own reasons.

On the other hand, I owned a Barefaced Big One that, while in some ways being outstanding, caused problems due to its incompatibility with certain amps (including the one that I just happened to be using at the time!). Again, no manufacturer is perfect in every situation!

I guess what I am saying is "horses for courses" and that variety is the spice of life. Or something like that...

Edited April 27, 2016 by Conan

[JTUK]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1461746284' post='3037235']
Oh FFS!!

To the OP - Please just buy the cab. Any cab... just put us out of this state of misery!!!
[/quote]

and then don't come back here and moan as one or other party will be able to say told you so

[JTUK]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1461766355' post='3037432']
[b]Yes - or people who think that it is their prerogative to post in order to restore some sort of "balance" to the argument. As if too much praise for a product cannot be allowed?! So they are actually sticking their oar in for our benefit![/b]

I like Barefaced cabs (or at least, the ones that I have tried and/or owned). I make no secret of that fact. However, I don't think they are perfect. The fact that the range keeps expanding and revising shows that even Alex Claber shares the view that perfection has not yet been achieved. Unlike some people on here though, he listens to feedback and responds to it.

I was always dubious about Bergantino products. Probably because I don't like it when people shout from the rooftops that "such and such a product" is the best. Anyway, I bought a pair of HS210s and used them for a while. They were good. Very good even... but in the end I sold them because I found them too heavy and bulky for my needs. Also, although the tone was lovely, I found the dispersion average.

I went back to a Barefaced Compact (and a TKS H115) because they are my favourite cabs as they (for me) offer the best compromises in volume, tone, size and mass. I love them both equally, but for different reasons. Other people will reach other conclusions for their own reasons.

On the other hand, I owned a Barefaced Big One that, while in some ways being outstanding, caused problems due to its incompatibility with certain amps (including the one that I just happened to be using at the time!). Again, no manufacturer is perfect in every situation!

I guess what I am saying is "horses for courses" and that variety is the spice of life. Or something like that...
[/quote]

Why should it be any different tho... the question is generally, 'should I'..? often followed by something along the lines of 'BC loves them so I'll buy etc etc '...
No,... certain BC-ers love them... and some don't, but the people who sing their praises a lot and start quite a few posts seem to think that they can't be challenge.

What starts a lot of this nonsense is some one saying they don't like them and daring to post that. Some 'likers' seem to react to that and the 'non-likers' react to be told their opinion
isn't required when the OP initially asks what do WE think.

I think warwickhunts post was fair enough. It is his opinion, he wasn't rude to anyone,... but here we are again...

Somebody is being too precious here... and you can't not like 'BC's favourite cab'.. so until anyone bans any anti posts and the OP doesn't actually say 'non-likers' don't post your opinions because I don't want to know, lets carry on as usual..but grow up a bit.



FWIW, a friend who had/has one, asked me what I thought of his sound... it didn't make any difference. His sound was poor in the first place ( before he got the cab) - to my ears- and it is still poor now.
The problem is often in the ears
All I could say was you might want to play with your amp EQ and get used to it... he is still gigging as far as I know...hasn't got fired yet.

Edited April 27, 2016 by JTUK

[Conan]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1461767513' post='3037455']
and then don't come back here and moan as one or other party will be able to say told you so
[/quote]

Of course!

[machinehead]

I find that it takes a while to get to know a cab, (This applies to all gear really.) So I've never expressed a view here of a cab I haven't gigged for several gigs at least. I don't feel qualified to comment otherwise.

So as far as the Barefaced argument goes, or any other cab manufacturer, I've always read the comments of the inexperienced with a pinch of salt.

One poster even posted about Barefaced cabs that he'd tried and didn't like.... [i][b]"No, but to be fair, [u]I didn't like the look of the cab[/u] from the off so 5 mins or less was enough. "[/b][/i]

That's neither an open minded trial or a fair trial and certainly doesn't add to a balanced argument on the forum.

Frank.

[JTUK]

I agree any part of the signal chain is a work of progress.

Recent purchases ( 6 months or so) include an amp, cab and bass.
I knew pretty soon (quickly) that I could work with them though.........

[Ant_On_Bass]

Well that escalated quickly! At the end of the day everyone is entitled to their own opinion, not everyone will agree that's the beauty of forums etc, although I can't say I'm interested or enjoy reading the passive aggressive side of things but completely take criticisms/positives on board, that was the reason for asking after all :-)

Regarding the cab, how tough is the tolex on these? Having a road ready powerhouse I never need to worry about damaging it! Having said that if I did end up buying one I'd probably end up buying a case for it anyway :-P

[barkin]

[quote name='Ant_On_Bass' timestamp='1461778095' post='3037607']
Regarding the cab, how tough is the tolex on these?
[/quote]

Not 100 percent sure, but I think a 'tuff-cab' kinda finish is standard on the Big Twin.