mrtcat Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 (edited) [quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1469777371' post='3100941'] So tone shaping shouldn't be a problem. What about PA cabs? [/quote] RCF 745s and RCF905s. The gear is more capable than me for sure when it comes to good tone. Edited July 29, 2016 by mrtcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 [quote name='mrtcat' timestamp='1469777480' post='3100942'] RCF 745s and RCF905s. The gear is more capable than me for sure when it comes to good tone. [/quote] I'm very, very surprised you can't make that setup work. You're the guy with four 905s aren't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtcat Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 [quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1469777997' post='3100945'] I'm very, very surprised you can't make that setup work. You're the guy with four 905s aren't you? [/quote] Yep we have four but rarely use them all unless its a big venue. I think it's more about my ability as an engineer than anything else or maybe I'm so used to hearing the bass through an amp that when its through the PA it just sounds so big that it throws me a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bassman7755 Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 (edited) [quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1469705698' post='3100459'] I think my key point is, that there is a lot more you can do to improve the sound in a live situation before considering such an expensive DI. [/quote] Likewise I dont see any problem at all using the DI from a good amp as long as you avoid extreme EQ settings such as massively boosted lows and/or cut mids. Most likely if it sounds good in IEMs it will sound decent FOH since they will have a similar frequency range and response. Its more of problem when you have a highly voiced cab where your tone settings for that likely wont work so well FOH. Edited July 29, 2016 by bassman7755 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2elliot Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 (edited) [quote name='FuNkShUi' timestamp='1469713792' post='3100576'] [/quote] The Pickfords Shuffle Brilliant Edited July 29, 2016 by 2elliot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 [quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1469778479' post='3100948'] Likewise I dont see any problem at all using the DI from a good amp as long as you avoid extreme EQ settings such as massively boosted lows and/or cut mids. Most likely if it sounds good in IEMs it will sound decent FOH since they will have a similar frequency range and response. Its more of problem when you have a highly voiced cab where your tone settings for that likely wont work so well FOH. [/quote] Agreed - I suspect I may open a can of worms here.... - but pre-eq to your desk from your amp is fine. It doesn't matter what EQ you choose to use on an amp then. In fact, the sound coming out of your speakers when using IEMs is a bit of a moot point as you shouldn't be hearing it directly anyway. What you say about the IEM sound I don't necessarily agree with though. The treble response of your inears maybe be a little more excitable than front of house... and certainly, if you are boasting big subwoofers front of house, you may find that the bass response in your ears a little lacking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 [quote name='mrtcat' timestamp='1469777480' post='3100942'] RCF 745s and RCF905s. The gear is more capable than me for sure when it comes to good tone. [/quote] I'd be running nothing more than a 1x12, 2x10 or in ears with that PA, honestly you would need a very serious bass amp to compete with that out front, I'm talking like Flea's 7 cabs serious! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtcat Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1469788554' post='3101030'] I'd be running nothing more than a 1x12, 2x10 or in ears with that PA, honestly you would need a very serious bass amp to compete with that out front, I'm talking like Flea's 7 cabs serious! [/quote] Don't get me wrong, size of sound and volume isn't an issue at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 [quote name='mrtcat' timestamp='1469799965' post='3101157'] Don't get me wrong, size of sound and volume isn't an issue at all. [/quote] What's going down then? The case that it sound so different to what you are used to hearing coming out of your amp? Your setup should sound huge (which is a good thing) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtcat Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 [quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1469801155' post='3101171'] What's going down then? The case that it sound so different to what you are used to hearing coming out of your amp? Your setup should sound huge (which is a good thing) [/quote] Yeah I just never feel that it sounds as tight as I'd like it. It's really hard to explain and is probably more of a problem that as the guy who ends up engineering as well as playing I never have the time to work on how it sounds. I should probably rig the PA up somewhere and spend a few hours tinkering until I'm happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I think that's what you need, make a good starting mix into one 745 and save it on the mixer, adding more speakers on the gig should just make it sounds better! If there's something you don't like in the initial mix you will just be fighting it during the gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Just out of interest, what is your bass rig? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 It's a bank of six SVTs with an Ampeg fridge for each one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDaddy Posted July 30, 2016 Share Posted July 30, 2016 Am I alone in enjoying the trouser flapping goodness on stage through my bass cab? I would love the convenience of not having to take it, but can IEMs give the full body bass experience? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulmcnamara Posted July 30, 2016 Share Posted July 30, 2016 (edited) Tis the way to go I feel. We use X18 and P16 personal monitors; players have choice of iem's or floor wedge. Also using a RCF light weight PA and M80 direct box, guitarist just uses his floor effects unit into PA. We are so lightweight and the quality is so good, can't see us returning to the good bad old days! Edited July 30, 2016 by paulmcnamara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted July 30, 2016 Share Posted July 30, 2016 The problem imo is that in many venues trouser flapping volume is too much for the on stage mix, that gives the guitarist the perfect excuse to blast the Marshall, the singer now can't hear themselves so the monitors go up, more feedback and now the band is louder than the PA. The dog and duck and an 8x10 don't mix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted July 30, 2016 Share Posted July 30, 2016 [quote name='MacDaddy' timestamp='1469870142' post='3101568'] Am I alone in enjoying the trouser flapping goodness on stage through my bass cab? I would love the convenience of not having to take it, but can IEMs give the full body bass experience? [/quote] The point is, there is no trouser flapping. There's the feeling of your ears getting absolutely ragged - which if that is your aim, a set of IEMs running stupidly loud would win anyway... and then there is the feeling or resonance and stray vibrations around your cab... like the floor shaking on crappy stages or example - if that is what you are craving, you may want to check out a pleasure board or the offerings from porter and davis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted July 30, 2016 Share Posted July 30, 2016 I'd carry an ampeg single handed to every gig before standing on a pleasure board! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtcat Posted July 30, 2016 Share Posted July 30, 2016 [quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1469828485' post='3101433'] Just out of interest, what is your bass rig? [/quote] Aguilar DB750 and two TKS 1126. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuNkShUi Posted July 30, 2016 Author Share Posted July 30, 2016 [quote name='mrtcat' timestamp='1469885433' post='3101779'] Aguilar DB750 and two TKS 1126. [/quote] Hell of a rig!! Cant imagine you ever actually need two of those cabs. Especially if you are going through the PA too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtcat Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 [quote name='FuNkShUi' timestamp='1469887568' post='3101800'] Hell of a rig!! Cant imagine you ever actually need two of those cabs. Especially if you are going through the PA too [/quote] Yeah they came as a pair but rarely use both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyJohnson Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 I haven't read the whole thread here, but from the perspective of gigging without an amp (or rig) is a definite no no from me. Last night we were the opener at a gig in Reading. Four bands. I'd been assured the headliners would be providing the cabinetry to aid a quicker turnaround between bands, so (in hindsight, stupidly), I left my 4x10 at home. Consequently, I ended up running a Sansamp RBI direct into the PA and frankly, it was a disaster. Although I was assured by people watching us said it sounded OK front of house, I know for a fact that I played a good chunk of one song in the wrong key as I simply couldn't hear what I was playing and I failed to notice I was two frets higher on the neck than I should have been. I can't actually see how IEMs would have improved the situation either as I would only have been monitoring myself as the venue (and I suppose most of the venues we play too) wouldn't have had any kind of way to facilitate IEMs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 [quote name='NancyJohnson' timestamp='1470040643' post='3102786'] I haven't read the whole thread here, but from the perspective of gigging without an amp (or rig) is a definite no no from me. Last night we were the opener at a gig in Reading. Four bands. I'd been assured the headliners would be providing the cabinetry to aid a quicker turnaround between bands, so (in hindsight, stupidly), I left my 4x10 at home. Consequently, I ended up running a Sansamp RBI direct into the PA and frankly, it was a disaster. Although I was assured by people watching us said it sounded OK front of house, I know for a fact that I played a good chunk of one song in the wrong key as I simply couldn't hear what I was playing and I failed to notice I was two frets higher on the neck than I should have been. I can't actually see how IEMs would have improved the situation either as I would only have been monitoring myself as the venue (and I suppose most of the venues we play too) wouldn't have had any kind of way to facilitate IEMs. [/quote] Iems wouldn't help? No aux sends on the desk then? There's plenty of original acts I know that give the sound guy a transmitter and ask them for a mix. With all due respect, this is one of the problems with IEMs - they are poo pooed before being given a proper chance. Either cheap headphones, cheap radio gear or a crappy mix is usually all newcomers have as a benchmark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 Sounds more like crappy venue and/or engineer than a reason to rely on a cab of your own, if you know that can't happen (i.e. You have control of the PA like most function bands) that's not going to happen, failing that you need to do a JTUK and get written confirmation that there will be six db or d and b monitors at every gig! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyJohnson Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 I've never used IEMs; in general I've just used my good ol' ears(!), which together with a combination of backline, monitors and live drums has worked pretty well for the last three decades or so. Sure, there's been the odd instance where things may have gone a tad awry using this combination, but it's generally been in a situation where things are stacked against us (like last night), but we know our material backwards, are experienced enough to make the best of things and will grind through the set. We, like many bands, play small venues where the sound guy is simply there to cover vocals, plus the bass and snare drums, so there's no logic in saying that IEMs would have resolved anything last night. I'm not pooping on IEMs in the slightest (I was citing my experience from last night only), but horses for courses as they say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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