TimCook Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 (edited) Hi there, I've recently swapped strings on my bass from 40-100 stainless roundwounds to 50-105 tapewounds (La Bella Gold/White Nylon) so thicker and with much lower tension and am struggling to set it up. I'm getting a lot of rattle from the E-string (the others are fine). I've loosened the truss rod 4x quarter turns but the E-string is still too close to the fretboard (with the 1st fret capo'd and 24th fret held). On the feeler gauge the string currently moves at 0.008" at the 8th fret - on my other basses I'm perfectly set up at 0.013". I'm confident the action is correct (I don't play with super low action) so does anyone know many turns is it safe to apply to a truss rod? The last couple of 1/4 turns haven't noticeably changed anything so I'm concerned turning more might only damage it!! Edited August 2, 2016 by TimCook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franzbassist Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 (edited) A whole turn is quite a lot! Have you let the neck settle for a day or two at this lower tension? Where exactly does the e string rattle? It sounds like you may need to raise the action a bit to compensate for the thicker gauge and lower tension. I use white nylons too and find I have to set the low E and B a touch higher than normal to compensate for this. Edited August 2, 2016 by walbassist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimCook Posted August 2, 2016 Author Share Posted August 2, 2016 (edited) Thanks for the reply and yes, that's exactly what I thought! I gave it a couple of 1/4 turns on Thursday, then another 1/4 on Friday and left it to settle over the weekend. I've given it another turn earlier tonight but feel it's not doing the trick so am tempted to wind it back to the point where there was last an affect and then make a compromise with raising the action. Again I'll leave it overnight though. It rattles awfully on open 'E' then there's progressively less rattle until the 10th fret. Short of raising action there's not a lot else I can think of (other than going for the higher tension 0.115 string) if truss rod won't do it. I'm mainly concerned the feeler gauge measures much lower than it should as a starting point. Edited August 2, 2016 by TimCook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twincam Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 Oh and if its rattling on an open E its possible the nut is cut too low too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norris Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 [quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1470165679' post='3103815'] Oh and if its rattling on an open E its possible the nut is cut too low too! [/quote] Yes - I was going to say check that the (slighty thicker) string is sitting comfortably in the nut slot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowieBass Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 Loosening the truss rod by a turn or so allowing the neck to develop more relief is safer than tightening it to straighten it out. Checking the relief in the manner you describe has told you correctly that there isn't enough relief. AFAIK you can't damage the truss rod even if you unscrew the adjustment nut completely. The fact that there's fret buzz/rattling near the nut also suggests insufficient relief to me (fret buzz at the dusty end indicates too much relief and buzz along the whole fretboard indicates the action is too low). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twincam Posted August 3, 2016 Share Posted August 3, 2016 Does the bass has a dual action truss rod? Essential really when fitting low tension strings as you can add relief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted August 3, 2016 Share Posted August 3, 2016 What I would do to start is slacken off the strings. Slacken the Truss Rod. Take the neck off and remove any shims that anyone may have put in the pocket. Then refit the neck, making sure the neck is well seated in the pocket as you do the screws up. Let the neck settle over night and then re-tune. Then go through a standard set-up. Then if you find the action too high, you might find you want the shim back in, but you need to find out what you have first. Also, it seems that on finding the action too low, you've gone straight for the truss rod. The job of the TR is to straighten the neck. This is called "the Refief". What you should adjust for the height of the action is the bridge. If you'd like a set up you can send the bass to me and I'll do it for you FOC. OR if you can wait a few days I'll probably be in the Hampton area, I could collect it, or maybe, fix it on the spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimCook Posted August 3, 2016 Author Share Posted August 3, 2016 (edited) [quote name='Norris' timestamp='1470173186' post='3103905'] Yes - I was going to say check that the (slighty thicker) string is sitting comfortably in the nut slot [/quote] The nut isn't ideal since the silk encroaches very slightly at the back (it's a thick nut) so widening a touch at the exit may help here. However this doesn't solve rattle on fretted notes. Edited August 3, 2016 by TimCook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimCook Posted August 3, 2016 Author Share Posted August 3, 2016 [quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1470190139' post='3103981'] Does the bass has a dual action truss rod? Essential really when fitting low tension strings as you can add relief. [/quote] Hi Twincam, I'm not sure but you may have hit the nail on the head if not! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimCook Posted August 3, 2016 Author Share Posted August 3, 2016 [quote name='HowieBass' timestamp='1470174025' post='3103913'] Loosening the truss rod by a turn or so allowing the neck to develop more relief is safer than tightening it to straighten it out. Checking the relief in the manner you describe has told you correctly that there isn't enough relief. AFAIK you can't damage the truss rod even if you unscrew the adjustment nut completely. The fact that there's fret buzz/rattling near the nut also suggests insufficient relief to me (fret buzz at the dusty end indicates too much relief and buzz along the whole fretboard indicates the action is too low). [/quote] Thanks Howiebass, you've reassured me by answering the original question (damage by overslacking) and that I was thinking in the right direction Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowieBass Posted August 3, 2016 Share Posted August 3, 2016 @Grangur - TimCook says he checked the relief and it was insufficient (.008") even after slackening off the truss rod by a complete turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimCook Posted August 3, 2016 Author Share Posted August 3, 2016 (edited) [quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1470205296' post='3103993'] What I would do to start is slacken off the strings. Slacken the Truss Rod. Take the neck off and remove any shims that anyone may have put in the pocket. Then refit the neck, making sure the neck is well seated in the pocket as you do the screws up. Let the neck settle over night and then re-tune. Then go through a standard set-up. Then if you find the action too high, you might find you want the shim back in, but you need to find out what you have first. [/quote] Hi Grangur, thanks for your suggestion... Removing the neck isn't something I'd like to do, as a last resort maybe. I much appreciate the offer of a second eye/help, I'll have another check when I get in tonight, see if it's settled at all and may well get back to you. 'A very kind offer! Edited August 3, 2016 by TimCook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimCook Posted August 8, 2016 Author Share Posted August 8, 2016 A little update.. I raised the action, pulled back the silk on the 'E' so the nut is well clear and left everything to settle while away at the weekend and the bass now plays beautifully. Cheers for the suggestions guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twincam Posted August 8, 2016 Share Posted August 8, 2016 [quote name='TimCook' timestamp='1470664604' post='3107451'] A little update.. I raised the action, pulled back the silk on the 'E' so the nut is well clear and left everything to settle while away at the weekend and the bass now plays beautifully. Cheers for the suggestions guys. [/quote] Shame you couldn't get the relief you wanted. Bit long as it still plays ok then raising the action is the only thing you can do sometimes with very low tension strings if the rod won't allow any more relief. There are other ways around this but then your compromising the bass setup, if you go back to any higher tension strings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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