Non massacre of 4 string

[christhammer666]

Question for you all. I'm in a band which plays in drop d so easily done on a 4 string but have been asked to play with another band who will play in drop b. I have no desire to buy a 5er and I'm not keen on the idea of messing up my 4s to much. Even if I had a pro set up and changed it back a year later I don't fancy it. Anyone else turned a band down cos of pain in the ass tunings ?

[kusee pee]

Get a 5er and never turn back. You know you want to.

[Mykesbass]

BEAD tuning won't harm your 4 string. New nut and a tweak of the trussrod is all it will be.

[christhammer666]

Can just about get my small fingers round a 4 let alone a 5

[fretmeister]

[quote name='Mykesbass' timestamp='1473703416' post='3132425']
BEAD tuning won't harm your 4 string. New nut and a tweak of the trussrod is all it will be.
[/quote]

This.

Or get a 5. Despite my first 20 years of playing a 4 I now wouldn't be without that extra string.

[discreet]

Plus one for BEAD - but in answer to your question I have indeed turned down a band due to tuning issues. Though to be fair, I probably would have turned them down due to any number of other issues, but it didn't help.

Edited September 12, 2016 by discreet

[BigRedX]

Do you NEED to change your tuning to match what the rest of the band uses?

On the two occasions when I've played with guitarists who down-tune or use non-standard tunings I've kept my bass tuned as normal and haven't had a problem. In fact IMO it generally leads to more interesting bass lines and overall arrangements since I can't always do the same as the guitars but an octave lower.

[ordep]

Havent tried it personally, but try to check the digitech drop pedal.

http://youtu.be/4Ux3pEIpxjc

Edited September 12, 2016 by ordep

[thodrik]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1473715937' post='3132583']
Do you NEED to change your tuning to match what the rest of the band uses?

On the two occasions when I've played with guitarists who down-tune or use non-standard tunings I've kept my bass tuned as normal and haven't had a problem. In fact IMO it generally leads to more interesting bass lines and overall arrangements since I can't always do the same as the guitars but an octave lower.
[/quote]

This is always an option worth considering and can lead to some very cool results.

I usually tune my four string to match the guitarists as I find it easier for the guitarists to follow what I'm doing during a writing session (it avoids the 'what notes are you actually playing' discussions...). If I am using a five string I will sometimes tune that to suit the tuning of the guitarists as well rather than keeping it in standard tuning. That is just my personal preference though.

For the original poster, what type of drop B are you using? Standard tuning with just the E string dropped to B or the drop D equivalent of tuning to C# standard? If it is the latter, I would look at the D'addario balanced tension set at 120 - 50. You can pick up a set for less than £20. I have used the strings for all manner of tunings from drop B up to D standard. If you prefer being in the same tuning as the guitarists then this might be more beneficial than tuning a four string bass tuned B E A D or getting a five string in standard tuning. It really just depends on how you want to approach it though.

Personally, I play quite a lot of low tuned stoner and doom music and have never had any problems from setting up basses with various tunings with larger strings and then later setting the bass back up for standard tuning when I start another project. It will not under any circumstances mess up the bass. You just have to be conscious that there are no magic strings that will be able to play drop B and then tuned back up to standard tuning without the need for another set up.

I have never turned down a band because of alternate tunings. I have however turned down bands where every song is played in drop D tuning using the same chord patterns, though that is the band's fault rather than the tuning. I have however turned down guitarists who are not willing explore alternate tunings, such as the songs are in D standard or drop C and he/she insists that it isn't possible to set up a guitar for this tuning despite the fact that they are a massive Mastodon fan and half of their songs are in that tuning or lower).

If you don't want to play in that tuning though then just tell the band you are not interested and leave it at that.

[christhammer666]

the tuning will be B,F#,B,E. I don't mind adjusting saddles and tweaing truss rods I just don want to bugger the nut in case I go back to standard tuning with 45-105s

[Lw.]

It's really not a problem to play drop D on a 4-string; just get some slightly higher gauge strings, it doesn't even need to be a big difference & you don't need to change the nut. You can get some pretty thin necked 5-strings nowadays though - maybe look at Ibanez?

I assume you're looking at riff-y music so the whole play your basslines on a non-dropped bass isn't an option.

[chris_b]

As a general observation I'd say if anyone can't get around on a 5 string bass then they need to work on their technique.

If you need to use different open strings to standard tuning then even a 5er might not be the best option. A better approach seems to be a bass tuned down to the tuning you want. Multiple tunings seems to indicate multiple basses.

[thodrik]

[quote name='christhammer666' timestamp='1473751236' post='3132694']
the tuning will be B,F#,B,E. I don't mind adjusting saddles and tweaing truss rods I just don want to bugger the nut in case I go back to standard tuning with 45-105s
[/quote]

Nuts are easily replaced (and generally really cheap) so that has never been an issue for me. The set I am using for that tuning is 120 - 90 - 67 - 50. The E string is slightly heavier than normal, but the others are not much bigger than the equivalents in a 105 -45 set. I actually didn't even need to adjust the nut when going back to standard tuning with a 105-45 set on My Fender Precision.

I don't see it as a 'massacre' of a four string bass when I widen the nut to accommodate alternate tunings, I just see it as setting up the bass for my own needs. As said above though, multiple tunings lend themselves to multiple basses. If I just had one bass things would be a bit problematic!

[ivansc]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1473758961' post='3132771']
As a general observation I'd say if anyone can't get around on a 5 string bass then they need to work on their technique.

[/quote]

Not hardly. My excuse is severe arthritis in both hands which limits my playing massively even on a 4 string. Plenty of other reasons for not being able to get around on the average five. How are you on upright bass, for example?

[chris_b]

I would expect that everyone should understand that limitations arising from any medical condition are excluded from the intentions of my comment.

[bassjim]

If its a full on full time band you want to be part of and you see longevity ahead and no doubt about it, then do what you gotta do. Get a 5, a spare bass with BEAD or sort yours out. You probably already know what the other answer is....

I once turned down a band who tuned down half a step for the singers benefit. The band wasn't all that good. There wasn't even a glimmer of hope that I might join.
On the 3 rehearsals leading up to my decision not to join, playing with the strings all floppy and notes bumming out wasn't fun at all. I had no incentive to do anything about it.

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='ivansc' timestamp='1473775085' post='3133014']


Not hardly. My excuse is severe arthritis in both hands which limits my playing massively even on a 4 string. Plenty of other reasons for not being able to get around on the average five. How are you on upright bass, for example?
[/quote]

As someone that had their left hand bolted back on with a titanium plate, plays five strings and upright bass I can tell you that with the correct technique anyone that can play a four string could do five strings, if anything I play with a more open hand on a five string even though I do still grab the neck far to hard, my classic 5 Stingray nut width can't be more more if at all that some P basses either.

I've seen many people swap to five strings BECAUSE of their arthritis to use the playing across the board technique to make it easier on their hands, fingers and arms.

Edited September 13, 2016 by stingrayPete1977

[thodrik]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1473784919' post='3133114']

I've seen many people swap to five strings BECAUSE of their arthritis to use the playing across the board technique to make it easier on their hands, fingers and arms.
[/quote]

I've been told this. In fact one the guys at Guitar Guitar told me a few years ago that he had switched to five strings for this very reason. However he might have just been trying to convince me to buy a five string Sadowsky or Sandberg...

On the double bass front, I have small hands and never had a problem playing double bass or five string. My opinion is that it is all about technique and the longer you play the more your fingers will be able to stretch and cover greater distances. I have also people with much smaller hands than me excel on both the double bass and five string electric bass. I can't comment on any medical conditions like arthritis though, which would obviously be a consideration, though I don't think playing a five stresses my hands any more than playing a four.

[stingrayPete1977]

There's some fantastic petite female double bassists, when in thumb position your thumb doesn't go behind the neck at all unless it's about 3 foot long!

I started on upright because I couldn't bend my wrist to play horizontal, I now play with a electric bass held sort of diagonal and use the three finger technique from the double bass, a dogs breakfast but I'm still gigging!

[thodrik]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1473799040' post='3133281']
There's some fantastic petite female double bassists, when in thumb position your thumb doesn't go behind the neck at all unless it's about 3 foot long!

I started on upright because I couldn't bend my wrist to play horizontal, I now play with a electric bass held sort of diagonal and use the three finger technique from the double bass, a dogs breakfast but I'm still gigging!
[/quote]

That sounds like a nasty injury. Well done on managing to find a solution to keep on playing though. That is pretty much my view in the event that I suffer any serious problems.

Luckily so far my only problems have been goalkeeping related football injuries. I fractured the middle finger on my right hand the week before a grade 6 double bass exam. I tried to play around it with an agricultural 'grip it and rip it' bowing approach. I managed to pass though, mostly because that approach didn't really differ from my normal approach to bowing! Safest thing to do after that was to stop playing football, not so much to keep my fingers safe, more so because I was rubbish at football!

[ahpook]

I don't like downtuning - it makes my bass sound and feel silly

Edited September 13, 2016 by ahpook