Bob Marley vs The Beatles

[darkandrew]

There's little question that both Bob Marley and The Beatles were musical phenomena that rose above music and became something more but who has made the biggest and most enduring impact?

[ras52]

A very well-travelled friend of mine said that the only music he'd heard played wherever he went in the world was Bob Marley's, so he gets my vote.

[KevB]

http://www.debate.org/debates/Bob-Marley-Vs-The-Beatles/1/

[Low End Bee]

I love reggae. Own shedloads of it. I can't stand Bob Marley though.

Beatles on a techincality.

[leftybassman392]

I'd rather not choose between them ta very much.

No offence intended to anyone who feels otherwise, but WTF!?

[Phil Adams]

I never quite got Bob Marley, but I have respect for all those that did. Not for me I'm afraid.

[Grangur]

Not knowing the cultural influence of either/both in all parts of the world I'm ill-equipped to vote on this. If you could narrow this to Europe, or the English-speaking world, then I might stand a chance.

I like both equally, but that means nothin'

[ras52]

There's only one way to find out...

http://youtu.be/o0RFfKFH4JE

[darkandrew]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1474387271' post='3137586']
Not knowing the cultural influence of either/both in all parts of the world I'm ill-equipped to vote on this. If you could narrow this to Europe, or the English-speaking world, then I might stand a chance.

I like both equally, but that means nothin'
[/quote]
Do you think that The Beatles' influence and legacy is limited to white, English speaking cultures any more than Bob Marley's is limited to black, Afro-Caribbean cultures? Maybe Bob Marley's biggest strength was his ability to appeal across racial, cultural and socio-economic divides?

Is anyone here from Africa or Latin America? Did The Beatles ever make it big in these countries?

Edited September 20, 2016 by darkandrew

[Grangur]

[quote name='darkandrew' timestamp='1474387805' post='3137597']
Do you think that The Beatles' influence and legacy is limited to white, English speaking cultures any more than Bob Marley's is limited to black, Afro-Caribbean cultures? Maybe Bob Marley's biggest strength was his ability to appeal across racial, cultural and socio-economic divides?
[/quote]
No, not at all. I'm white, English, but I really like Bob Marley's work. It was probably Marley's work that brought reggae to the UK and I respect his influence. Full respect to him and all those who've followed.

I imagine, also that there are Beatles influences everywhere too.

What I am saying is I don't know how either have influenced Asia, Australia, South America, much of the USA.... the list goes on.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoFzMrpS7nw[/media]

Enjoy!

Edit. Didn't the Rolling Stones do a reggae number or two as well - that will be through Bob Marley's influence.

This is a big question. I don't think anyone can really give a definitive answer.

Edited September 20, 2016 by Grangur

[Happy Jack]

It wouldn't be much of a game.

The Beatles could afford to leave Ringo in goal, play Paul and George on the wings, and put John through the middle.

Bob would never get near the ball.

[discreet]

I got into the Beatles and Bob Marley and the Wailers at roughly the same time in the mid- to late seventies (mainly through the albums [i]Sergeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band[/i] and the crossover [i]Catch A Fire) [/i]and I'd say they had about the same cultural influence on my white, middle-class teenage self, i.e. they blew my little mind. So I'd have to vote for both - or neither.

At the same time there was a reggae sampler album out called [i]The Front Line[/i] that featured various artists - and through this I got into dub reggae, after being exposed to Burning Spear and the album [i]Garvey's Ghost[/i], the dub mix of [i]Marcus Garvey[/i]. And that blew my little mind some more. If you want to know what reggae rhythm is really all about, listen to [i]Garvey's Ghost[/i].

https://youtu.be/vrG0CnxJkuc

Edited September 20, 2016 by discreet

[Cato]

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1474388834' post='3137608']
It wouldn't be much of a game.

The Beatles could afford to leave Ringo in goal, play Paul and George on the wings, and put John through the middle.

Bob would never get near the ball.
[/quote]

What would be the Beatles equivalent to 'Redemption Song'?

They played with politics but, as far as I'm aware they never got anywhere close to the sheer emotional & intellectual power of that song. It's a cracking tune as well.

Surely that's a goal for Marley?

[RhysP]

I Could happily live without either.

[Grangur]

[quote name='Cato' timestamp='1474389307' post='3137615']
What would be the Beatles equivalent to 'Redemption Song'?

They played with politics but, as far as I'm aware they never got anywhere close to the sheer emotional & intellectual power of that song. It's a cracking tune as well.

Surely that's a goal for Marley?
[/quote]
Both bands were active in the same period in history. But at that time didn't the black section of the population, especially in the Americas, have massively greater issues to object to and get seriously passionate about?

As I remember it, back in the 60s /70s it was pretty well unknown to see whites get involved or concerned about "black issues".

I guess the lack of politics in the Beatles music reflects, how much easier it was, at that time to be white than black.

[timhiggins]

Its gotta be Bob reggae's Pele would have run rings round the fab four and with Family man in goal things couldnt get anymore solid ! ..
although i reckon if you had asked the question on a guitar forum
the glorified boy band would have it !

[Woodinblack]

I don't know, and again I don't know what their relative influences around the world are. However, I would probably put money on which one had more impact in parts of Milwaukee

[Roger2611]

I can't vote on this one, both were massively influential in their own genres, I imagine Bob would have listened to or at least heard the Beatles stuff in his younger days but to choose one over the other is something I can't do

Football wise I think Bob would have won, he was a really keen footballer, I don't think the Beatles were?

[blue]

[quote name='Woodinblack' timestamp='1474390774' post='3137636']
I don't know, and again I don't know what their relative influences around the world are. However, I would probably put money on which one had more impact in parts of Milwaukee
[/quote]

I have very close contact with The Wailers. I've known Al (Albert ) Anderson since we were in grade school.


Blue

[ras52]

[quote name='Roger2611' timestamp='1474391525' post='3137643']

Football wise I think Bob would have won, he was a really keen footballer, I don't think the Beatles were?
[/quote]

Probably not, there are no decent teams from where they grew up

Edited September 20, 2016 by ras52

[Beedster]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1474388710' post='3137607']

No, not at all. I'm white, English, but I really like Bob Marley's work. It was probably Marley's work that brought reggae to the UK and I respect his influence. Full respect to him and all those who've followed.

I imagine, also that there are Beatles influences everywhere too.

What I am saying is I don't know how either have influenced Asia, Australia, South America, much of the USA.... the list goes on.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoFzMrpS7nw[/media]

Enjoy!

Edit. Didn't the Rolling Stones do a reggae number or two as well - that will be through Bob Marley's influence.

This is a big question. I don't think anyone can really give a definitive answer.
[/quote]

Stones did some almost reggae with the likes of Peter Tosh and IIRC Sly and Robbie. I like it, probably not for the purists however

[JoeEvans]

Not a great fan of either, myself. Obviously I can see that they are both hugely influential, change the face of music etc etc but I wouldn't actually choose to listen to either, ever.

[taunton-hobbit]

Back in the day, Bob was widely regarded as 'white man reggae'
Beatles were the alternative to the Stones.

end of......

[lowdown]

Both have a very big place in history.

Reggae was pretty strong in clubs in this country before Bob Marley came along.
Trojan records were trotting out Records in a big way, although it was all very commercial.
Was it real hardcore ? Not really. But it certainly introduced folks to Reggae.

[drTStingray]

[quote name='lowdown' timestamp='1474399867' post='3137762']
Reggae was pretty strong in clubs in this country before Bob Marley came along.
Trojan records were trotting out Records in a big way, although it was all very commercial.
Was it real hardcore ? Not really. But it certainly introduced folks to Reggae.
[/quote]

Back in the 60s reggae (and other versions of it) was big in the Caribbean. The likes of Trojan introduced it here. So in the late 60s the albums under the arm of skinheads and townies were Motown Chartbusters volume 3, Tighten Up Volume 3 etc etc. So groups of white people dug this music.

I also recall watching an interview with Chris of Island records who was instrumental in bringing some reggae to the UK - their biggest worry was the bass being too loud and prominent for western tastes........... now there's a thing 🤔

I had the pleasure of working with a black Jamaican group in the 70s and I can tell you their influences were all reggae and soul (the guitarist was also a Hendrix/Isleys fan). I don't recall them being that into Marley to be honest - though I do remember many white people liking him/them if you include the Wailers. Maybe they introduced an audience to reggae though many white people only know the famous stuff - White musicians often play Marley unauthenticly - missing the point in my mind.

The Beatles were a teen sensation from 63 onwards (I was about 9 back then) and I mean a sensation - Beatles Bubble gum picture cards were legal tender in the playground and unlike crazes which followed (Bay City Rollers etc) managed to mature musically as their audience did and thus continued to be a phenomena and central to UK if not world culture for a number of years and remain a national treasure.

So I've voted Beatles - not least because soulster Billy Preston played with them and I know my70s black band mates knew all the famous songs.

Stones were a different animal completely - not a teen craze IMHO (though not to say some 60s teen ladies weren't affected). They were a harder R and B based outfit than the Beatles and to me as a kid were not involved in teen/kids merchandise, more the occasional sultry and rather strange totp performances were about all the exposure there'd be (Radio 1 didn't start till 1967 remember). I started to dig them as I got older but some of the other bands like Fleetwood Mac sounded like better musicians to me (sorry Keef and Co - I love the groove though) - standard of musicianship was always important for non classical/jazz musicians back then - the establishment poo poo'd pop and rock or anything else as mindless nonsense played by idiots (or mimed because sessions musicians were the real deal) - even as long ago as the first Shadows album, there was a track (Nivram) setting out to prove they could all play - and in a very twee late 50s way this is explained on the sleeve notes!!!

Marley arrived to most in the mid 70s (during a period dominated by albums from Wings, Lennon, Genesis, Allman Brothers, Eagles etc). The Jamaican community in say, Handsworth (Birmigham) where I grew up, or Notting Hill started in the 50s and was large by the 60s. Look to bands like Inner Circle, Steel Pulse for young UK Caribbean based reggae of the mid/late 70s.

Reggae was well and truly here before Marley. The Beatles changed everything.

Sorry for the long post but I was a bit pissed off by the Beatles v xyz threads and their contents - just remember amongst other things John Lennon's off the cuff utterance which was televised caused burning of Beatles paraphernalia in the US in the mid 60s, such was their power of communication and the affront felt by evangelists - of course John was right they did have a bigger worldwide audience.......

Edited September 20, 2016 by drTStingray