Happy being average

[DBerriff]

I have worked with some musicians who are brilliant but obsessive too. I have a balanced life that I am am pretty content with, and would not want to be like them, much as I admire and respect them.

Most people in the population could not tune, let alone play a bass. That makes all of us way above average.

[Painy]

I think the standard of playing amongst bands on my local pub scene - particularly among younger bands - has gone up a fair bit over the last 10-15 years.
If you'd asked me 10 years ago I'd have said my playing was probably a bit better than most of the other players who were about in my area at the time (certainly not all of them though. Some of them - Dood springs to mind for one - would have wiped the floor with me )

These days I still feel like I can hold my own pretty well and I've yet to come across a song I've wanted to play that I couldn't get down with a bit of practice, but the bar is definitely getting raised amongst the 'competition'.

Edited September 27, 2016 by Painy

[Woodinblack]

Its very hard to judge how good you are. There is some rule, that I have forgotten, which is why really skilled people are constantly doubting their abilities, whereas people with no real skill want to go on the XFactor sort of programs. The better you get at a thing, the more you realise what you are doing wrong. If you are not very good at all, you don't really notice it anywhere near as much as you don't see the detail.

I vary between moments of surprising myself that I can do something I didn't think I could, and moments of wanting to give up because I am useless.

I see many people in pub bands and think 'oh put some effort in', and others that seem way better than me. so I guess if I average that out, I must also be average!

[lowland]

@ Woodinblack: I think you're referring to the Dunning-Kruger effect, '[color=#252525][font=sans-serif]a [/font][/color][url="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_bias"]cognitive bias[/url][color=#252525][font=sans-serif] in which low-ability individuals suffer from [/font][/color][url="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority"]illusory superiority[/url][color=#252525][font=sans-serif], mistakenly assessing their ability as much higher than it really is', and a corollary, where '[/font][/color][color=#252525][font=sans-serif]high-ability individuals may underestimate their relative competence and may erroneously assume that tasks which are easy for them are also easy for others'.[/font][/color]

[url="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect"]https://en.wikipedia...93Kruger_effect[/url]

I regularly see both types in my little corner of the music biz, audio mastering, an area where many would agree that there's no substitute for just doing the job. Ten years is regularly quoted as a typical time to get to a decent level of competency, and yet in mastering forums you'll often come across people who started the equivalent of last week and think experience is seriously overrated; or alternatively someone with a long and stellar track record questioning their own working methods and approach.

I like the Bertrand Russell quote in the Wikipedia article: '[color=#252525][font=sans-serif]One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision'.[/font][/color]

Tune in to the forthcoming series of The Apprentice to see illusory superiority at its finest!

Edited September 28, 2016 by lowland

[Nicko]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1474988389' post='3142081']
You need drive and you need focus. Then you need innate talent which some have more than others.
None of this matters much if you are already where you want to be.

If you are writing about it, I'd be thinking you aren't happy....?
[/quote]

I think I am. I've been thinking a lot about this recently due to the olympics, where the athletes are not only physically gifted and specifically talented but are willing to give up everything else in search of being as good as they can possibly be. I lack the need or the drive to get better and enjoy doing what I do as the level I'm at.

[6feet7]

[quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1475052869' post='3142564']
I think I am. I've been thinking a lot about this recently due to the olympics, where the athletes are not only physically gifted and specifically talented but are willing to give up everything else in search of being as good as they can possibly be. I lack the need or the drive to get better and enjoy doing what I do as the level I'm at.
[/quote]

This

[uk_lefty]

I'm probably below average. Can't read music, can't play more than one Beatles song, but I am happy playing what my band needs in the way that I feel fits best. I'm not a great bass player but I'm the right one for my band. I would like to be better but I can't spend hours practicing unfortunately.

Its funny though because I don't see it as competition. If I was a golf player I'd want to be "the best" but as a bass player I just want to be appreciated. Take Flea for example, to some people he's untouchable and the best and greatest bassist ever, others don't rate him. Leads me to think that in the arts there's no such thing as "best" overall

[discreet]

When you play the right note, in the right place, at the right time, you're as good as anyone on the planet.

[phil.c60]

I was [u]really[/u] good for about 10 seconds at last Saturdays gig then........

[blue]

I have to work hard just to stay average. But yeah, I'm happy with it.

I have work, and I'm more concerned about that aspect of this bass guitar player stuff.

Blue

Edited September 29, 2016 by blue

[lojo]

For most things we do , especially if it's not connected to our survival , the questions simply is do you enjoy it ?

I enjoying playing bass and football , But Dont need a spectator to tell me how great my playing was for either to matter, don't get me wrong compliments are nice , but if you need them your never going to get enough.

As others have said if you play each song as its meant to be , no one can better it

Edited September 29, 2016 by lojo

[blue]

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1474977704' post='3141963']
It took me 30 years to attempt to play with fingers rather than a pick.
[/quote]

It took me 30 years to attempt to play with a pick rather than fingers.

Blue

[DaytonaRik]

When I reach average then I'll let you know!

[Barking Spiders]

Well I can't and don't wanna play improvised solos. A while back I set myself a target of being able to play 100 fave bass lines off pat which I now can do including a fair few Stevie Wonder, Level 42, Jacko and Japan tunes, several JJ Motown classics and bass classics like Too Shy and Rhythm Stick. Could I jam along to unfamiliar Vic Wootten, Billy Sheehan or Stanley Clarke numbers? Not very well! Do I wanna improve? You bet. Next target up, Stu Hamm's 'Country Music'. A big ask but you've go to aim high even if you don't get there.

Edited September 29, 2016 by Barking Spiders

[mikel]

If you enjoy playing bass, at whatever level, then its all good. Gigging or even just playing with other musicians still gives me a huge buzz even after 50 years of playing music. Its the sound of the complete band that counts and the music that matters. I love every gig I do and I fit with the drummer and the rest of the band. We make decent music and audiences like us and dance there feet off.

I have a friend who is a very good bassist, light years better than me, but he is constantly beating himself up with regard to his playing, practice regime, how many hours a day he has for practice, quality of equipment etc, he never seems happy with anything he does in music. So who has got it made, me or him?

[MisterT]

Some of us have yet to venture out and play in front of an audience, so to me, no matter my skill or yours, you're out in front and where I want to be. And I will. /bucketlist

[PaulWarning]

I'm generally happy with my standard, I can play the stuff I want too, sometimes I have to cheat (try playing Babylons Burning using all downstrokes with a pick!) but hey, I can probably play stuff that other people can't, but there's the rub you only doubt yourself when you can't play something when you can you tend to assume everybody can

Edited September 29, 2016 by PaulWarning

[Earbrass]

[quote name='mikel' timestamp='1475139282' post='3143291']. I have a friend who is a very good bassist, light years better than me, but he is constantly beating himself up with regard to his playing, practice regime, how many hours a day he has for practice, quality of equipment etc, he never seems happy with anything he does in music. So who has got it made, me or him? [/quote]

People who are very good at stuff are seldom happy with their performance - that's why they are so good, they are constantly driven to improve.

[chris_b]

[quote name='Earbrass' timestamp='1475145968' post='3143385']
People who are very good at stuff are seldom happy with their performance - that's why they are so good, they are constantly driven to improve.
[/quote]
+1

I always used to think, I can do that better.

Now I'm older I think that should have been better, but that's as good as it's going to get.

[ambient]

What do you class as being average though ?

[krismpos]

Even I've been playing bass for 14 years, it's only during the last four that I decided to actually learn how to play the instrument. I am now at a level that I can fill the sonic void of a trio and get nice comments by bandmates and punters occasionally. I consider myself average at best.
Am I pleased with my improvement? Certainly. Happy with my level? No. I accept my limitations but I (want to) believe that I haven't reached them.

Edited September 29, 2016 by krismpos

[RhysP]

[quote name='ambient' timestamp='1475149208' post='3143423']
What do you class as being average though ?
[/quote]

Not being sh*t but not being sh*t hot.

[ras52]

[quote name='walbassist' timestamp='1474974168' post='3141905']
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyihQtBes1I[/media]
[/quote]

I've still to be convinced that the second line isn't "Put on a porn show".

[mikel]

[quote name='Earbrass' timestamp='1475145968' post='3143385']
People who are very good at stuff are seldom happy with their performance - that's why they are so good, they are constantly driven to improve.
[/quote]

My point was that no matter how good he is, or may become, he is not enjoying it, so what is the point? I play cos I love and enjoy the whole experience, and I am a firm believer in the old saying "Its not what you play but how you play it"

Also, on 99.9% of gigs, I could play what he is required to play so I dont see the point of learning to play at 300mph, or play like Jaco Pastorius when I will never need to in a gig situation. If you are happy with what you have then you have everything you need.

[kusee pee]

I regard myself as average although I quite often get compliments saying that I'm good. However, compared to many I know I'm definitely nothing special. I'd certainly like to get better and always like challenging myself with new stuff. The others in my band are all better musically than I am which is a good incentive to try and keep up.