Sight reading

[paul_c2]

Any tips? I know its a broad subject!!!

Also of interest.........how many bassists can confidently read music? If not reading normal (western standard notation) score, what are you doing/reading/writing to communicate how to play things etc? And of those who can read, is it a bit ropey and needs a bit of working out, or confidently? Obviously everyone can play better once they practice a piece and go through it a number of times, but accepting that sight reading is about 2 steps lower than the highest ability one can play at, is it confident?

I am finding I'm having music put in front of me now which is harder than I've ever played before, and definitely needs an amount of "working out" to play it properly, although you can have a stab at it running through first time etc. In an ideal non-stressful non-live situation, I could spend a little time and go "oh yeah, that's a run down the G harmonic minor scale, I shall start here and end here" or "looks like Db with all them flats, 5th position shall serve me well" or something like that (I am not 100% sure how the 'positions' are numbered anyway!!!!)

[ras52]

My top tip would be to first scan though the whole piece and look for any tricky rhythms or intervals, and work out how to get those under your hands before they pop up to bite you in real time!

[ambient]

Take time to read through it first. Don't be afraid to pencil in notes and circle things. Pencil in specs and exclamation marks, anything basically as an aid beforehand.

[paul_c2]

Great, thanks for the tips. I guess its down to

1) Recognising the accidentals quickly enough to see if its just a passing note, or a modulation into another key which could help out with reading it
2) a SOLID knowledge of scales, ie knowing all the positions and all the patterns so you know without thinking too hard, where to place your hand and what notes fall under what fingers, quickly.

For example here:

[attachment=229816:star wars music extract.jpg]

bar 76 is G harmonic minor and bars 126-128 is Bb natural minor, but best done at the 8th fret and shift for the final Bb onto 6th fret E string (or a bit earlier if you want to). The rest is pretty easy.

[ambient]

[quote name='paul_c2' timestamp='1476359632' post='3153602']
Great, thanks for the tips. I guess its down to

1) Recognising the accidentals quickly enough to see if its just a passing note, or a modulation into another key which could help out with reading it
2) a SOLID knowledge of scales, ie knowing all the positions and all the patterns so you know without thinking too hard, where to place your hand and what notes fall under what fingers, quickly.

For example here:

[attachment=229816:star wars music extract.jpg]

bar 76 is G harmonic minor and bars 126-128 is Bb natural minor, but best done at the 8th fret and shift for the final Bb onto 6th fret E string (or a bit earlier if you want to). The rest is pretty easy.
[/quote]

If there's a key change you'll have a double bar line, then the new key sig.

[paul_c2]

[quote name='ambient' timestamp='1476390276' post='3153969']
If there's a key change you'll have a double bar line, then the new key sig.
[/quote]

Look at the example provided, it goes into G harmonic minor, then later Bb minor. Yes there is no key signature change so its not a notated "key change", instead its written with no key signature (when its clearly not in C major/A minor) and uses accidentals to show the modulation. This is normal, if that modulation/chord/whatever only lasts a few bars - as chords do in this kind of music. It deliberately uses non-diatonic and sometimes distantly-related changes for dramatic effect.

[ambient]

[quote name='paul_c2' timestamp='1476396879' post='3154047']
Look at the example provided, it goes into G harmonic minor, then later Bb minor. Yes there is no key signature change so its not a notated "key change", instead its written with no key signature (when its clearly not in C major/A minor) and uses accidentals to show the modulation. This is normal, if that modulation/chord/whatever only lasts a few bars - as chords do in this kind of music. It deliberately uses non-diatonic and sometimes distantly-related changes for dramatic effect.
[/quote]

Harmonic minor doesn't have a key sig, so you'd only get accidentals. Yes, you're right about short, maybe 1 or 2 bar sections. What I'm saying is if there's a key change, then you'd get, or expect to get a double bar line followed by the new key sig.

If I was given that to read, then I'd put exclamation marks around bits like that, to show them. Do whatever to not miss them when they came up. I remember my tutor at uni saying "don't be afraid to pencil in".

[deepbass5]

I play in two big bands now and would advise you to read regular, as it will come easier but sounds as though you may be. My main problem was knowing the bast place to start the piece - where to put my left hand. I had lessons and took along the most troublesome numbers. This was because i tended to leap about the neck and make mistakes always returning below the fifth fret for comfort. Then i realised if i position my hand as if to play the scale of the key i was in most of the notes were falling under my fingers, sounds obvious but it wasn't at the time. so Db start with index finger on Db was the best bet. I play five strings, so no real excuse it has made me play and grow more confident in the middle of the neck.

[paul_5]

My advice would be to practise reading as often as you can. Certain rhythms and note groupings crop up quite regularly, so once you learn to spot them, then it's all stuff that you've played before, so there aren't really any surprises.

If it's a 'sight reading' gig, then I'd echo what's been said on here already; take a couple of minutes to read through the score to see if there are any complicated rhythms or fast runs that need a bit of prep and play them through in your head (visualise where your hands will be on the fingerboard) to mentally prepare yourself for playing them.

Other than that, just relax and have fun with it.

[JapanAxe]

In the OP's example, the semiquaver runs stand out. I would play through those slowly at first and work out my fingering. If I realised that they were a particular scale (as here) I would 'pencil' that on the piece, whether in reality or in software.

[neilp]

Practice, practice and practice some more! I find - 30+ years of sightreading behind me, to be fair! - that I focus mainly on rhythm, the notes are the easy bit, particularly on BG. Tap out - in your head if necessary - anything that's not obvious, and make sure you know what you're counting - if you have a conductor, is he/she beating that 4/4 section in 4, or 2 or maybe even 1? The notes themselves can usually be read as you go, the key is practice and more practice!

[paul_c2]

[quote name='deepbass5' timestamp='1476399246' post='3154063']
I play in two big bands now and would advise you to read regular, as it will come easier but sounds as though you may be. My main problem was knowing the bast place to start the piece - where to put my left hand. I had lessons and took along the most troublesome numbers. This was because i tended to leap about the neck and make mistakes always returning below the fifth fret for comfort. Then i realised if i position my hand as if to play the scale of the key i was in most of the notes were falling under my fingers, sounds obvious but it wasn't at the time. so Db start with index finger on Db was the best bet. I play five strings, so no real excuse it has made me play and grow more confident in the middle of the neck.
[/quote]

I know exactly how you feel, regarding left hand position. One becomes very familiar with putting the hand around frets 1-5 and its echoed in a lot of the music which will have low G, Ab etc which needs that position (on a 4 string) anyway. So, D (above middle C) on the page is a bit of an occasion, and anything higher is "interesting"!!

I've sight read - a lot - but a long time ago, its getting back into it which is really providing my brain with a good workout, but its stil enjoyable. And its other aspects such as keeping in time with a conductor especially when the music passage might be a slow or slowly moving one with no well defined beat (no drummer/percussion there), keeping count of many bars of rest or repetitive sections, doing all the repeats right, DC al Coda, DS al Coda, etc etc. Also, I've been used to playing in (effectively) 4/4 at a fairly restricted range of tempos, so different ones like 3/4, 2/4 and very slow (or fast) stuff is new to me too.

Regarding scales, I've never really sat down and practiced them on the bass. There's only really been one scale (well, two if you start on the E string or A string) but recently taking up electric guitar has broadened my knowledge of the scales and there's actually (at least) 5 patterns, which can all transfer/be adapted to the bass. And while I've probably been inadvertently playing some of the other patterns anyway, now I'm learning more about them I can fit it all together to make things easier for myself.

A couple of the pieces demand low D, a quick flick through shows that low C is sometimes demanded too. The double bass player that sat next to me on Saturday doesn't have an extension so can't do these notes; I am thinking I can do at least one of them with a detune (to DADG) then retune to EADG in a rest (with a decent tuner). But maybe buying a 5 string bass would make a lot of sense, especially if it has other advantages like being able to play some complex runs without needing to shift positions. However I'm still kinda in the mindset that a 4 string can/should be able to do it. And of course....it would mean spending more money on yet another instrument etc!!!

Edited October 14, 2016 by paul_c2

[ambient]

Playing a 5 or in my case a 6 string does make reading a whole lot easier. I tend to do most of my playing from the 5th fret upwards. So low F I'd play at the 6th fret on the B etc. It's easy then to play Ds and Es on the G string, they right below you.

[scalpy]

[quote name='paul_5' timestamp='1476429589' post='3154141']
My advice would be to practise reading as often as you can. Certain rhythms and note groupings crop up quite regularly, so once you learn to spot them, then it's all stuff that you've played before, so there aren't really any surprises.

If it's a 'sight reading' gig, then I'd echo what's been said on here already; take a couple of minutes to read through the score to see if there are any complicated rhythms or fast runs that need a bit of prep and play them through in your head (visualise where your hands will be on the fingerboard) to mentally prepare yourself for playing them.

Other than that, just relax and have fun with it.
[/quote]

This is a great tip. Have a rhythmic vocabulary as well as a harmonic vocabulary. I was taught at uni its better to play a wrong note in time than a right one out of time! Which has got me out of a pickle on many an occasion.

[paul_c2]

I tried again today and we had a new piece - as in, new for the entire orchestra. It was in Eb with plenty of "dusty end" stuff (high Eb, F etc (ok not quite the really high stuff)) so it made sense to tackle most of the passages in a much higher position than the "normal" frets 1-5 or so. It worked out really well.

[Mcgiver69]

A good idea would be to start by learning Takadimi which is a form of Indian rhythmic method, one of the pros is that it teaches you how to read block of notes rhythmically and not note by note. This accelerates the learning curve.

Here are some quick examples to try:

[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SW133P2ZgxQ[/media]

[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fdfwcx0vmGU[/media]

Edited November 4, 2016 by Mcgiver69