blue Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 [quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1477550205' post='3162865'] Just like the Wirebirds guitarist, another Al, he fixes trucks etc as a day job. Fingers like fat sausages, but man can he get some sweet blues out of his guitar. [/quote] That's cool. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 (edited) Back in the 1970's The Who used backing tapes when they performed songs such as Baba O'Riley and Won't Get Fooled Again. The tapes had a tendency to stretch in hot environments and Moon (obviously) played without a click track. Disaster was never far away. One night the tapes failed on several occasions and the glowering Townshend completely lost it, launching a savage assault on luckless tape operator and long-time Who roadie Bob Pridden. With this in mind I tend to give backing tracks the swerve, though I'm sure they're very handy for other people and good luck to anyone who uses them Edited October 28, 2016 by skankdelvar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted October 30, 2016 Author Share Posted October 30, 2016 Quick update, for anybody who's interested. The drummer sent me three rehearsal recordings of singer + acoustic guitarist. The singer was sounding good - hitting the notes, and hitting the timings pretty accurately. Songs were: A night like this and Back it up by Caro Emerald, and Winehouse's Back to black. I'd not heard of Caro Emerald, so looked up the songs on Youtube. Basically "swing", but over catchy grooves - almost a reggae feel at times!? The more I listened, the more interested I became. I emailed the drummer and said that I'd like to pop over to rehearsal for a play-along. I also asked him about backing tracks. He replied that the guitarist hadn't finally decided on them yet, and would wait to hear how things sounded with a drummer and bassist - very much a start-up project. So, I'm hoping to meet up with them all shortly for an initial play-through of a few songs. It may be that, with a drummer and a bassist, the guitarist decides the sound is "beefed up" enough without backing tracks. I hope so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahpook Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 (edited) [quote name='solo4652' timestamp='1477819708' post='3164554'] Quick update, for anybody who's interested..... [/quote] That sounds encouraging, it sounds like you're quite into it. Much power to your elbow for the first get together - I hope it goes well Edited October 30, 2016 by ahpook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 I'd certainly at least give it a try, it's sounds ok so far to me, nowt wrong with a bit of Caro Emerald either. It's all networking too, bands evolve so the backing tracks might get dropped or the guitarist in charge of them might leave and be replaced by one happy to fill the sound out on their own or even bring in another guitarist. On top of that this band might be crap or never get started yet at the same time the drummer might be in another awesome band requiring a new bassist or similar situation. Good luck and even if you go with tracks I'd say gigging with tracks is better than being a bedroom critic with no band because they all use music stands,wrong colour xlr leads,won't let you use both of the Ampegs you use in the box room etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted October 30, 2016 Author Share Posted October 30, 2016 Yes - thank you. I wouldn't normally give "swing" a second listen, but Caro Emerald's band puts a nice groove behind her vocals. Also, if you watch the YouTube videos of them playing live, you'll see some two-deck, errr "mixing" (? don't ask me what it's officially called - I dunno). I wonder whether that's what was in the guitarist's mind when he referred to backing tracks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted October 30, 2016 Author Share Posted October 30, 2016 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1477821631' post='3164573'] I'd certainly at least give it a try, it's sounds ok so far to me, nowt wrong with a bit of Caro Emerald either. It's all networking too, bands evolve so the backing tracks might get dropped or the guitarist in charge of them might leave and be replaced by one happy to fill the sound out on their own or even bring in another guitarist. On top of that this band might be crap or never get started yet at the same time the drummer might be in another awesome band requiring a new bassist or similar situation. Good luck and even if you go with tracks I'd say gigging with tracks is better than being a bedroom critic with no band because they all use music stands,wrong colour xlr leads,won't let you use both of the Ampegs you use in the box room etc [/quote] [i]Very[/i] sound advice, right there. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 Do you partake in the old upright bass? Nice new venture to add into the mix if you don't currently! Caro is very 'watchable' on YouTube lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted October 30, 2016 Author Share Posted October 30, 2016 No, I've never played upright bass. Given the weakness in my fretting hand, I doubt I ever will. A short-scale P bass with half-round strings and the tone rolled off will be getting close to that sound, won't it? Obviously not going to look like an upright though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivansc Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1477505312' post='3162685'] Agreed, Dave we recently added "The Weight" [/quote] I programmed the full brass intro fron the live version of The Weight and used to do it when I was working with just me on guitar vocals and a drummer. The crowd generally liked it, but we did have to run about a bit onstage to make it look like there was more than 2 of us! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted November 2, 2016 Author Share Posted November 2, 2016 (edited) Another quick update. I've just received the following songlist so I can practise before meeting the band some time next week. A varied setlist... Caro Emerald songs: Back it up, A night like this, That man, Riviera life. Beautiful South songs: A little time, You keep it all in. Songbird Back to black Torn Temptation - Heaven 17 Edited November 2, 2016 by solo4652 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike257 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Plenty of keys/brass in amongst all that, I'd very much expect that the backing tracks are intended to cover those bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted November 19, 2016 Author Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) Finally got to play with these guys today. The drummer sent me some videos of guitarist and singer rehearsing some songs, plus a list of songs and keys. All good, apart from guitarist was playing one song in Cm on the video, but saying it was Bm on the songlist. I queried this, he replied that they did it "as per the video, in Bm". I rechecked the video and, trusting with my ears, convinced myself he was playing Cm. Having never met these guys, and fearing I'd be labelled a pedant, I carefully, politely, asked the guitarist to re-check the song key. Email thread, all before we'd met today: Guitar: "Oh yes - sorry - I am playing it in Cm on the video, but after that we changed it to Bm." Me; "Ahh, right. So shall I practise it in Bm, then?" Guitar: "Yes, please" Me: "OK - no problem. I'll tell you what, I'll practise it in Cm and Bm, then I'm covered both ways" Guitar; "Fine. See you Saturday" Got there for the first meeting/audition. A few songs in , we got to the song in question. Guitar; "Right. Let's do [the song]. We'll do it in C#m" Me: "Pardon?" Edited November 19, 2016 by solo4652 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted November 19, 2016 Author Share Posted November 19, 2016 Stop press: I've just received this email from guitarist: "We would like very much for you to join us on this new project if we haven't traumatised you too much with the key changes!" I've said yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted November 19, 2016 Share Posted November 19, 2016 Excellent news Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted December 18, 2016 Author Share Posted December 18, 2016 (edited) Five rehearsals in, and it's going well. However...guitarist wants to do an acoustic version of Wish you were here. At the start, he wants to use a looper to record the 12-string picky guitar bit so he can then play Gilmour's resonator/bluesy bit over the top. Looper gets turned off before the verse, and myself and drummer come in towards the end of the first verse, as per the original song. I've thought about this, and I've said that I'm not happy with a looper being used, for three reasons; In this song, I can play some of the 12-string guitar part on the bass - enough for the guitarist to do the bluesy stuff over the top. In other words, I think we can do the song justice without a looper. My choice would be to keep things simple and not risk timing and technology cockups from using a looper. My personal opinion is that a live band means exactly that - what the audience is listening to is what's being played in real time by the musicians in front of them. What do you think, folks? Make a stand, or go with the guitarist's flow? Edited December 18, 2016 by solo4652 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanAxe Posted December 18, 2016 Share Posted December 18, 2016 [quote name='solo4652' timestamp='1482080319' post='3197456'] In this song, I can play some of the 12-string guitar part on the bass ... [/quote] Huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahpook Posted December 18, 2016 Share Posted December 18, 2016 [quote name='solo4652' timestamp='1482080319' post='3197456'] What do you think, folks? Make a stand, or go with the guitarist's flow? [/quote] I'd say it's unfair to dismiss the idea out of hand...I'd let the guitarist try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted December 18, 2016 Share Posted December 18, 2016 Suggest that the guitarist plays the acoustic guitar bit while you do the first solo. It sounds suprisingly nice played on the bridge pickup of a bass (It used to be my party piece for the easily impressed). You'll be an octave down on the original but you could always use a pitch shifting effect. I doubt he'll take you up on it but it might make him think twice about doing everything himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 18, 2016 Share Posted December 18, 2016 It takes skill to get the loop track right, as a punter I wouldn't take issue with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted December 18, 2016 Share Posted December 18, 2016 (edited) The other way to approach the opening guitar part on bass is to bung in a few harmonics. Nothing fancy just tap the 12th fret of the g with your right hand just after you fret the first e on the string. Same sort of thing on the fretted g on the 15 fret of the e. 12th fret of the a just after you play the last open a of the sequence. Sounds lovely. Hope that makes sense. Edited December 18, 2016 by Cato Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike257 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 [quote name='solo4652' timestamp='1482080319' post='3197456'] My choice would be to keep things simple and not risk timing and technology cockups from using a looper. My personal opinion is that a live band means exactly that - what the audience is listening to is what's being played in real time by the musicians in front of them. What do you think, folks? Make a stand, or go with the guitarist's flow? [/quote] If I've learned anything from the years of rehearsal room debates, it's that once you finish discussing things like this, you realise you still haven't agreed on anything, you've missed last orders at the bar, and the whole episode has taken at least five times as long as it would have done to just give both ways a try and see what worked best! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mingsta Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 We learned True by Spandau Ballet for a first dance in June and did our first bit of canned music. For the sax solo our drummer kicked in a drum pattern on his edrums, played the sax solo live, then switched back to drums. Our singer wasnt keen at first, but the alternatives were too complicated and we felt it was a part of the song that we couldn't cut out. Apart from that, we don't use backing tracks, but I don't have a problem with it at all. I saw a 4 piece band play at Sandown racecourse in April. They played a lot of current chart stuff and filled out a few bits with some synth pad etc. It didn't take anything away from the band imo. I'd draw the line at anything that would be in the foreground of the music, but a bit of subtle synth/keys type filler is something we'd consider doing. Our guitarist can cover a lot of ground but as a four piece, there's a lot of songs that we would love to do but can't as they'd be missing a key part. I'd love to have a keyboard player to give us more options but I think we'd need to step up in terms of number of well paid gigs to justify it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted January 7, 2017 Author Share Posted January 7, 2017 Folks - can you please help me to think this through, because I'm not sure how to approach the situation. Guitarist turns up to rehearsal with his acoustic guitar and played it through a 200W Fender Rumble bass amp. He normally plays through a Crate power amp into the desk, and that has been fine. Today, it was a bit of a sonic mess. I thought he was too loud and I suggested he could turn down so we could hear the vocals better. Also, I was finding it hard to play bass, possibly because he was playing through a bass amp. On one song, I asked him to noy play through the bass amp, but to revert to his Crate + PA. Result was a much clearer, cleaner, quieter sound mix, with my bass being much more present in the mix. I suggested the guitarist should stay with his Crate + PA setup and leave the bass frequencies to me. "That's why I'm here", I said, perhaps a little tetchily. Guitarist scowled and stuck his bottom lip out. It's his band, and he likes to play his well-rehearsed songs in his own way. He finds it hard to change what he does to accommodate the newly-recruited rhythm section of myself and drummer. There is a good band here, and I'd like to continue with them. However, I am finding it hard to fit my playing around the guitarist all the time. I've said a few things to him, but the same issues crop up again and again. He's band leader. Any thoughts, folks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahpook Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 [quote name='solo4652' timestamp='1483808281' post='3210300'] Any thoughts, folks? [/quote] Why is the guitarist playing an acoustic through a bass amp ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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