EBMM Stingray 2eq question

[sirmuppet]

Hi all.

Just got myself a 2009 Ernie Ball Musicman 4 string Stingray. It has the 2 band EQ. I'd only ever played the 3 band EQ previously and was surprised to find the the 2 band EQ is a treble and bass boost and doesn't have the cut function.

Any way my question is this, The basses preamp doesn't function like I believe it should (Boosting the treble and bass). The treble control does nothing until it's on about full, the bass one seems to go full on just after you start to turn it. I spoke to the seller who said it was original and that the bass one is actually an active passive mode even though it's a knob without any indent and the other knob is just a boost. Have EBMM ever come with this stock? I can't find anything to say this is so but it's what I'm being told by the seller.

Thanks for any help.

[drTStingray]

[quote name='sirmuppet' timestamp='1478043198' post='3166387']
Hi all.

Just got myself a 2009 Ernie Ball Musicman 4 string Stingray. It has the 2 band EQ. I'd only ever played the 3 band EQ previously and was surprised to find the the 2 band EQ is a treble and bass boost and doesn't have the cut function.

Any way my question is this, The basses preamp doesn't function like I believe it should (Boosting the treble and bass). The treble control does nothing until it's on about full, the bass one seems to go full on just after you start to turn it. I spoke to the seller who said it was original and that the bass one is actually an active passive mode even though it's a knob without any indent and the other knob is just a boost. Have EBMM ever come with this stock? I can't find anything to say this is so but it's what I'm being told by the seller.

Thanks for any help.
[/quote]

The 2 band Musicman EQ doesn't have centre detents and is cut and boost - however the neutral position is not at the centre of the rotation of the controls.

Dependent on the amp you're using, the bass boost may sound more powerful than the treble - however you should hear a more progressive change rather than an all of nothing. It may be worth checking/changing the battery if you've recently bought the bass.

The only version of the 2 band pre amp with active/passive function appeared on the gilded white PDN Stingray and also on some Guitar Centre basses (standard 2 band Stingrays) produced around the same time. One of the controls on those basses has a push/pull function to change from active to passive, becoming a passive tone control.

Edited November 2, 2016 by drTStingray

[stingrayPete1977]

It should be very noticeable from full to minimum on both bass and treble pots with a nice gradual adjustment.

[sirmuppet]

[quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1478048768' post='3166417']
The 2 band Musicman EQ doesn't have centre detents and is cut and boost - however the neutral position is not at the centre of the rotation of the controls.

Dependent on the amp you're using, the bass boost may sound more powerful than the treble - however you should hear a more progressive change rather than an all of nothing. It may be worth checking/changing the battery if you've recently bought the bass.

The only version of the 2 band pre amp with active/passive function appeared on the gilded white PDN Stingray and also on some Guitar Centre basses (standard 2 band Stingrays) produced around the same time. One of the controls on those basses has a push/pull function to change from active to passive, becoming a passive tone control.
[/quote]

The bass is in the car to take down to the guitar shop to get checked out. I'll run down in a moment and check if any of the pot are push/pull. The shop will have batteries so I'll get them to check for me. I'm not normally one for active basses so didn't think of that one, lol.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1478081915' post='3166547']
It should be very noticeable from full to minimum on both bass and treble pots with a nice gradual adjustment.
[/quote]

Thanks for confirming. It's almost an instant change with no gradual adjustment/change.

[sirmuppet]

Just checked and there's no push/pull knobs on it.

This might be a daft question but I'll ask anyway. Would a Musicman 2eq work without a battery? This guy is saying the knob makes it active passive. So if this is correct and the musicman doesn't work without a battery then if I take it out it should work in passive mode but not in active, correct? Hope that makes sense, I'm just rattling it off from my thoughts, lol.

[dannybuoy]

I don't think it would have active/passive in stock form, and I've never heard of active/passive switching achieved by turning a pot that wasn't a push/pull or rotary switch.

Either way, it would only pass signal without a battery if it was passive, or if it was active with intelligent switching to fallback to passive in the event of a battery failure.

Sounds like this guy butchered your electronics without knowing what he was doing!

[sirmuppet]

[quote name='dannybuoy' timestamp='1478084984' post='3166579']
I don't think it would have active/passive in stock form, and I've never heard of active/passive switching achieved by turning a pot that wasn't a push/pull or rotary switch.

Either way, it would only pass signal without a battery if it was passive, or if it was active with intelligent switching to fallback to passive in the event of a battery failure.

Sounds like this guy butchered your electronics without knowing what he was doing!
[/quote]

Thanks man. Pretty much what I thought but thought I'd double check with the people who know.

I've never seen it either like that nor heard of it being on one of these models. I'll take the battery out and try putting it in the position he says is passive. If it is passive then it should work without the battery, right?

[sirmuppet]

[quote name='hiram.k.hackenbacker' timestamp='1478092096' post='3166660']
As our learned Music Man experts have mentioned, the only one I'm aware of that fits your description is the white Gilded PDN Stingray which has gold hardware and a push/pull nearest the jack.

I think you would almost certainly get some detailed answers to your questions by putting some decent photos of the bass and its guts in this thread.
[/quote]

Yup exactly what I was thinking when I had it in the shop only an hour ago. I took a couple of pics on my phone. Just going to get them on my machine and upload. Just a moment....

[sirmuppet]

Ok here you go. Can get better when I get home but this is what I have for the moment.

[URL=http://s444.photobucket.com/user/ferengo/media/Instruments/Z_Stuff/Sub-Misc_1/IMG_0377_zps7zxjczd2.jpg.html][IMG]http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq170/ferengo/Instruments/Z_Stuff/Sub-Misc_1/IMG_0377_zps7zxjczd2.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

[URL=http://s444.photobucket.com/user/ferengo/media/Instruments/Z_Stuff/Sub-Misc_1/IMG_0378_zpshhg7ho2l.jpg.html][IMG]http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq170/ferengo/Instruments/Z_Stuff/Sub-Misc_1/IMG_0378_zpshhg7ho2l.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

[ikay]

Hmm, no obvious signs of having been molested. Circuit diagram and wiring schematic below in case that's of any use.

[sirmuppet]

[quote name='ikay' timestamp='1478097279' post='3166726']
Hmm, no obvious signs of having been molested. Circuit diagram and wiring schematic below in case that's of any use.
[/quote]

Thanks man. I had a look online and it looks like the newer 2009 board according to the site I found, looked identical.

The tech I had the bass into said it wasn't behaving properly and agreed that the pots seemed to be fully on or off, no gradual increase etc... He could say more without test it properly but I was on t lunch and pressed for time.

[mcnach]

[quote name='sirmuppet' timestamp='1478043198' post='3166387']
Hi all.

Just got myself a 2009 Ernie Ball Musicman 4 string Stingray. It has the 2 band EQ. I'd only ever played the 3 band EQ previously and was surprised to find the the 2 band EQ is a treble and bass boost and doesn't have the cut function.

Any way my question is this, The basses preamp doesn't function like I believe it should (Boosting the treble and bass). The treble control does nothing until it's on about full, the bass one seems to go full on just after you start to turn it. I spoke to the seller who said it was original and that the bass one is actually an active passive mode even though it's a knob without any indent and the other knob is just a boost. Have EBMM ever come with this stock? I can't find anything to say this is so but it's what I'm being told by the seller.

Thanks for any help.
[/quote]

I think the treble is indeed cut/boost, it just does not have a centre detent. For the bass... I believe modern 2EQ cuts a bit and is mostly boost, but again no centre detent and the centre is not the 'flat' position anyway. In addition they are very interactive... They're very intuitive once you are used to them, and it's a great sounding preamp.

Now, treble not doing anything until full on?
That's not my experience at all: how old are the strings? That treble can get pretty ear-piercing, but if the strings are old it just may not be much of those frequencies to boost.

I have heard of an active/passive Stingray only once before, which was some special instrument for someone. I'm not aware they did that as production instruments, but I could be wrong. Hmmm. Have you opened it up? The board will show you if it's an original EBMM. At least then we'll know for sure: if it's not the original then who knows what the preamp is supposed to do.

[mcnach]

[quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1478048768' post='3166417']
The only version of the 2 band pre amp with active/passive function appeared on the gilded white PDN Stingray and also on some Guitar Centre basses (standard 2 band Stingrays) produced around the same time. One of the controls on those basses has a push/pull function to change from active to passive, becoming a passive tone control.
[/quote]

thanks for that!

[mcnach]

ok, catching up... sorry.
The preamp looks fine... but yeah, that behaviour is not normal. Hopefully your guy finds what the duff componentis and can replace it.
If not... I'd be thinking of a John East 3-band preamp (MMSR, 3 knob version). It's not the cheapest, but it's just brilliant. Unlike a stock 3-band stingray, with the mids control flat (centre detent) you'll have a 2EQ, pretty much (John modelled it based on his own '76 Stingray). The mids module actually has selectable mid frequency control, and it's fantastic.
I replaced the preamp on my 2002 2EQ Stingray with one of those, and I went from liking the bass to loving the bass
In addition, I asked him to make the volume knob a push/pull for active/passive. It only added the cost of the knob, really, as far as I remember. It's a good option to have if you're a little forgetful about batteries: it already saved me a few months ago when I discovered my battery had been on for well over 2 years and it's a bass I use a LOT... and it just died. I pulled the knob and carried on. Then replaced the battery during the break.

[stingrayPete1977]

I wonder if the phono jack is faulty/dirty or needs the tangs bending back which is stopping the preamp cutting in fully? Looks all standard so that is a good start.

[sirmuppet]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1478105470' post='3166802']
I wonder if the phono jack is faulty/dirty or needs the tangs bending back which is stopping the preamp cutting in fully? Looks all standard so that is a good start.
[/quote]

Am just about to email the seller back. He's been really good about getting back etc... He was 100% right that it is the stock preamp but it certainly doesn't work as it should and my tech confirmed that. I may ask him if it's ok to have it put in and checked/priced for repair, will mention what you said about the jack. He offered to replace the case which is cracked free of charge but I'd rather have the bass repaired than the case replaced. Will keep you all posted as to what happens. Thanks for all the advice so far

[stingrayPete1977]

Good luck

[4 Strings]

I notice on the diagrams the treble pot should be 1M Ohm and the bass 100k Ohm. It may be worth checking those installed have the correct value (can't quite see from the photos). Incorrect values would give the effect you describe. (I'd be surprised, though, as the board looks unmolested - unlikely that EB got the installation wrong)

If they are the correct values, a quick spray with contact cleaner may help.

[sirmuppet]

So an update to a point. I'm taking the bass in to get repaired/checked fully. The seller has said to do this and bill him, he says he'll give me the money back that it costs, but I'll get a cost before going ahead and will check with him. He also insists on providing a new case for the cracked one. So fair play to him, he's been great to deal with. I'll let you all know what the problem turns out to be.

[chickenjames]

my £0.02

I have a modern 2EQ 4 string like this, RW fboard, all black

Both controls are progressive. I always have the bass on full, and I vary the treble from all-off (mostly) to all-on (rarely).

I believe that it will run passive if you take the battery out, but I've never tried this.

Hope you get it sorted, that's a GREAT bass.

[stingrayPete1977]

I've never had one that runs passive.

[4 Strings]

[quote name='chickenjames' timestamp='1478648514' post='3170689']
my £0.02

I have a modern 2EQ 4 string like this, RW fboard, all black

Both controls are progressive. I always have the bass on full, and I vary the treble from all-off (mostly) to all-on (rarely).

I believe that it will run passive if you take the battery out, but I've never tried this.

Hope you get it sorted, that's a GREAT bass.
[/quote]

Exactly the same here (albeit Pre-EB)! No place for treble in the soul band, but the occasional bit of slap (I know, I know), up goes the treble to create a totally different sound. How I love Stingrays. Did the development of the bass guitar stop when they put a 3EQ on one?

Edited November 14, 2016 by 4 Strings

[drTStingray]

[quote name='4 Strings' timestamp='1479122585' post='3174043']

How I love Stingrays. Did the development of the bass guitar stop when they put a 3EQ on one?
[/quote]

Nope - they made the Bongo with 4EQ - seismic bass EQ as well!!