Help needed installing ACG/East preamp in Warwick Streamer

[Sneleoparden]

[b]Anyone with a Warwick Streamer Stage 1 with MEC´s and ACG/East preamp out there? Or someone who can help?[/b]

How did You install the preamp?

I just bought a used ACG/East EQ 02 preamp, which I want to install in my Warwick Streamer Stage 1 from 1992. It´s pretty easy to follow the instructions from ACG, but need help now, since I can´t get a sound out of the bass. There are som issues that I don´t know how to solve, and that might be the causes that there is no sound:

1. The MEC pickups are active, so they need power. What would you recommend me to do here? Do I need a special kind of wire to make it work? I did connect the red wires from the pickups to the red wire from the battery clip, then connecting these to the preamp, where the power has to go. But, no sound..

2. The Jack socket that somes with the ACG/East preamp does not fit in the hole where the original Warwick jack socket has been (this socket is longer than the ACG/East socket). Plus there are 4 wires on the ACG/East jack socket, but only 2 on the Warwick jack socket. I want to use the Warwick socket (maybe replacing it with a swithcraft), but what to do with the 4 wires, where do they go?

The manual for the installation is here: http://www.acguitars.co.uk/docs/eq02Manual2009.pdf

[LukeFRC]

I've stuck a ACG EQ-01 into a 1991 SS1... so should be able to help!.... hang on a mo

[LukeFRC]

Your warwick barrel jack and the ACG jack will (99%sure) be a stereo jack with 3 contact points.

The[b] tip[/b] is the signal from the preamp.
the [b]base[/b] is the ground - you might have thin wires in your warwick preamp going everywhere which is also the ground.
The [b]sleeve[/b] is the negative from your battery - when you plug it in it completes the circuit and turns it on. Unpluged it doesn't drain the battery.

Have a look at your ACG jack. Even if it's got 4 wires my bet is that two of them go to the same place on the jack.
The sleeve should be the black wire from your battery clip.

Now the one difference between your bass and mine is the active pickups, I've got passive barts on mine.
as you know your pickups need power... if you follow the instructions from ACG you've plugged the red power from the battery terminal into the preamp.
You need to have that power going to [b]both[/b] the pickups and preamp. The easiest way to do that is to put both the power wire from the pickups into the pickup.
You've said you've done this - so I think it will be the jack wiring that's the issue?

[LukeFRC]

...And make sure you've not the tip connector of the jack socket touching the edge of the cavity. That will lead to no sound.
... might be obvious but make sure you've got the thing turned up!

[Sneleoparden]

Thanks for your reply I did´nt use the warwick jack, because I could´nt figure out how it should be connected. So right now it´s the ACG jack that are connected, like it says in the manual. But of course I want to use the Warwick jack, since it fits the bass. I will take a look on the bass again when I come home. If i can´t make it work, I will post some pictures of how it looks.
Thanks

[BassBunny]

If the red wire from the pickups is indeed a "+ve" supply wire, sending it straight to the battery will mean the pickups are permanently connected and draining the battery all the time.
From memory I think it is the "-ve" supply to the pre-amp that is switched.

[Sneleoparden]

And still no sound... I soldered the ground wires from both the pickups and the bridge to the same point on the cavity. And put the power wires from the pickups directly into the preamp, where the power from the battery goes. The wire from the neck pickup was´nt long enough, so I made it longer with some leftover wire. I still have the ACG jack connected, I will use the Warwick barrel jack, when it works with the ACG.
Soo... what could the problem be? I think the problem might be the active pickups, because it needs power, and because there is only one wire for the sound from each pickup. As far as I remember there are always two wires from passive pickups. maybe I did it wrong. It is the two white wires you can see. There is one smaller wire inside, surrounded by insulation(?) metal. I put the wire from the middle into the hot input on the preamp, and soldered some extra wire to the metal that is around, leading this to the cold input. I saw a guy do it here http://www.finnbass.com/showthread.php?t=4030

But no sound...so what could the problem be?

[BassBunny]

I know The guy on Finnbass that did the work on the Spector but those are EMG's and it is pretty easy to get diagrams for them.
Can you identify which MEC pickups you have?
Did you make a note of where the wires wnet with the original pre-amp?

[GreeneKing]

Shame you are in Denmark as I've done a fair bit of this, in fact a whole lot. The jack wiring is the culprit quite often and getting your head around it's switching via the -ve side is important.

If struggling start from scratch and work out what is going on with the wiring.

[BassBunny]

[quote name='GreeneKing' timestamp='1481643685' post='3193964']
Shame you are in Denmark as I've done a fair bit of this, in fact a whole lot. The jack wiring is the culprit quite often and getting your head around it's switching via the -ve side is important.

If struggling start from scratch and work out what is going on with the wiring.
[/quote]
Problem is Peter that we don't seem to know how the pickups are powered.
EMG's are easy there is an additional Red +ve that is used to power them. The MEC's only seem to have a Hot and Ground and I am struggling to see how they are powered up unless there is something unique about the MEC pre-amp.

[GreeneKing]

[quote name='BassBunny' timestamp='1481644441' post='3193971']
Problem is Peter that we don't seem to know how the pickups are powered.
EMG's are easy there is an additional Red +ve that is used to power them. The MEC's only seem to have a Hot and Ground and I am struggling to see how they are powered up unless there is something unique about the MEC pre-amp.
[/quote]

I don't think that all MECs are active. Is it possible that they aren't active at all? In that case connecting them to the battery would be a major faux pau.

I believe that the active MECs appear to have two wires but the white wire has an inner core (+ve power to pickup) and the outer braided wire is a common ground. I suspect you know this though

Although if the OP has connected the red wine to 9v then it would be wrong as that is the pickup output hot wire. Inner white to 9v switched and braided wire ground, inner white is the pickup power not red. Thats as I remember it anyway.

Peter

Edited December 13, 2016 by GreeneKing

[BassBunny]

[quote name='GreeneKing' timestamp='1481646826' post='3194009']
I don't think that all MECs are active. Is it possible that they aren't active at all? In that case connecting them to the battery would be a major faux pau.

I believe that the active MECs appear to have two wires but the white wire has an inner core (+ve power to pickup) and the outer braided wire is a common ground. I suspect you know this though

Although if the OP has connected the red wine to 9v then it would be wrong as that is the pickup output hot wire. Inner white to 9v switched and braided wire ground, inner white is the pickup power not red. Thats as I remember it anyway.
Peter
[/quote]
My thoughts exactly Peter. Not convinced these are actually active MEC's in which case they could be fried.

Edited December 13, 2016 by BassBunny

[Sneleoparden]

Thanks for your responses. How it was before: The red wires from the pickups where connected with a red wire from the battery and red wire from the preamp. They were soldered together at.Thats why I believe them to be active, and the red wires to be power. the white wires from the pickups was soldered to one of the pots. From this point, two smaller white wires went to two different connectors/pins (?) on the same pot, and a non-insulated wire went to two other pots (this I believe is ground).

[GreeneKing]

[quote name='Sneleoparden' timestamp='1481796798' post='3195161']
Thanks for your responses. How it was before: The red wires from the pickups where connected with a red wire from the battery and red wire from the preamp. They were soldered together at.Thats why I believe them to be active, and the red wires to be power. the white wires from the pickups was soldered to one of the pots. From this point, two smaller white wires went to two different connectors/pins (?) on the same pot, and a non-insulated wire went to two other pots (this I believe is ground).
[/quote]

The white wires from the pickups - you do mean two from each pickup? i.e. the core and the braided outer? I think you are correct. My apologies re above, the red is the power. Re connection to the East preamp the core white is hot and the braided outer goes into the screw -ve connector. I do have the East pre in my Thumb and it you are still unsure I can retrieve it from my loft and open it up.

It should be pretty much the same as your bass.

Peter

[Sneleoparden]

From each of the MEC pickups there is one white wire, which have a smaller wire in the middle, and braided around it. And a red wire. From the pickup springs there is a wire, which must be ground. There is a similar wire coming from the bridge. so 3 in all. I had some copper shield-tape, which I shielded the cavity with. I soldered the 3 ground wires from the pickups and bridge AND the black wire from the jack, in one point on the shielded cavity.

I tried something different, thinking that it might be something with the batterypowered pickups that are causing the no sound. I installed a noname passive precision pickup, removing the MEC p-pickup first of course. But..... no sound! so now what could the problem be? The bridge pickup is not wired to the preamp now. the ground wires, including the wire from the jack are still connected to the cavity. The battery has power. Could it be a grounding problem? or maybe it´s the preamp that does not work...

Sorry about all my questions, if I had the money I would go to a guitartech, but soo it´s expensive...

[GreeneKing]

On the East pre there are 2 screw connectors for each pickup. They should be connected to the inner core of the white AND the braided wire. Don't connect the braided straight to earth/ground. You need a circuit connecting to the pre amp from each pickup.

This may be your problem.

See top of page 2 pickup inputs, 4 in number

[url="http://www.east-uk.com/pdf/uni-pre.pdf"]http://www.east-uk.com/pdf/uni-pre.pdf[/url]

and also bottom of page 5.

If you connect the braided wire direct to ground it won't work.

Peter

Edited December 15, 2016 by GreeneKing

[GreeneKing]

I'm quite happy to work through the wiring on my Thumb and take some photo's.

[Sneleoparden]

Thank you, I will try to figure out how to upload photos during next week, so I can show how it looks now.

[GreeneKing]

[quote name='Sneleoparden' timestamp='1482057412' post='3197200']
Thank you, I will try to figure out how to upload photos during next week, so I can show how it looks now.
[/quote]

From memory, I took each white pickup wire and made two separate pre soldered tails on each. These tails went into the pre-amps inputs screw connectors with the inner core +ve and the outer braiding -ve.

The red pickup wires went to the battery +ve along with the (red?) preamp supply. I had to use the Warwick barrel jack to replace the supplied one. The pre-amp output that I suspect from John's other pre's is usually orange goes to the jack tip connection. The other two connections are basically used as a switch when the jack is inserted and are the cavity/preamp ground onto one and the battery -ve terminal on the other. I don't think it matters which is on which.

I've actually just sold my Thumb and it's packed for the courier so I can't access it. I'd like to help you sort this if it's at all possible so photo's will help.

I hope it's not your only bass.

Peter

[MoonBassAlpha]

It's worth asking at this stage, with the guitar connected to an amp and the preamp powered, do you get a buzz through the preamp when you touch the metal bits of the pickup connector? This will show that at least the actual circuit is wired right and doing something.
Verify one part of the circuit at a time.

[GreeneKing]

Here's a photo of what I suspect your MEC hot and cold pickup connections look like:



You need to solder a wire onto the braided outer to make the two wires to connect into the East pre (I've insulated the solder connection):




I fitted a Uni pre into my MEC equipped GMR yesterday. The pickups in my bass are passive but the white hot/cold wires are the same The braided wires don't go to ground they are the cold pickup connection:

It worked straight up:

[Sneleoparden]

Hi all, and thank you so much for helping me. Right after christmas i was offered a job in Norway, beginning in 21 january, so I was busy arranging things before going. I did´nt bring my bass, but I will continue trying to get the preamp installed correctly, when I get back in a couple of months.

Henrik