Being fired from a band?

[AutomaticWriting]

Okay so recently I've been playing for an artist who shall remain anonymous. But the basics are that I have been producing their studio work and then putting together a live arrangement for them as well as playing bass. I have worked night and day, tirelessly for this artist and putting off all of my own university work to help them out. It was all going well playing live in a few university things and the band were feeling really good. We then got the opportunity to play at a very large venue (which again shall remain anonymous but it's a chain of venues in every major city, you can probably figure it out). Unfortunately due to commitments made over 6 months ago I couldn't play at this event (it was only one song). So they hired in a stand in guy. I had a meeting with the singer to talk about moving forward as well new plans for the future and I was told that the singer wants to replace me with the stand in guy. The reason? It felt good playing live with him and he played a couple of your parts differently. I should add at this point that this is the first real live outing of the band and we've only played to various lecturers beforehand, so I haven't even had a chance to show what I can do at a real gig.
My defence being that due to the deadlines of these assessments coming so rapidly to play in front of lecturers that I didn't have a lot of time to work on bass parts due to having to also produce the track, so I largely kept it the same as the synth bass parts played on the studio version as to not confuse the band. We had around 4 assessments and auditions in like 2 weeks and I also had to produce all of the other instrumentation as well as mixing the track. I feel like I have been unfairly treated here as whenever people heard us play I always got compliments and I don't feel like I've put a foot wrong. The opportunity to play at the "large venue" wouldn't have even happened if I didn't work night and day over a weekend to take a demo that consisted of solely a few chords and some rough vocals into a fully completed demo quality pop song with completely re recorded parts and new production.
I feel like I have been stabbed in the back a bit here. I have been offered to keep playing live with the artist doing "other things". Should I quit all together and not do the production anymore either? Or should I stay?
Sorry if any of this is incoherent or my grammar is poor. I think you guys will understand when somethings got you worked up that it's hard to type properly haha.
Cheers.

[Geek99]

I think he has been honest but brutal, and it sounds liked you deserved better than brutal, I would put it down to experience and move on

[MacDaddy]

keep your dignity and quit altogether.

[cheddatom]

If he was reasonable he'd give you a shot to show what you can do. He owes it to you for all the work you've put it. It sounds like he hasn't offered this, so IMO I'd f*** him off unless you think you stand to make money/reputation from the production side of things

[GreeneKing]

I feel for you. It will be hard but you have to move onwards and upwards.

[RockfordStone]

[quote name='MacDaddy' timestamp='1481730641' post='3194630']
keep your dignity and quit altogether.
[/quote]
This, it's hard but if he has a better feel with someone else and he is the artist the project is built around, if he wants to replace you it's his prerogative.

If he feels that way, you are on to a losing battle if you stick around, so i would formally hand my notice in along with an invoice for the time spent producing, re-recording and turning his chords and vocal into a fully formed pop song.

Edited December 14, 2016 by RockfordStone

[Low End Bee]

Clean break and move on. It's not nice but that's the way it goes. If it wasn't this instance you've outlined it'd be something else further down the line.

[stingrayPete1977]

Yep, bye.

[thebassist]

Yes I'd move on too.

[dmccombe7]

Poor show but take the positives from it. You've gained a lot of production and rceording experience from using them.
I would try to accept what has happened and just move on to the next project.
There's always something new on the horizon.

Dave

[moooper]

Sorry to hear this I know probably feel like crap at the moment. This is how the business can be sometimes, the harder you work the more you get crapped on. I'd honestly really try to learn loads from this. I can't possible tell you everything that you should learn from it of course but it will be a very valuable lesson that will make you grow into a better musician.

[geoffbyrne]

Sounds like they need you more than you need them.

G.

[Grangur]

Do you feel like you want to hang around and just do the production stuff, or do you want to play bass?

It sounds to me like you may have been so busy on the production that you, possibly, didn't have the time to work on your thinking through your own bass part. Then, in walks some other guy. He's had no production stuff to do. He's only been thinking of the bass parts and how he can enhance it and show his metal... and they're smitten with the creativity.

If it were me I'd drop them. Besides, if they'll drop you that easy, how long before they find yet another bass player and spit the next one out? Keep your dignity, enjoy the experience you got and move on I say.

[Marc S]

So sorry to hear of your bad experiences matey. Does the singer realise the amount of work you've put in?
Do others in the band realise the hard work and hours you've put in? Do they have a copy of your fully mixed recordings?
If not, then maybe they need to be told - it's amazing how some people can miss how others have helped promote a so-called "joint project"
If they don't have the unmixed recordings or even the mixed versions - then perhaps they will miss these when / if you leave

As others have said though, if they are going to continue giving you less than fair consideration - then I would maintain your dignity and leave. And as others have also pointed out - there's always something else around the corner

It is indeed hard to type or even think really coherently when you are annoyed at others. But whatever you do, don't bottle it up and carry on if you feel you're being taken for a ride. That way, you'll be the only one to suffer. Take a deep breath, go and do something completely different & relax before you take the next step. But if this were me, I'd need to have a "chat" with the singer, and perhaps with other band members first too

Best of luck with it, and let us know how you get on

Edited December 14, 2016 by Marc S

[JellyKnees]

I would take some consolation in the fact that at least he was honest with you.

Last band I was in, myself and the singer/pianist got binned off after 6 month of rehearsals/song development by the drummer and guitarist. Their method of doing this was for the drummer to announce out of the blue on our Facebook group that he didn't want to carry on with the band anymore as he had another project he wished to pursue. We subsequently found out that him and the guitarist were now working with a different bassist and were advertising on joinmyband, using virtually the same ad that the drummer had original placed when he started the band. I was majorly pissed off, more for their lack of honesty and integrity than anything else. But I'm sure karma will have a way of biting them back.

Personally, I'd chalk it down to experience and move on. In the immortal words of Les McQueen, it's a sh*t business...

[Rocker]

Don't neglect your studies. Music is a business as well as a hobby. You learned from the experience so let it go and as several others have said, move on. The world is round, you may get an opportunity to work with this guy/band again so act gracefully even if you feel otherwise. But don't neglect your studies. And keep on playing....

[Monkey Steve]

what does your gut tell you? Are you happy being left to the production role, and perhaps importantly, are you likely to get paid for doing it, or will you be told at some future point in time "sorry, we've got a producer in and your services are no longer required"

While it sucks, I do wonder about the other side of this. A mate's band are going through a very similar thing at the moment - they have a band member who simply isn't what they want/isn't up to it (they're right, he isn't) and they've told him that he can stick around for live work but won't be on the album. It's definitely the right decision for the band, but there's no way to soften the blow and he feels like he's just been kicked in the balls after a year of work and some decent live reviews. And he's now got a similar decision to make - does he keep his pride intact and quit completely, or carry on under a cloud?

[chris_b]

A band leader told me once, "You can always find someone better. The trick is knowing when to stop looking."

What can I say? Welcome to the real world!

The next band will be better.

[Grangur]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1481734778' post='3194700']
A band leader told me once, "You can always find someone better. The trick is knowing when to stop looking."

What can I say? Welcome to the real world!

The next band will be better.
[/quote]

When John Lennon was asked if he considered Ringo the best drummer in the world. His response was "He's not even the best drummer in the Beatles!"

But they still kept him.

[Rich]

Definitely time to move on. Politely decline the artist's offer of doing 'other things' and wish them luck with the new bassist/arranger/producer... I assume the new guy is doing all three jobs, like you were?

[Paul S]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1481735095' post='3194707']
When John Lennon was asked if he considered Ringo the best drummer in the world. His response was "He's not even the best drummer in the Beatles!"

But they still kept him.
[/quote]

He didn't, as it happens - that is an urban myth.

[AutomaticWriting]

Thank you so much guys, you are all legends!
I need to hear some of these responses. I feel like I should make my point to them again, when I was told in person I discussed it for a little while and then left (I genuinely had things to do as well as being angry). I don't really have an ego and in no way would I say that I'm an amazing bass player but I'm not bad or anything, I know that if given a chance I would be up to it. This isn't the first time I've considered them ungrateful, I got complained at and ranted at for not having a demo ready by a certain day despite the singer knowing It was exam week and that I had a lot of university work to catch up on because of putting it off to work on their tracks. I should add to all of this that I have done all the production, playing bass, playing keyboards and helping them with marketing for free because we were friends and it was in both of our best interests to gain experience from it. I feel if I continue in the production role that I should now start charging or just quit all together like some of you have suggested. I will copyright my recordings before doing this which would mean that they can't use any of my production work or ideas without my blessing. I'm just a bit stuck because I'm pretty new on the scene and would like to get into MD'ing and being the "backing guy" who plays a variety of instruments onstage, so I kind of need the name on my portfolio but at the same time I know I'd dislike myself for allowing myself to be walked all over...
Again thank you so much people, you've made me feel a lot better about it!

[anzoid]

Personally, I'd have a think about what the agreements were that had been made as to the production work so that the artist doesn't just get to walk off with all your hard work. Did you have anything written down? Are you the equivalent of "work for hire" - i.e. you get paid and they get the work, nothing else? Are you a creative partner with some/any rights in the work?
I think quit and move on is the right advice, being replaced as the bassist sucks, but don't get walked over with regards to the production work in the whole "leaving the band" process.

[anzoid]

AutomaticWriting - my post arrived at just about the same time as yours (at least it wasn't there when I started writing mine ). In regards to your comment "I will copyright my recordings...". They are already copyrighted, the question is how the rights in the work are apportioned - writer, person who owns the recording, etc. You might might not be totally home and clear on total ownership but would, I think, own the copyright in the particular recording - as you say, meaning they can't use it without your permission. (I'm not a lawyer and don't play one on the internet but have done a lot of reading on copyright... if you feel the need to totally protect your rights, talk to a real IP/Copyright lawyer - the Uni might even have one or two kicking around who'd help, might as well start early in the business getting to know how to cover yourself legally.)
And on a different note - singer doesn't sound like a friend, friends don't rant at friends doing them a favour. You definitely got some experience though...

Edited December 14, 2016 by anzoid

[Grangur]

[quote name='anzoid' timestamp='1481737517' post='3194736']
Personally, I'd have a think about what the agreements were that had been made as to the production work so that the artist doesn't just get to walk off with all your hard work. Did you have anything written down? Are you the equivalent of "work for hire" - i.e. you get paid and they get the work, nothing else? Are you a creative partner with some/any rights in the work?
I think quit and move on is the right advice, being replaced as the bassist sucks, but don't get walked over with regards to the production work in the whole "leaving the band" process.
[/quote]
This ^

With that lot you're always going to be walking a tight-rope and begging to keep the gig going. They don't appreciate you or give you your full value. You're better than that. You can do better.