Trace Elliot Twin Valve impressions

[malpasso]

Hi!
I have the chance to get this head Elliot Twin Valve. My aim is a portable all-valve head that can get me the so much sought after 3d, tubey, note weight tone. Will play through a couple of front ported, tweeter defeatable Gallien Krueger cx210 cabs tha sound fantastic out of my current Tecamp Puma500 class d head, which I will keep anyhow.
Band environment is a two guitar and drummer band at moderate volumes. Assorted music styles 90%, finger 1977 Jazz Bass, P.Bass with faltwounds (Sire v7/Stingray when i go active) and also fretless on rare occasions. so it should be versatile.
I'm addressing former or current users of this head and would be most grateful if they should share their views.
Thank you!!!

[VTypeV4]

I had the 15" combo version - it was truly awesome albeit somewhat arkward to move..

I only sold it as I managed to get my Trace V4 back but if that hadn't have happened then I'd still have it. Don't be put off by the ~100w rating as I'm sure through those 2x10s you'll blow the windows out! Mine could find the limits of it's internal speaker although it was way too loud in any normal situation by then..

Probably the second best Trace I've owned - and I've owned lot's of 'em! - only trumped by my V4

[Roland Rock]

It's a good head which is loud and flexible. IMO it is better at clean than dirty (I wasn't fond of the overdriven tone). I had a bit of trouble getting clarity at volume when I cut the treble/boosted the bass so moved it on. Overall though, it's a quality head and useful for quite a few applications.

Edited December 20, 2016 by Roland Rock

[molan]

[quote name='VTypeV4' timestamp='1482259585' post='3199041']
I had the 15" combo version - it was truly awesome albeit somewhat arkward to move..

I only sold it as I managed to get my Trace V4 back but if that hadn't have happened then I'd still have it. Don't be put off by the ~100w rating as I'm sure through those 2x10s you'll blow the windows out! Mine could find the limits of it's internal speaker although it was way too loud in any normal situation by then..

Probably the second best Trace I've owned - and I've owned lot's of 'em! - only trumped by my V4
[/quote]

I had one of these. My main gigging amp for a while but then moved on to an SWR SM400 which I absolutely loved. Still one of my favourite ever amps.

I like the Twin Valve but struggled to get a tone from it that I really liked. Bit of a pig to move around - I fitted some castors but it wasn't an ideal shape / balance and always felt like it was about to topple over, lol

[malpasso]

Thank you, guys!
It's the head alone what i could get, not the combo; so no lugging around issues for me, I expect. As for the sound, there was a time when i'd swear for an SWR tone...but I am on the opposite corner now, seeking tubey thickness, bloom, air-moving feel...without much overdrive, just a bit of hair when pushing. Think I'll pull the trigger on this one!!!

[VTypeV4]

http://basschat.co.uk/topic/264557-trace-elliot-twin-valve-combo/page__p__2805840__hl__trace%20elliot%20twin%20valve__fromsearch__1#entry2805840

You might this of use, I wrote it a while back but I think it's a fair and balanced view. For what it's worth, I'd have another.

[malpasso]

[quote name='VTypeV4' timestamp='1482259585' post='3199041']
...
Probably the second best Trace I've owned - and I've owned lot's of 'em! - only trumped by my V4
[/quote]

Ahhh! When a man loves an amp!!!! (LOL)

[malpasso]

[quote name='VTypeV4' timestamp='1434986028' post='2804429']
Overview:

Part of Trace Elliots' late '80e early '90s series six range of Valve bass guitar amplifiers. This is the baby one which came in two versions, a head and a 1x15" combo with the GP7 pre-amp. Twin valve refers to it's dual 6550 output valves which make an apparent 115w RMS whilst the larger models in the range were Quattra and Hexa Valve sport 4 tubes (220w) and 6 (300w+) respectively. These larger models (available as head only) also feature the larger and heavier featured GP12 pre-amp. All are easilly identified from the SS models by having a brushed look panels and black writing opposed to the usual grey / bright green livery.

Features:

Front:

The pre-amp is almost the same as the Series 6 GP7 version wit the omission of a balanced XLR direct out although I have seen some with this included. From left to right we have an input gain and overload indicator, separate jack inputs for both active and passive guitars and the classic Trace 'pre-shape' EQ button. Towards the middle is a switch in/out for the graphic EQ and the EQ itself which looks to have a longer fader travel than current models. Further over still is an array of jack sockets, the first pair are the FX loop send / return, the second pair are Line in / out and lastly a head-phone socket. The final controls are the master volume and standby switch on the far right of the panel. The only other thing on the front are the power / standby indicators although they're labelled as 'Pre-amp' and 'Power amp'.

Rear:

A rocker switch chooses between 4 and 8 ohm total load with two outputs. One is XLR (they loved this didn't they?) and the other jack although the jack is used for the internal 8 ohm speaker. Lastly there's an on / off switch and two fuse sockets for the mains and HT supplies.

All in all, it's quite simple for a Trace (have a look at a fully fledged GP12SMX or 600SMX if you want lots of options) but for me it's a case of 'set and forget' and adjust the master volume to suit.

Sound Quality:

It was love at first plonk! I borrowed it from a friend who was looking to sell but from that first note, it was gonna be mine before we'd even discussed monies. Oh dear.. Considering it's simply a single fifteen inch Celestion in a slightly compromised enclosure, it sounds superb offering an adequate low end and goes surprisingly high too. I say the enclosure is compromised as running the maths against the spec of the driver suggests it would be prefer a slightly larger box and lower tuning however on the face of it, it goes plenty low for me.

The flexibility of the pre-amp allows for many different sounds to be coaxed from it as the chap I bought from uses a P-style bass with flats whereas I'm on round wounds and like plenty of ping. Short of a dub-reggae thud, it'll do it without drama. It responds best with the Warwick although it sounds sweet with the Jazz bass too.

Lastly the valve pre and power stages add that lovely bit of warmth and squash to the otherwise tight Trace sound. Having previously owned a number of SS Trace combos and a V-Type 4808, this trumps them all including being able to play louder without complaint. Given it's ~100w rating, it's very capable and will stand up to gigging without drama. I have never needed it flat out to keep up. The amplifier wiill distort and break-up with a bit of soft valve grind when played loudly however, this too finds the limit of the speaker which isn't particularly nice. Through my old Ashton 410 though, it was a monster. It's drive sounds very similar to my Trace V-Type V4 when pinned. Just for giggles of course, I like the clean but compressed valve type sounds mostly.

Build quality and reliability:

This example was built in 1990 so at the time of writing (June 2015), it's 25 years old. I have had it since '12 / '13 and never had and ounce of bother with it. Just before I had the unit, it had been serviced with some some new caps and a full set of PM brand ECC83 / 6550 valves.

I don't think it's had a particularly hard life having still got it's orginal vinyl cover but the upholstery and finish are excellent and still in great condition. Inside the amp chassis the standards are maintained with thick PCBs, tidy wiring and decent sized transformers. Pictures inside and out can be found here:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/26162-trace-elliot-porn-thread/page__st__300"]http://basschat.co.u...d/page__st__300[/url]

Bad bits:

I don't really have much bad to say about it to be fair. It weighs a tonne (or more realistically about 35Kg) but it's a valve combo, if it was light, i'd be worried! The side handles aren't great and bite into your hands a little, the recessed types on the larger cabs would have been better but at least they wern't so daft as to put a central strap handle on top of the thing. The only other real compromise is the speaker / enclsore. For me it goes low enough without complaint but running the maths, (if I remember correctly) it starts to roll off around 75Hz with a little hump in the 100Hz area which can be heard. I think it's simply the compromise of such a small enclosure.

Conclusion:

It's old and a bit heavy but with the exception of my V4, it's the best sounding Trace Elliot I've owned. And of course, being a Trace, it's not going to be everyones tastes but it's well worth a look as it's a variation on that traditional sound. It's been totally reliable and I intend to keep it around for a good while yet!
[/quote]

Great review, VtypeV4!! I did not see it when I waded through posts looking for info! Thanx for sure!!!

Edited December 20, 2016 by malpasso

[VTypeV4]

I always wanted a V6 or V8 but when that V4 came up as NOS in box.. The rest is history!

[VTypeV4]

All good man!

[disssa]

The TwinValve is one of my favorite amps. I wrote something about that amp [url="https://www.disssa.de/reviews/amps/trace-elliot-twin-valve/"]here[/url]. I love that round, warm and fat tone.

[KF2B]

Hello.

I have one. If I had to sell off my gear the last amp that would leave the house would be the Twin Valve.
It is stupidly good and not only that, but a pretty unique too for a myriad of reasons (size, ss pre/tube power stage etc.).

The way I see it is that it does not only excel in the actual use it was made for, but also has a - dare I say - flair of Industrial Art within it. It is good and it is unique. Get it and do not sell it.

[malpasso]

Thanks a lot, everyone!
I have decided to give it a go!!!

[VTypeV4]

Post some pictures when it arrives..

[malpasso]

I will...it might need retubing. Has anyone run kt88s on his?

[VTypeV4]

Never tried '88s in my T/V but you shouldn't have issue as the type differences between those and 6550 aren't that distinct these days. I run EHX KT88s in the V4 currently but I've had all sorts in there - my second favourites were a quad of the re-issue Tung Sol 6550s.. If you do, it might be worth having the bias checked although if memory serves, these are fixed (like an old boogie or Hiwatt) bias anyways. Mine had never been modded and ran happily with the PM branded 6550s..

[andytoad]

[quote name='VTypeV4' timestamp='1482785421' post='3202759']
Never tried '88s in my T/V but you shouldn't have issue as the type differences between those and 6550 aren't that distinct these days. I run EHX KT88s in the V4 currently but I've had all sorts in there - my second favourites were a quad of the re-issue Tung Sol 6550s.. If you do, it might be worth having the bias checked although if memory serves, these are fixed (like an old boogie or Hiwatt) bias anyways. Mine had never been modded and ran happily with the PM branded 6550s..
[/quote]

Does this mean I can 'plug and play' new valves in my hexa? Oddly, the previous owner removed two of the valves as it was too loud for him. I have them, but didn't want to put them back in unless it was modded in some way.

[VTypeV4]

[quote name='andytoad' timestamp='1482787061' post='3202768']
Does this mean I can 'plug and play' new valves in my hexa? Oddly, the previous owner removed two of the valves as it was too loud for him. I have them, but didn't want to put them back in unless it was modded in some way.
[/quote]

I think Quattra / Hexa models did have an adjustable bias but they're best setup on a scope for best performance if you're changing all the valves. If you're just putting back in what should be there - ie going back to six tubes, then unless the amp has been modded for four, you should be fine.

It's the old trick from years ago to make the amp distort at a lower volume typically used on Marshall and Fender amps that used four output tubes - pull two out and makes half the power - but does create an impedance mis-match at the output transformer unless you use the 'wrong' taps ie 8 ohm load / 16 ohm tap (or the other way round, I can't remember). It's less than ideal on the Trace as it's not a half / double match due to it having six valves so it's a 3rd / two-thirds mismatch. I expect your amp will sound sweeter back on all six as it's what it's output transformer was designed to operate with. It'll probably play louder and cleaner too..

[andytoad]

I'd better take it to a pro, aside from shoving the last two in, I don't really know what I'm doing!

[malpasso]

Thanks, folks!
ETA for my Twin Valve is Jna, 3rd !!!

[Shaggy]

I had one for a couple of years - main memories of it are:
For: great clean tone, probably the nicest for my fretless I've ever had: hi-fi clear yet warm and organic. Very portable, very cool looks.
Against: ultimately underpowered for my needs (why I moved it on), and preamp out is unbalanced line out only rather than balanced DI (which I think the higher rated models do have)

Great amp,and must be pretty rare now - you won't be disappointed

[andytoad]

[quote name='malpasso' timestamp='1483099217' post='3204682']
Thanks, folks!
ETA for my Twin Valve is Jna, 3rd !!!
[/quote]

Let us know what you think...

[malpasso]

My Twin Valve head arrived the morning of Dec the 51st, that was three days in advance.

Cosmetic state is alright. just a bit grimey, but nothing that could not be sorted out with a slightly damp cloth and some elbow grease. No bumps or dents, just the expected swirls from age and normal use, not even scratches. I already knew from the seller pics that two of the EQ slider tips and caps were missing, but I have already ordered 4 new sliders from an american website (funny, isn't it) called [url="http://www.britishaudioservice.com/product-page/3246761641"]http://www.britishau...page/3246761641[/url]

I also ordered some Series Six knobs for the sliders, but they are white, not black like the originals. I may get some black Strat pickup selector plastic tips to keep it in accordance with the original aesthetics, but that is a minor point I will see to later on.
The head wighs 13 Kilos. This is one Kilo less than my former Ashdown ABM 500 EVOII, which is perfectly alright for an all-valve head. Bear in mind that the lightest all-tube head I know of is the Mesa Boogie Prodigy Bass Four 88, that comes at 13 Kilos in a lunchbox format and pumps 250 Watts, but an Ampeg V4b that is powered at 100 Watts and weighs over 18 Kgrs.
The Twin Valveis built like a rhino. it is easily carried by two sturdy sleel handles that feel steady and reliable. I will shortly have an enclosed cover made by Hotcoves, in the UK.
here are some pcs from the seller. ill post better ones when I take my camera along sometime:

[b]Fancy an expresso? He he!![/b]
[url="https://flic.kr/p/PLwVGU"][/url]

[url="https://flic.kr/p/PPi9k8"][/url]

One of the extras this unit brings about is a switchable fan . The switch is placed at the back of the head. On wading through forums about the Twin Valve, I read that it gets hot from use, so I found this was really handy as the heat issue proved to be true. Trouble is that it is fairly noisy. I am not picky in this respect, but I might replace it in the near future with some of the modern and more silent computer fans existinting now.

Now, the sound. I only had the chance to test is alone at the rehearsal room. My heart sort of faltered when I switched from standby to on and I heard no sound but the fan's. Breath returned when I gradually started getting sound after a few seconds.
I tuned the EQ section on the GP7 graphic the following way: Flat at 50 Hrzs, a slight boost at 100 and 230 Hrzs, flat again at 500, +3 decibels at 1 and 2 Khrzs and flat at the top high frequency and started to play on my Sire V7 with the master pot at 1.
The sound is clean but thick, pushy, warm and authoritive. Using the passive imput, I could get clean headroom as far as 9 (will use 0 to10 scale for pot positions), then it started breaking up in a velvety way, but do not expect hairy overdriven sounds form it.
As I started turning up the master windows and drums started to rattle at 3. I do have to say that this thing is loud!
Could not turn it past 5,5. Still that can be misleadin when playing alone, and I will have to check out power and volume when the rest of the band is present.
The tone from this head seems to be exactly what I was seeking. Creamy, air-moving clarity; definition with warmth. Switching patches from SVT to slap on my Zoom B3 made my bass keep the pace in both situtions without sweating at all. I got the thump and weight note in the first case (quick enough in fast, tight notes passages), and the snap without harshness in the second (highs never got shrill). I have the impression that sound tends to be a bit scooped for some tastes, but I get as many mids as I want from tweaking the basses preamp or the B3's EQ. It' was just the versatitlity I was pursuing
All in all I could expect no more from a first contact, and I can't wait to test the head in a band context.
Hope this helps!

Edited January 8, 2017 by malpasso

[VTypeV4]

Nice one, fella!

[malpasso]

[quote name='VTypeV4' timestamp='1483964887' post='3211416']
Nice one, fella!
[/quote]
Thanx, V!!!